Anti-Gay Australian MP: People Are Lying To Pollsters About Their Marriage Vote Due To Political Correctness

The Guardian reports:

Cory Bernardi does not accept there will be an overwhelming “yes” vote in the same-sex marriage postal survey, with more than 70% of forms returned.

The Australian Conservatives leader said he believed people were pressured by political correctness and were saying they voted “yes”, even if they had voted “no”.

“I’m not even conceding defeat quite frankly,” Bernardi told Sky News on Sunday. “I think there are a great many people who are deeply concerned about the potential consequences of changing the marriage act.”

Several weeks ago Bernadi complained about an “intrusive” text message campaign from the Yes side just before he launched a robocall campaign to one million Australian homes.

The survey closes on November 7th and it’s been recommended that voters mail their forms by this Friday. Last week the leader of the anti-gay side said they would not accept the results if Yes wins, vowing to fight the likely vote that would follow in the Parliament.

  • misterjack

    Dead horse.

  • Elsewhere1010

    Right wing pol makes things up that he cannot prove because they aren’t true.

    • Ross

      Well, that IS what right-wing pols do.

      It’s all they know.

      • billbear1961

        Because LYING is the only way they can ever win a goddamned argument.

        • NZArtist

          Reality has a liberal bias.

          • Ross

            Reality = liberal.

  • CottonBlimp

    Last week the leader of the anti-gay side said they would not accept the results if Yes wins, vowing to fight the likely vote that would follow in the Parliament.

    Of course they won’t. This whole vote wasted all that money and played politics with people’s lives all for nothing.

    • Lazycrockett

      Yeah it does seem like a really stupid waste of time and energy, when nothing is changed by the result.

    • SoCalGal20

      Typical. Always moving the goalposts when they don’t get their way.

    • Randy503

      I hope people will hear that and vote yes out of spite just to prove this whole thing was a farce, and the people were being used.
      You know damn well that if the vote were no, he would call it binding and say that’s the end of it.

    • LaChatSayWha

      Yep. When they wrote all the rules & got all things their way, they looked smug and told us to respect the law and be patient for change. But once we achieved success legally, they started ignoring the laws & doing whatever the fuck they wanted.

  • SoCalGal20

    Wow this is shit worthy of the GOP douchebags in the U.S.

    • Ross

      Douchebags are never confined by national borders.

      They are everywhere, everywhere, everywhere.

      Sigh.

      • billbear1961

        Yes, but among the advanced democracies, they have more power in the States than anywhere else, mainly because the American “news” media refuse to do their goddamned JOBS!!

        They and the Democrats never challenge the right’s media LIE machine, and the “serious” press engage all the time in false equivalencies, and refuse to aggressively and relentlessly call out baldfaced liars (for fear of being labelled “biased” by the fucking LIARS–biased for defending the TRUTH, which is their JOB!!) and to defend genuine democracy from irrational and hateful extremism, preferring, instead, to treat LIES and national PILLAGE and blatant FASCISM as “controversial” in order to perpetuate their deplorable media CIRCUS, to milk it of all the profit they can squeeze out of it, to HELL with what’s good for the country!!

        HUNDREDS are mowed down by a gun-wielding maniac in Las Vegas, and journalists–JOURNALISTS!!–entertain the possibility that “now’s not the time to talk about responsible gun-control laws–it would be politicizing a tragedy”!! Funding for CHIP has expired–the lives of CHILDREN are at risk–and Americans STILL aren’t in the streets PROTESTING!!

        Mow Americans down with automatic gunfire–children, too–let kids go without the healthcare they need–let them DIE–rescind rules to protect the rights of disabled children–and the STREETS remain QUIET!!

    • NZArtist

      Australia == Little America.

      • Bluto

        From a Kiwi that’s extra Aussie burn. Well done, Sir.

  • Ross

    “I think there are a great many people who are deeply concerned about the potential consequences of changing the marriage act.”

    Cory, dear?

    You know, a great many countries HAVE allowed marriage equality. And in not a single instance has the sky fallen. There have been no dire consequences.

    So, Cory, dear?

    FUCK OFF YOU IGNORANT ASS.

    Thank you.

    • aagold76 .

      well- there was one country with dire consequences- it could be that it was part of the reason Trump won- social backlash

      • Ross

        Did Trump win?

        Or did Russia steal votes for him?

        My money is on the latter.

        (But I understand your point!)

      • Strepsi

        That’s because you’ve allowed too many citizens to believe in “States Rights” without understanding what a country is or does.

      • barryearle

        Trump didn’t win the election. Hilary won that by 3 million votes. Trump won the Electoral College game. More reason to get more states to pass a law that says the winner of the popular votes also wins all the Electoral College votes. Granted, we might not like the popular winner either but at least a majority voted for that person. Trump won a minority vote.

      • No More GOP.

        No. The putative election of Trump was not a reaction to LGBT folk getting married. It’s a bit more complicated than that.

    • Strepsi

      I read the article looking for an example, and the one he gave was youth requesting euthanasia in the Netherlands! Motherfucker’s just chucking all his religious bugaboos together!

      • FAEN

        Seriously? That BS AGAIN?

      • Prost Seattle

        There are an awful lot of people in Asia. We may need a pause on the whole youth in Asia concept.

        *whisperwhisperwhisperslapwhisper*

        Oh…never mind.

        • Karen

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    • OdieDenCO

      PS: dear cory, russia, a country that has no marriage equality had a large space rock blow up over it.

    • Dk

      I think that this is Murdoch’s home country and that is why this is taken so long….when you think about it, most of the bad things happening-Trump, Brexit-can be traced back to him and his out dated views which are magnified in his media companies. He did install his own Trump-Tony Abbott, but luckily for the Aussies they have a system which can get rid of idiots more quickly than we can. Everyone hates Trump but I think Murdoch is the worst human alive

  • greenmanTN

    Good thing it’s impossible (I assume) to hack a mail in vote because when a right-wing pol in the US says that it means, “We’re doing everything we can to make this go our way, by hook or by crook!”

  • Cuberly Deux

    OT: Federal judge lets stand Schock indictment

    “A federal judge in Illinois on Monday let stand the vast majority of the indictment against former GOP Rep. Aaron Schock, refusing a defense request to dismiss the charges.

    However, U.S. District Judge Colin Bruce threw out two of the 24 counts against Schock, which followed an earlier ruling where the judge agreed with the defense team that federal prosecutors had not been candid with the grand jury that charged the one-time Republican rising star.”

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/10/23/judge-aaron-schock-indictment-244088

    This is going to be interesting.

    • greenmanTN

      I hope Schock is outed big time because this nasty little closet case is a hypocrite who needs to be vilified and shunned. Despicable little shit-slick…

    • clay

      Meanwhile, Schock’s been busy using Habitat for Humanity to fulfill local government obligations for housing low-income city workers and veterans. Sorta like how the Walton family’s fine with Food Stamps, as long as Walmart employees get ’em.

      • Lars Littlefield

        I’m too tired to play. I read your comment to imply John-Boy, grandpa Zebulon, and grandma Esther didn’t pay farmhands enough on Walton Mountain and needed food stamps. :-/

        • clay

          Pretty much, ‘cept Walton Mountain’s now at Bentonville, Arkansas.

  • safari

    Don’t get gay married. Done. Never speak again.

  • fuzzybits
  • Todd20036

    Of course, if the population voted no, you’d bet the Nazis would everything they could to prevent the government from granting civil rights – the majority voted against the rights of the minority, so there!

    But the Nazis aren’t ok when the reverse happens.

    But hey, Nazis gotta Nazi!

  • clay

    “The Australian Conservatives leader said he believed people were pressured by political correctness and were saying they voted “yes”, even if they had voted “no”.”

    Oh, probably, but that doesn’t mean jack shit because 1) the number who voted “No” might still be fewer than those who voted “Yes”, and 2) it’s been a non-binding vote from the get go, as his own side demanded.

  • billbear1961

    You mean that, unlike you, THEY would be ashamed to admit they’re motivated by HATRED, you goddamned FASCIST??

    • zhera

      The only people who complain about political correctness are the ones who hate minorities. I try to remember that every time someone brings up PC.

  • fuzzybits

    Should not be voted on in the first place.

  • Sam_Handwich
  • Ninja0980

    “Last week the leader of the anti-gay side said they would not accept the results if Yes wins, vowing to fight the likely vote that would follow in the Parliament.”
    Which is another reason why this never should have been put up to a vote in the first place but rather voted on in Parliament (where it would have passed easily) a long time ago.

    • Well, let’s say that Yes wins in the plebiscite and then ME passes in Parliament. Who will Bernardi then take his grouches too? Certainly not to the High Court, which ruled unanimously in 2013 that the Constitution gives Parliament the last word on all matters pertaining to marriage in Australia.

  • Paula

    That is one ugly motherfucker! Hate twist the psyche and face.

    • Ross

      A face which screams repressed homosexual.

      • vorpal 😼

        I hope not.
        He’s not worthy of the noun “homosexual.”

        Part of me wants to feel sorry for self-loathing faggot trash, but we all overcame myriad challenges, and learned to make society better for the next generation of LGBT people, and it’s hard to muster up much respect for those who haven’t.

        • Lars Littlefield

          I would say he’s not worthy of the prestige status of homosexual. 🙂

        • Phillip in L.A.

          Preach, vorpal!

    • Sam_Handwich

      he looks like someone just stole his autographed copy of of Mein Kampf

      Sad!

    • Strepsi

      My British relatives have a wonderful expression he puts me in mind of: “He’s got a face like a slapped arse!”

      • Vista-Cruiser

        Hey! Some slapped arses look really hot! Especially if the guy regularly does squats.

  • JWC
  • Strepsi

    Oh man, not this ass wart again.

  • DN

    Gee, it’s almost like they’re ashamed to admit they hold an awful opinion…

  • Shorter homophobic bigotry: “We’re so sure everyone agrees with us, we’re going to paternalistically assert that our bigotry is universally shared by all.”

    Moving the goalposts is what they always do. Can’t win honestly? Ignore the results.

  • Me in general today:
    https://twitter.com/swear_trek/status/922599941582872578
    Apologies in advance and in retrospect for my excessive rage levels. I know the rest of you are all like the silver-clad Tellarite in the background, just watching shit happen.

    • Strepsi

      Yes, I am wearing my foil jumpsuit now!

    • Phillip in L.A.

      That is me in general every day

  • Lazycrockett

    Just FYI I will not be available this thursday evening.

    https://twitter.com/CityofSouthBend/status/922524695857188867

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    While I do believe the majority of Australians are not anti-gay, the fact remains that he may have a point. As Americans learned, the hard way, positive polls can’t be taken at face value and that apathy, coupled with complacency, can lead to disaster. Whether he’s right or not, hopefully everyone who can fill in the ballot, did so for YES on Marriage Equality.

    • Ninja0980

      Prop 8 was the last time I ever trusted a poll on marriage bans.

      • bobbleobble

        In MD, ME and WA in 2012 as well as Ireland a couple of years ago the polls were all predicting a yes win and the voters came through. There was also a certain degree of accuracy in terms of the Yes vote predicted percentages although the no vote was often underestimated.

        I have no idea what will happen this time but there are good precedents as well as bad. There were also a few polls showing Prop 8 passing not far out from the election, that hasn’t been the case throughout in Aus.

    • zhera

      But 70% have already mailed in their vote. That’s a pretty good number, isn’t it? Though, I don’t know if a high number means a win for YES or a win for NO.

      • Jean-Marc in Canada

        My point exactly. While I’m cautiously optimistic, I won’t celebrate before the result are know.

      • bobbleobble

        I would suspect that a higher turn out is good for the YES side. Support for Ssm is always strongest among younger people but they are notoriously bad at participation whereas older people vote no matter what. A higher turnout means more of the young have voted which can only be good for YES.

        • zhera

          Yes, I think I remember reading that a large number of young people had registered to vote, or whatever it’s called in Australia.

          • bobbleobble

            Well in Australia it’s compulsory to register but they don’t really worry that much if you don’t and Young people often put it off as long as possible. However, around 90k extra youngsters made sure to register for this vote specifically which in an electorate of 16m isn’t chump change!

  • Pizza009

    Dear aussies, take a lesson from the yankies: even if you win, the fight isn’t over. Religious freedom to discriminate will be the next battle.

  • vorpal 😼

    #fakenews

  • kelven

    He vowed they would fight even if yes because of course he did. Christianists will not rest as long as any one else is not as miserable as they are.

  • oneloneokie

    A “Right” either exists or does not exist. It is not a “Right” if someone can give it today and take it away tomorrow. Fundamental Rights do not rely on popular opinion or change based on who holds the majority votes. Those are called “privileges.”

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    Typical duplicitous religitard.

    If the vote is YES, we will fight it because it’s not a legitimate vote, only a plebiscite.

    BUT

    If the vote is NO, we will accept the voice of the people because they have spoken.

    Fuck, these Christers are beyond reprehensible.

    • vorpal 😼

      If the vote is YES, it will because humans are fallen degenerates.
      If the vote is NO, it will because their god listened to their righteous prayers.

      • Phillip in L.A.

        Not mutually exclusive!

  • kevin vincent

    Yes go ahead you POS waste all that money for a vote and THEN refuse to honor the will of the people who voted see how that goes!

    • Karl Dubhe

      Hey, he’s “fighting” for the will of Gawd! Deux Virriles, or something like that. My Latin might be off somewhat.

      Deus Clubs! Thash itz. 🙂 hic

      • RoFaWh

        My question: why does he care? Is there a good grift that’ll be messed up by same sex marriage?

  • OdieDenCO

    not accepting any result but the one you approve of because that’s how democracy works. moron!

  • TampaZeke

    On that point he’s probably right. Plus you have to factor in the Russian component.

  • JWC

    well Kiddies its nearing Scotch oclock and dinz Here is a “woof” for you https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0a1a9d96a507866edea0c5cf3ed26b1313ea573457991901e71be65acb00e95c.jpg

    • Karl Dubhe

      I used to have wavy hair like that…

      I waved it bye bye over the last two decades. 🙂

    • Ross

      Oh, yes, PLEASE woof me!

      Woof me HARD!

    • I wonder what that beard would feel like on one’s inner thighs…

      Woof.

      • JWC

        Ah tickle tickle

      • Robincho

        The smart money says it’d feel christalmighty magnificent…

    • Prost Seattle

      I can definitely make his beard smell like my….

      • JWC

        Oh the mind boggles

    • Phillip in L.A.

      (Groucho.) That looks like at least a woof-and-a-half, to me.

      • JWC

        Have you now changed from. Captain Peacock to Groucho

        • Phillip in L.A.

          That is supposed to be an indication that the Dramatis Persona named within the parenthesis does the speaking.

          • JWC

            Ok

  • bkmn
  • Sam_Handwich
  • justmeeeee

    Protesting too much, Mary?

  • Natty Enquirer

    He also believes a virgin got pregnant by a supreme spirit being and gave birth to a half-man half-god who had to sacrifice himself to his father to save human beings from death (although they still die, unfortunately) because his father gave them the choice of remaining ignorant or knowing good from evil and they fell prey to a talking reptile who was actually a degenerate supernatural spirit trying to get even with the sky-daddy …

    • Gianni

      One thing, Jesus is claimed to have died for the forgiveness of our sins, I believe in particular, Original Sin. Every human is born with the stain of Original Sin which is the sin of disobedience committed by Adam and Eve. As to how this all works, has always been a total mystery to me.

      • Natty Enquirer

        It’s the ancient notion of blood sacrifice, dressed up in tons of theological nonsense and functioning as a tool to shame and manipulate the faithful. Invent the disease, sell the cure. If you find yourself suffering insomnia, you can read all about it.
        http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11312a.htm

      • Sam_Handwich

        if you read the creation story carefully, you’ll find that Eve is the only one telling the truth.

        • JohnJay

          The snake was telling the truth, too. It was only God who lied… saying they would die if they ate the fruit.

          • Natty Enquirer

            But Adam and Eve did die.

          • JohnJay

            800+ years later

          • andrew

            A talking snake. I like the reruns of the Mr. Ed show, it has a talking horse. Much more believable. Although to be fair, the bible does have a talking donkey.

          • clay

            ” . . . on that day.” God, who supposedly created them, has huge problems negotiating space and time.

          • JohnJay

            Well, you know. 1,000 years is like a day to God.

          • clay

            And Massachusetts recognizes same-sex marriages,
            so Kansas get slammed by a tornado.

          • jmax

            I live in Kansas. Damn you, Massachusetts!

        • Adam King

          The snake told the truth.

      • NZArtist

        I believe Saruman was greatly misunderstood. He just wanted what was best for Middle Earth and felt that Sauron was the best path to that goal.
        If only the Ents hadn’t destroyed his stronghold, the world would be a much better place.
        Why, yes, your mythology *is* crazy as a loon.

        • Gianni

          Actually, it’s not mine. I just repeat what I learned in Sunday school.

      • Prost Seattle

        If Jesus died for my sins, I feel I need to make certain it was worth it.

        • Gianni

          😀 That’s a thought provoking point of view.

    • Sam_Handwich

      it’s even worse than the General Hospital story line

      • Natty Enquirer

        But not as bad as Dark Shadows.

    • Ross

      STOP! STOP!

      You are driving me to drink!

      (Oh, upon reflection…)

  • blackstar
    • reposting–

      CNN anchor: “And here to discuss the matter is one person who believes an apple is an apple, one expert who disputes the existence of apples, and a Banana Truther who says they have documented proof the apple really is a banana that was born in Kenya. I’ll set up a question, and then let my guests scream at each other for the next nineteen minutes until it’s time for a commercial break.”

      Commercial break: “The Democrats are LYING to you about apples, trying to pass off bananas as apples. Apples go into apple pie. Have you ever had an all-American apple pie made with bananas? Of course not. And neither has our amazing leader, President Donald J Trump. Who enjoys TWO scoops of all-American ice cream with his apple pie. Why do Democrats hate America? (…this ad paid for by the Boris Badenov GOP Advancement Fund for American Patriots Only…)

      CNN anchor: “And we’re back. Added to our panel is Barney Frank, former Representative from Massachusetts, Kellyanne Conway to present the White House position on the apples vs bananas debate, and Phil Robertson from Duck Dynasty who suggests women should be barefoot, pregnant, and in the kitchen making apple pies. The screaming will begin…now.”

    • Sam_Handwich
      • Gianni

        May I peel that for you sir? Now I can’t tell if I’m hungry for a banana or what it is symbolizing.

        • Mike_in_the_Tundra

          Go for both. Win, win.

      • houstonray

        Reminds me of an old boyfriend… 😉

    • Johnny Wyeknot

      Just try putting that up your ass and get back to me.

    • Adam King

      So hypocritical. When will CNN stop hiring and interviewing the banana crowd?

  • Gianni

    We have a lot of Americans like this dude, “It’s my way or the highway!”

    • Johnny Wyeknot

      Like this (closet case) dude …

  • shellback

    Cory, Didn’t your mother teach you it’s not polite to speak with your mouth full – of dick?

  • Cuberly Deux
    • Gianni

      Oh so true!

      • Cuberly Deux

        Trump’s base is proof.

  • Ninja0980

    This guy saying this doesn’t surprise me at all.
    Here in NY, only our legislature could pass marriage equality (and the bigots on our top court told us that was the only way we were getting equality), yet when they did, the bigots immediately sued and claimed proper legislative procedures weren’t done, the people should vote on it, blah blah.
    There is no right way for us to get rights because the bigots don’t think we should have them at all.

    • Adam King

      It’s like white people judging when and in what manner it’s appropriate for black people to protest murder by police.

  • andrew

    Is he saying that if they voted no, they are ashamed to admit it?

    • Gianni

      It’s sort of twisted but convenient logic. They vote “Yes” and then tell the pollsters when asked how they voted, they say they voted “No”. There’s a really large ridiculous component to that reasoning.

    • Johnny Wyeknot

      How the world has changed in my lifetime. I remember not too long ago people generally were appalled at the notion that homosexuals should be able to legally marry each other. Even homosexuals thought it pretty far fetched.

  • dagobarbz, fine Italian shoes

    Weird. It’s like Australia has a majority who think your bedroom antics are nobody’s business except the participants. He just can’t believe everyone isn’t as obsessed with other people’s sex lives as he is!

    Wake up, stupid, and smell the hate-free coffee!~

    • Johnny Wyeknot

      Bedroom antics has more to do with sodomy laws than marriage equality, but I catch your drift.

      • Adam King

        I am definitely on the pro-bedroom-antics side.

        • Johnny Wyeknot

          Me too. But I find bedrooms a buzz kill. Give me a good alley with a dumpster nearby.

  • Publius

    He’s actually right in a sense. In the world of polling, it very much is a common problem that people will sometimes tend to give a pollster a socially acceptable answer. This is called the Bradley effect. It explains polling outcomes in cases like 2016. The reality is that the Yes vote will be a slightly lower percentage than what polls predicted.

    Where he is wrong is in his belief that his view is the silent majority. Enough Australians support gay marriage to render this polling phenomenon a non-issue.

    • Ross

      You wrote: “It explains polling outcomes in cases like 2016.”

      WERE the polls wrong?

      Or did Russia steal the vote?

      My money is on the latter.

      • Publius

        IDK man I’m just trying to provide some insight. This is my field academically, and I’ve studied it a lot. Not trying to piss anyone off, just provide a prospective.

        • Ross

          I’m not pissed off.

          And I, too, am just trying to provide another perspective.

    • Cuberly Deux

      Secularism is outpacing the growth of religion in Australia. Alas, there is a boom in young adults attending pentecostal mega-churches.

      https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/jun/27/christianity-on-the-wane-in-australia-but-pentecostal-church-bucks-trend

      Times are a-changin.

      • billbear1961

        A mega-church isn’t a church–it’s a goddamned freakshow.

        • Cuberly Deux

          It’s a big big business. Large flashy services, plus some “churches” have in-house youth sports teams, food courts, movie theaters showing christian films, pools, bowling allies, rec centers. It’s all designed to center an attendees complete attention & time on the “church”. It’s also a big draw in proselytizing for new members.

          Mega-churches are freaky micro-cults.

          • billbear1961

            Cult is exactly what comes to mind.

            People can be so pathetic, so easily manipulated, preyed upon.

            What a species!

    • bobbleobble

      You know the people actually involved in that election don’t believe that there was any such thing as the Bradley effect. The problem was that the pollsters stopped polling early and as a result missed the shifts that were happening in that race late in the day.

      In 2016 what characterised a lot of the polls was the vast numbers of undecideds in virtually all of them. Late breaking events pushed a lot of undecideds Trump’s way but it wasn’t picked up in the polls.

      Anyway, I don’t know what’ll happen but I’m hopeful of a YES.

      • Publius

        Yeah I totally agree. This was different kind of campaign. Pollsters had their biggest defeat since “Dewey Defeats Truman.” Polling companies are probably doing a lot to recalibrate their methods.

        • bobbleobble

          They did that in the UK for the election in June and most of them fell on their faces spectacularly! They underestimated the youth vote enormously and consequently underscored Labour drastically whilst also giving Theresa May a false sense of security. However, not all pollsters got it that wrong, a couple were bang on.

          What gives me more hope that these polls are accurate is that there are now four polls showing YES support consistently at 60%. It seems unlikely that if people were lying that they would do so with such consistency.

    • another_steve

      Thanks for voicing that view, Publius.

      I hope you’re right in that enough Australians support marriage equality so as to render the Bradley Effect irrelevant.

      We’ll see.

  • June Gordon

    Pardon me, but I detect acute gay-face.

    • Johnny Wyeknot

      I thought the same thing.

    • Canadian Observer

      More obtuse than cute.

    • Oscarlating Wildely

      Yep.

      Cory, hon, you got something on your face there. Looks to me like more than a little piece of gay.

  • ClevelandJim

    I hope the people pull an Ireland and WHUP your ass, Cory Bernardi!

  • Hamoverfist

    Hey Cory, Fuck you, die mad.

  • bkmn

    It looks like it has been about three years since he has taken a good crap.

    • Adam King

      He’d never pull that broomstick out of his ass. Jesus said to keep a broomstick shoved up your ass, and by golly, he’s going to do it!

  • Stuart Wyman-Cahall

    The Bradley effect? Prop 8? I don’t trust what people do in a voting booth. Americans have marriage equality, not by the good graces of the American people but by a one vote decision in our Supreme Court. And sure marriage equality polls well here at home. But I wouldn’t bet on it winning here in the USA. It’s Trumpland. That’s where we’re at.

    • bobbleobble

      As I mentioned elsewhere there is substantial debate as to whether the Bradley effect actually exists. Also prop 8 polls were much closer than in Aus and some even had prop 8 winning.

      • stevenj

        The polls done (on 8) early on looked promising – that it would lose. Towards the end of summer and into October the polls became very close. Too close.

        • bobbleobble

          I remember when that result came through. My bf (now hubby) and I were celebrating not just Obama who managed to even take my bf’s then home state of NC but also Bev Perdue holding the governor’s mansion and Kay Hagan giving Liddy Dole the boot. Despite all that good stuff prop 8 passing felt like a real kick in the gut.

          • Ninja0980

            Yup, Obama won, Democrats got more Senate seats… and Prop 8 passing took all the fun of that night away.

          • stevenj

            I remember part of Obama’s speech that night in Grant Park in Chicago – where he mentioned celebrating all of our rights. I was thinking, yeah, well they’re taking ours away in 3 or 4 states.

        • Ninja0980

          A couple of my friends saw that and had a bad feeling about it.
          I of course refused to believe California would pass it..woke me up a lot politics wise that night.

          • stevenj

            “a bad feeling about it” – – As did the husband and I. We were planning to get married in November or December and at the beginning of October it looked (from the polls) that we might not be able to. Our 9th/24th anniversary is on Halloween and now there is no excuse for either of us forgetting.

  • KnownDonorDad

    Bookmarking for gloating purposes.

  • Lazycrockett

    Rachel will be interviewing Eric Holder well bout right now.

  • margaretpoa

    Democracy: Only good if YOUR side wins!

  • safari

    Got my butternut squash roasted, my turkey breast cooked… all I need is to make some orange cranberries and I’ll have early thanksgiving for dinner tomorrow since it is now cold. I needed a break from the screen.

    • Sam_Handwich

      i always get itchy for that dinner in October. i’ll probably do the same next week, plus bread dressing w/ sausage and apples. mmmm

      • Adam King

        Yum..

      • safari

        That’s my favorite. But — I defer to my 86 year old grandmother to make it first.

    • Adam King

      Yum.

    • SoCalGal20

      Sounds delicious!

    • fuzzybits
    • BobSF_94117

      Got my butternut squash roasted

      Phrases screaming out to be a euphemism.

  • greenmanTN

    Way OT: I’ve mentioned going through boxes of things stored, in some cases, for decades.

    This is a print, my late 1980s idea of what HIV looked like in the blood stream. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/50e5aee7af206b37d53615bd2db8d6f3f82906a9a0feebc7c39a654ce4ea860e.jpg

    Desire and simultaneous fear of sex… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/c9a88c70b8f40f07cc10dc143bfb4c1c4addb7806c922f311b4092c52c4809c4.jpg

    • safari

      Beautiful.

    • houstonray

      Both hauntingly beautiful!

      • greenmanTN

        Thanks for saying so. It’s odd for me to see them.

    • Oscarlating Wildely

      Both brilliant; adore that second one for its haunting nature. Do you make prints in your current career? You should; these are great.

      • greenmanTN

        There are two answers to that question. I have the equipment and ability to make prints and am in the process of setting up studio space. That is something I did 35 years ago and no longer have the wood block used to make it.

        • canoebum

          I hope it is framed and on display. My mother was a print artist. I grew up watching her work. I have many here in my house, along with a few paintings. She did wood block and collage as you have. Also lithos and silk screens. In some she would use cut pieces of fabric, cardboard, wood pieces, yarns, fibers, etc, for impressions; others were drawn or sketched.

          • greenmanTN

            Lol. Hardly. Rolled up and hasn’t seen the light of day in decades.

          • canoebum

            Well get that thing framed and on a wall where it can be appreciated!

          • greenmanTN

            That’s great! My mother’s side of the family has an odd streak of visual art running through it, painters, quilters, sculptors, etc. Tacky stuff too. Have you ever seen a toilet paper doll cover?

            I have and it was not ironic! https://i.pinimg.com/originals/2e/f2/00/2ef20098263615bf199ee73dbcb9007c.jpg

            Do you do artwork too?

          • canoebum

            I don’t. I try my best to appreciate art, whenever possible. I buy art when I can find a bargain. I have the same relationship with music. I’m a terrific listener. Don’t ask me to sing, please.

    • Phillip in L.A.

      Thanks for digging those up and allowing them see the light of day, again, greenman! They are amazing

      • greenmanTN

        Thanks. Now I see them I remember doing them, but I really had forgotten them.

    • Robincho

      You are amazing! I’ve always suspected that I needed to meet up with you, and now I know it…

    • HozillaSmallpox

      These are magnificent! I can’t believe our paths didn’t cross in that era

    • LaChatSayWha

      These are beautiful and powerful! Are those woodblock prints? Printmaking is so satisfying. I’m in the process of moving and I’ve just unearthed some of my old block prints and etchings. Your art inspires me to return to it.

    • Mb
      • greenmanTN

        I like! The wallpaper background- is that Wm Morris?

        • Mb

          No, it is a stencil I made based on Baroque wall coverings then spray painted on the canvas.

  • Ninja0980

    O/T but a friend asked me for advice the other day (on trying a three way relationship) and got mad at me when I gave him my answer.
    Don’t ask questions if you don’t want to hear an answer you might not like.

    • Adam King

      Three ways leave one person out.

      • Silver Badger

        More often than not.

      • JRDC

        Yep. It’ll never work.

      • Jean-Marc in Canada

        While I would generally agree, I think it also depends on what kind of threeway (or more) it is. If I may; my husbotter and I are hardcore (not porn LOL) fetish enthusiasts and have a strong Sir/Boy relationship. On occasion, he likes watching me “use” a third or more and then joins in as my second. Now, to be sure, this is not the same as a threeway where the dynamics involve what could best be described as “equals.” So, yes, in general your statement holds…I merely wanted to offer an example of the exception to the rule.

        • Ninja0980

          It can work in some cases but for a solid relationship long term..I’ve never seen it work out.

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            Agreed. Multiple house boys can work so long as none are the favourite, but humans being what they are, there’s inevitably a pairing or two. It’s why we only “play” and don’t “own” any extras.

          • Ninja0980

            Given my past experiences with my ex and the fact my hubby really isn’t in playing with other guys for the most part, always just been me and him.
            Certainly have no problem with other couples doing it though.

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            Absolutely. Esteban and I rarely do it, and only then if we’re both in the mood and on the same page regarding protocol and etiquette. Like you, we don’t judge others, everyone has their own thing and as long as it’s understood, consensual and above board, enjoy. The key is communication…cliché I know, but very true.

          • Ninja0980

            Communication is key for a healthy relationship.
            Told my hubby long ago if something bugs him, tell me because I can’t read minds.

          • Adam King

            Communication is absolutely key.

          • bambinoitaliano

            Beyond communication, not all couples enter into a relationship with the same level of commitment and understanding. Too much variation from each individual past experience. Having the intellectual understanding of what polygamy entails does not necessary translate into having the emotional capability to handle the actual relationship. It works for some and not others is what i’m saying.

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            Quite right. We don’t have a polyamourous or polygamous relationship, for us it’s just an occasional bit of play. Those involved are aware and it’s all good. As you say, many don’t have the intellectual or emotional maturity to actually handle it.

          • RoFaWh

            Somewhere in this discussion I have to point out one polyamorous household that worked: the harem of the Emperor of China, consisting of one chief wife (who occupied an unassailable social position), up to four secondary wives; and concubines of three grades, quantities not remembered.

          • houstonray

            Yep, a three way is a fun thing to scratch off your sexual bucket list (a few times, ha) but I’ve never seen a threesome work in a relationship. Too much potential for things to go down the jealousy path.

          • bambinoitaliano

            Physical sex is not the main issue. It’s the emotional side of it. It’s hard enough for two people to fulfill each other emotional needs let alone adding another one or more person into the mix.

        • Adam King

          Pix or it didn’t happen, you filthy but oddly intriguing slut.

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            Now, now, be nice; we don’t do pix during play….honestly, it creeps us both out. We’ve had people ask but it’s a hard no with us.

          • Ninja0980

            Smart move.
            I’ve had friends who did adult work and knew that in one form or another, photos of them having sex would always be out there.
            But I’ve also met people who were stunned that one or two webcam shows they did or photos they allowed one person to take are the same way.
            Once it’s out there, it’s out there.

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            BINGO!

    • billbear1961

      Then he didn’t really want your advice–he wanted your approval, or he wanted you to agree with what he had already decided.

      • Ninja0980

        Probably the latter in this case.

    • JRDC

      They’re being immature

    • SoCalGal20

      I’ve known people people in poly relationships but it’s definitely not for everybody. I’ve also known people in open relationships and the same deal. They work for some people but I think in many cases somebody ends up getting burned at some point or another.

      As already said, your friend didn’t really want your opinion by the sound of it. (and the reaction doesn’t bode well for a three way relationship)

      • Ninja0980

        I’ve seen them as well and just from my experience, for everyone that worked out, there were even more that didn’t.
        More often then not, someone is going to get the boot.
        Just how it is with most of them.

        • Jean-Marc in Canada

          I love some of the looks I get when they ask incredibly private questions and I or Esteban blurt out an equally shocking response. He’s very open about being a piggy power bottom and the first time he was asked to explain it, well, hilarity ensued….at least for me and him.

          • Ninja0980

            Done that as well.
            Suffice to say most folks don’t ask the hubby if he has a problem having sex with another man anymore (which is a stupid question to ask of someone who’s bi.)

          • Jean-Marc in Canada

            It’s the whole gay sex thing. Straight people, for whatever reason, seem eager to know and, more shockingly, seem to have zero filter or qualms about asking….only to then turn around and be shocked when they get an answer. I have never asked or been curious about straight sex. smh

          • Ninja0980

            In our case, some of the questions have been from gay friends as well as straight ones who don’t seem to get that being bi means you can be attracted to and have sex with either gender.
            My husband has been asked more then once how far he’ll go sexually, which is really no one’s business but ours.
            Suffice to say, after he answered a couple of times to a couple of people, they’ve shut up.

          • Oscarlating Wildely

            Yea, agreed there. Bi ness becomes a supposed invitation to ask about everything from orgasm rates to porn fantasies to the latest in masturbatory tendencies and beyond, with “actually vanilla and monogamous” never being enough.

            Really it’s not that hard to grasp: “I like both.”

    • Jean-Marc in Canada

      I have said this many times to many people: “you can ask me any question you want, no matter how personal or potentially offensive, with one caveat: understand that my answer may not be what you want to hear. If you can handle that, then all is good. If you can’t, shut the fuck up and sit down.”

      • Ninja0980

        Pretty much how I am as well.

    • SoCalGal20

      This comment also reminds me that I need to go see “Professor Marston and the Wonder Women.”

      • JCF

        It may or may not be true…but it’s a wonderful movie! [Going to see it 3rd time tomorrow.] I’m ticked off it hasn’t been a big hit…but I guess, in this day and age, that’s what Netflix is for.

        Also along those lines (same het guy + bi woman + bi woman dynamic) : the cable show “You Me Her” (really well-written, and mostly well-acted. Esp Rachel Blanchard as Emma). Season 3 now in production! http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5179408/?ref_=nv_sr_1

    • My experience has been that in any newly open or poly relationship will be at least one person who doesn’t want to be in one.

      Not saying it can’t work. I’ve seen it do so. But take one monogamous couple and suddenly there’s a 3rd person added one or both of two things will be true: One of the members of the previously mono couple will be unhappy with the change and is doing it only because they feel they have no choice. Or the newly added person will want primary/sole access and to shove out one of the mono couple members.

      Because while love itself is not a limited resource, time, focus and attention very much are.

      • JCF

        Well said.

      • Ninja0980

        Hit the nail on the head.

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I think the friend should know that if he wants to open the relationship up, there’s a much higher likelihood that his SO will find someone more enticing and float off, especially if the enticer offers a strictly monogamous arrangement.

      Also if the friend is a straight man, he may be unpleasantly surprised to find way, way more guys want to bang his lady friend no strings attached while he goes wanting for a woman willing to be the non-primary focus on a permanent basis. Also quite a few people don’t like to be the 3rd person because they feel that they’re being used as a sex toy for the couple instead of having their needs/wants/desires on the same level as the couple. I’ve heard quite a few people will actually get a pro as a 3rd so there’s less expectations and fewer feelings hurt.

      (This is from what I’ve read and not from actual experience.)

  • fuzzybits

    Reporter’s hat at trump press conference. https://i.redd.it/x7749k8s5mtz.jpg

  • Robincho

    Hate makes ugly. Case in point: Bernardi’s face. Yikes…

  • Michael R
    • Bryan

      Trick-or-treat.

      • zhera

        Trick-or-threat.

        • Natty Enquirer

          Pick-your-tweet.

    • houstonray

      Not evil looking enough for the asshole…

    • Jean-Marc in Canada

      “Trick or…..fuck it, RUN!!!!!”

      • bambinoitaliano

        Nope! Stand your ground! Kill it!!!

    • KnownDonorDad

      Don’t you want a balloon? I mean, it’s tremendous, just the best kind of balloon. Believe me, it’s really, really great.

  • JRDC

    It’s not gonna pass in Aus. Too many people with limited education.

  • Hank

    Cory Bernardi…… in one stall
    Tony Abbott……….in the next stall
    Tap, Tap, Tap…
    Tap, Tap, Tap…

  • another_steve

    Ohmigod I just googled “show me the way to heaven,” and look what appeared.

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/c854252d3e51e0344fae961f5f0968a41bc23b1ba89bdaa2098af896f1f22137.jpg

    • RoFaWh

      His six pack is accentuated with mascara. It sticks out like a sore thumb. Siily! I’m sure he has a perfectly deightful six pack without mascara.

      • another_steve

        Ohmigod I’m old and thought I knew all the secrets of faggotdom…but I didn’t catch that one.

  • Lazycrockett
    • another_steve

      Heaven help me… I’m old enough to remember when the NY Post was a semi-respectable newspaper.

      I can’t keep up these days.

      What’s respectable and what’s not.

    • Sam_Handwich

      65 pounds. that’s a lot of butter and cocoa.

      • another_steve

        Sam, should you and I adopt Halloween-style avatars? Others have done that here on JMG. I don’t know what kind of “scary” ham sandwiches are out there.

        My avatar is Lenten Roses – a flower I particularly adore.

        There are no scary Lenten Roses.

        • Sam_Handwich

          i ain’t goin pumpkin spice. nope

        • Lazycrockett

          can I play?

          • Sam_Handwich
          • Lazycrockett

            Ill go with something more festive!!

          • another_steve

            Sam, please get into the seasonal spirit.

            Think “diabolic ham sandwich.”

          • Adam King

            I’ve never met a ham sandwich that was anything but kind and considerate.

          • Sam_Handwich

            we’re like salty hugs, really.

          • another_steve

            To religious Jews, all ham sandwiches are evil. Temptresses.

            Fortunately, I’m heathen Jew. Look…I live in Maryland, home of the best crab cakes in the universe.

            So I ask ya… Did Zeus intend for me to keep kosher?

          • JCF

            Crab cakes? Clearly Poseidon didn’t!

          • another_steve

            They’re berserk here in Maryland with the crabs, I swear.

            My husband and I have a favorite Mediterranean restaurant where we occasionally go for breakfast. Traditional Mediterranean fare, with some exceptions.

            They feature a breakfast entree called “Eggs Benedict Chesapeake.” Eggs Benedict with an embedded crab cake.

            This thing of theirs is unbelievably delicious.

            One serving of it reduces your expected life expectancy by five years, but it’s worth it.

          • Oscarlating Wildely

            The crabs in MD are the closest thing I have found to proof that there may indeed be a deity.

            They are simply without comparison. I lived in MD many years ago. Never forgot the crabs.

          • another_steve

            There’s an activist community here in Maryland dedicated to the preservation of the health and vibrancy of the Chesapeake Bay – where our crabs come from.

            All is not 100 percent good and well there, but there’s been progress.

          • RoFaWh

            Some anthropologists speculate that the taboo status of the pig in Judaism is an echo of a time when the pig was taboo because it was a sacred animal.

          • another_steve

            I’m pretty much a biological evolutionary absolutist when it comes to understanding the imperatives that result in human behavior.

            The prohibitions in Leviticus against the eating of pork and shellfish were probably rooted in the empirical knowledge of the day – namely, that if you ate those, your chances of dying from food-borne illness were much increased.

            I have 100 percent confidence in the inherent and uncontrived wisdom of our species.

          • clay
          • another_steve

            LMAO

            (Ya gotta go to a gay blog for the most clever and funny stuff on the internet…)

          • RoFaWh

            Has anyone ever seen Underwood’s Deviled Ham in any container except the wee paper-wrapped can?

          • clay

            a friend’s foreskin?

          • Adam King

            Kinda corny.

          • safari

            *groan*

          • another_steve

            Your seasonal avatar is diabolical, for sure.

          • Lazycrockett

            Carved it myself.

        • zhera
        • They are all virulently poisonous, however.

    • safari

      It’s strange in this day and age to hear of the plight of the weed farmers on NPR.

    • Hank
      • safari

        And a cat. Or dog.

        • Oscarlating Wildely

          Or you could swing both ways.

          Oh, and like cats and dogs, too.

      • Lazycrockett

        I think PP has a whole different take on it.

        • safari

          Marcie never gets any love.

      • JCF
  • RichW

    If my marriage to my husband has any impact whatsoever on his marriage, then there is a problem in HIS marriage, not mine!

  • Henry Auvil

    I remember this same argument going down in the US in ’08. I went to stock up on hooch for the big election night blowout, and the liquor store lady was all “oh I heard a lot of people said they would vote for Obama but will chicken out in the voting booth.” Wishful thinking.

  • Jean-Marc in Canada
    • Hank

      Niger = Benghazi
      Niger = Benghazi
      Niger = Benghazi

      • another_steve

        Yes.
        Yes.
        Yes.

      • safari

        I’m told we shouldn’t go there.

    • Sam_Handwich

      there’s also another important delineation there –

      Benghazi victims were civilian diplomats. By all accounts, they knew the risks and stayed there at their will .

      The US special forces were ordered to carry out a mission in Niger, under CIC Dotard.

      • Hank

        Actually, Ambassador Chris Stevens chose to leave Tripoli and see what was happening in Benghazi. (I do not recall exactly why, but Benghazi is a large and important city in eastern Libya.) Two of the killed, were former Seals serving as security contractors. The other was a civilian diplomat.

        • safari

          We also had that CIA facility down the street.

          • Phillip in L.A.

            You mean the Consulate?

          • safari

            Both the CIA annex and the consulate were attacked. I just remember the CIA annex being a point of contention when a GOP congressman just blurted out that “something” is being shown on an overhead map of the area that was a national security concern and ended up closing the congressional session for security purposes.

          • Phillip in L.A.

            Really was just trying to point out that all consulates are, to a greater or lesser degree, CIA ‘annexes’

    • Gerry Fisher

      I agree with the sentiment and cringe at the lack of punctuation.

  • SoCalGal20

    Elizabeth Warren and Al Franken in 2020!

    https://twitter.com/SenWarren/status/922605762236571649

    • JCF

      Argh.

  • Blake J Butler
    • zhera

      PERFECT!

  • Blake J Butler
  • Blake J Butler

    More this year than in 2016, and 2013.

    https://twitter.com/RalphNortham/status/922613397081993219

    • Hank

      It will really come down to how many in NE Virginia come out to vote! Gillespie is a known Asshole, but VA is still a purple state, so it can go either way…. sadly!!!

      • Ninja0980

        I keep hearing folks say Northam isn’t inspiring enough.
        To that I say (#@.
        If protecting LGBT rights, reproductive rights, voting rights etc is based on how excited the candidate makes you, you don’t care about these rights.

        • bobbleobble

          Let me guess, bunch of butt hurt berniebros who are pissed they didn’t get Periello and are desperate for the Dems to get another kicking so that they can have another ‘told you so’ moment because VA dems didn’t kowtow to their sacred cow.

          • Ninja0980

            Pretty much.
            That’s despite the fact Periello is doing everything he can to help Northam win

      • Blake J Butler

        If it holds, he enjoys unified support from democrats and double digit support from independents, winning over college educated whites, women and 3/4ths support among non-white voters.

        he should be able to win. according to the latest poll from quinnipianc.

  • Ninja0980

    O/T but with no Yankees this week, my blood pressure will slowly go back to normal.

    • DaddyRay

      I know what you mean but at least it was a good increase in blood pressure that was providing a welcomed distraction from the nightmare in the White House

    • DaddyRay

      Do we have any Dodger / Astro JMG readers?

      • houstonray

        GO ‘Stros! Houston here, rooting for the home team.

        • DaddyRay

          Oh yeah – make sure your ‘Stros whoop those Dodgers for me

        • JCF

          NorCal here, rooting for the non-Dodgers! ;-X

  • safari

    Anybody read anything good recently? I’m looking for a book before bed that isn’t cerebral.

    • Sam_Handwich

      anything by Donald Trump

      • safari

        I’m trying to learn to sleep, not continue careening into insomnia.

        • Sam_Handwich

          i dunno. maybe you should just explore ASMR sausage frying on youtube

          • safari

            It’s more an attempt to get sleepy without a laptop screen.

          • Sam_Handwich

            last few years when i read a book in bed, about 80% of the time it’s a cookbook

          • RoFaWh

            My psychiatrist friend in Vancouver once worked in a sleep disorder clinic. He recommends reserving your bed and bedroom exclusively for sleep and sexual activity, specifically forbidding reading at bedtime.

          • hudson11

            Cookbooks are awesome reading!! Ones by Nigel Slater or Death and Co all have great little backstories to the recipes/ cocktails.

        • Hank

          What about Al Franken’s latest book??

          • safari

            I was thinking something with the intellectual capacity of Charlaine Harris.

          • You crack me up.

          • Lazycrockett

            I couldn’t get through the first one.

    • Refugay

      An aunt just gave me a copy of The Life We Bury by Allen Eskens. I couldn’t put it down-I was traveling for work and read it in two days. It’s what my mom called “lunch bucket lit,” something to chew on but not too heavy.

    • ‘The Collapsing Empire’ by John Scalzi. Good read, but forewarned it’s 1st book in a series that hasn’t been completed yet.

      Also just read the new David Mack prequel novel about Star Trek: Discovery, “Desperate Hours.” Light read, my guilty pleasure is books like these.

      • Another good, light read for those of us of a particular age: “Ready Player One” by Ernest Cline. Loved it.

        • safari

          I thought that sounded familiar. A movie is coming out next spring.

          • Yes. I’ve seen the trailer…I suspect the book will once again be superior to the onscreen treatment of it.

            RP1 is basically about an impoverished future culture where most people jack into a virtual reality, and an insanely wealthy man has hidden a fabulous prize behind a plethora of vintage video games of all kinds that the players must beat.

      • Lazycrockett

        Did the Klingon pages seem to go on forever and say basically nothing?

        • safari

          Perhaps they were groovy.

          • Lazycrockett

            Is his new jive talk part of the mirror universe? gawd Ive had bout enough of this show.

          • safari

            I’m starting to like it more. Plus I believe in the fan theory.

          • -M-

            Which fan theory? Section 31?

          • Lazycrockett

            Its like a deck of cards at this point. pick one.

          • safari

            Anthony Rapp becomes a talking mushroom.

          • safari

            hover
            That the Klingon Voq and the newly introduced Ash are actually the same. There is no record as I understand it of who the producers have listed as the actor playing Voq.

          • Lazycrockett

            My new fav is that this Lorca got zapped into the Prime from the mirror. This is just a theory and not a spoiler btw.

          • -M-

            Just saw that too. Haven’t watched ST:DISCO, the origin of section 31 could be interesting though if that’s where they’re going. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

          • Lazycrockett

            IT IS NOT DISCO. Its STD. disco is NOT going to happen. over my dead body. If the writers didn’t see that coming, thats on them.

          • -M-

            A line I thought of that I’d have liked to see in Trek, is a society descended from early human “augments” having to reveal themselves to humans in order to work with the Federation.

            Basically that Khan’s good counterparts went into hiding after the war, eventually settled empty worlds beyond some barrier like the badlands region from Voyager, while spying/keeping tabs on the Federation and now they have to find a way to build a relationship with humans who are paranoid about first generation augments like Bashir.

      • billbear1961

        The Collapsing Empire?

        Just look out your window, Becca.

    • Lars Littlefield

      Ghost Stories by Edith Wharton. Same gilded age voice, menacing spooks. It’s perfect for Halloween.

      • safari

        I downloaded the book. I just finished the preface and find it amusing that the author laments about the death of ghosts by the speed and lack of continuity of the modern (1930s) world.

        • Lars Littlefield

          Good for you. I think you’ll enjoy those short stories. I’m fond of Edith Wharton’s writing. I haven’t read the forward to the hard copy I have, but I can well imagine a woman from her time missing the mystery and spooks that inhabited the giant mansions she grew up in. Compared to her generation and class of wealth, Trump is little more than used single-wide white trash living without indoor plumbing.

        • Lars Littlefield
    • Lazycrockett

      I’m re reading Anne Rice’s The Witching Hour and its still great.

    • worstcultever

      Started the Bernie & Chet mystery series with “Dog On It.” Now I’m on the third one and they keep getting better. Bernie is a PI and Chet is his dog/partner and also the narrator. It might sound hokey but the writing is really droll and the dog-view of the world so well done, it really takes you out of yourself. Also it’s “cozy,” i.e. no gore or anything too fucked-up. Author is Spencer Quinn.

      • safari

        I’ve read quite a bit of the author Josh Lanyon. One of Josh’s books is about an author who had a wildly popular series about a detecting old lady who had a sleuthing cat companion… who then ends up in murder mysteries of his own and falls in love with a sexy younger cop-turned-author. The combination of your series and mine blows my meta mind.

    • RoFaWh

      My standard recommendation: science fiction and fantasy by Jack Vance. I’ve recently re-read the second and third volumes that make up Vance’s “Lyonesse” trilogy, viz. “The Green Pearl” and “Madouc”. I find the first volume, simply “Lyonesse” or “Suldrun’s Garden” ineffably sad, to the point that I don’t like to read it. And as I write I’m part way into the first volume of Vance’s “Demon Princes” pentology, “The Star King”.

      Many people like Vance’s fiction set on his fictional Dying Earth, but that would be too cerebral for you right now.

      Incidentally, most of Vance’s work is out of print. If there’s a used paperback place near you, they may have some.

    • JCF

      I’ve heard very good things about “Manhattan Beach”. https://www.amazon.com/Manhattan-Beach-Novel-Jennifer-Egan/dp/1476716730

    • hudson11

      Have a look at Undermajordomo Minor by Patrick DeWitt. I’m about 1/4 of the way into it. Its rather fun the way it reads like you might imagine reading the Grand Budapest Hotel as a book.

      https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25089757-undermajordomo-minor

  • bambinoitaliano

    So the public is being pressure to vote Yes what about this asshole? How much pre$$ure he gets to say No?

  • SoCalGal20

    Khizr Khan is going to be on Lawrence tonight. Also, he has a new book out.

    https://www.amazon.com/Khizr-Khan/e/B06XDTY4P2

    • Lazycrockett

      Plus Lawrence is gonna have a word or 2 bout what Fox had to say bout him last week.

      • JCF

        Listening now!

    • boobert

      He speaks wonderfully! So did Eric Holder on Rachael. Now we’ll get responses from the idiots trump and sessions.

  • Blake J Butler

    I’ve been missing O’Malley and wondering what he’s been up to.

    https://twitter.com/FairfaxJustin/status/922649150277279744

  • BobSF_94117

    Is there anything more pathetic than an Australian prude?

  • JCF

    “Last week the leader of the anti-gay side said they would not accept the results if Yes wins”

    No honor among homophobes?

    http://www.reactiongifs.us/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/im_shocked.gif

  • boobert

    Is this what he said to Obama that cracked him up ? He’s like your drunk uncle. lol https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b31b7be4969445290a815a0c44ad8ce9e3a1366e63a063a4c18873de09ef698a.jpg

  • what the actual fuck…
    https://twitter.com/byaaroncdavis/status/922650972073201664

    Corruption is one thing. Blatant, self-serving corruption of this degree is going to kill people.

    • safari

      I mean, I guess they can rebuild an entire island-state’s infrastructure… or not. One of the things we’re learning about how FEMA operates is that these no-bid contracts are laid out in advance and are all hella shady.

      • safari

        I think it was Rachael who brought up a similar ma and pa operation from Florida that’s supposed to construct the temporary trailer housing. When they called to get information, no one would speak to them and hung up.

        • Yeah, and as we here noted the other day, it sounds like food shipments are being contracted out to companies that just go and empty the nearest convenience store of all its worst crap.

        • Lazycrockett

          Yep. millions awarded to a company that doesn’t exist. Enjoy those mobile homes Houston.

    • Lars Littlefield

      This is going to fail, epically. Elon Musk’s proposal to retrofit the entire island with solar and wind is less of a risk.

      • safari

        The power walls (battery tech) and the like will change the wholesale energy market I think. Imagine a world where your power needs are pretty much a $5k addition to your house and your utility line is a backup.

        • We’ve already got more solar than we need. If Musk’s ‘power walls’ ever become a truly viable thing and we can get by with those and *maybe* a backup propane-fueled genny for extra nasty weather cycles, we’ve already decided to jump off the grid.

          • BobSF_94117

            Do not get a propane generator. Really. You’ll so regret it.

          • Had one at a place we lived for a couple years in middle Aughts. Did not regret it.

            Gotta buy a good one and have it serviced twice yearly.

            Only after we moved back to the general vicinity did we realize (and remember), holy shit, CNMEC is really shitty with the frequent outages. The genny let us ride them out w/out more than a brief 5 second interruption.

          • BobSF_94117

            In the seven weeks since Irma, my propane generator has worked, at most, barely half the time without throwing a fit about something. Also, the local propane companies are making only commercial deliveries. Even though my tank is as big if not bigger than many commercial clients, we have to hump 100 lb cylinders to their plant to get them filled. And this is a machine that was on a monthly maintenance contract. It worked fine for the frequent short power outages, but in a crisis it’s been a huge disappointment.

          • Lars Littlefield

            I am off the grid. I have both a Nature Power 2,000 Watt Marine Grade Wind Turbine and a Homestead Off Grid Solar System with a 12000 Watt Power Inverter. For storage we have two wall-mounted LG Chem Lithium-Ion Home Batteries. The original poles and power lines to bring juice to the farm from the highway cost $22,000 per mile, so slightly more than $66,000. And once I had them put in I discovered the power company owns them, even though I paid for them and they exist on my property. Before converting to off grid life I had to disconnect the lines to my outside power box. Otherwise, the power company would insist upon owning my solar and wind systems, too. If you’re in a position to actually go off the grid and you’re currently hooked into a pubic utility, carefully check the laws of your state. Nefarious forces have stacked going off the grid against us. Nevada has the same regulations regarding power lines you pay for and install on your property (once installed, just like Utah, they are no longer yours) and Arizona’s laws are even more evil. Local power companies will actually charge you for the juice you generate on your own property with your own system because that’s how the laws have been warped.

            And before any JMG nerd engineers try telling me I’m doing it all wrong and cannot possibly generate enough energy to run a small home and farm, fuck you. You have never tried it.

            Obviously, I’m very sensitive about distilling and canning my own energy. 😐

          • The_Wretched

            Good on you and yeah, the power companies have monopoly powers and State backing in most places.

          • Appreciate the warnings. New Mexico is pretty lax about these things yet, fortunately. And at present, we still have good net-metering available. Our current banked surplus is ridonculous.

            Trouble is the power company we’re on, New Mexico Central Electric Co-Op, is a very small, very rural company whose grid really isn’t very reliable. Throughout the day, just watching the UPSs (3x) in my home office, I see voltage vary by up to 10v across a 24hr period, depending on local load in our area. Lightning storm? Be prepared for an outage. I keep a Home Despot bucket filled with our power outage supplies, including USB lights and fully charged power bank devices. Every piece of electronics here is on UPS, even the little Amazon Echo Dot we use in the bedroom for sleep-music.

            Anyway, we do own our solar panels, having paid for them via tax rebates and a 2nd mortgage. NMCEC has no claim or right to them.

          • Lars Littlefield

            You are lucky. In my area the local juice provider is San Juan Rural Electric It’s a cooperative I still own shares in it. But I’d rather sell those shares and have the cash. When I installed the tower and wind generator I was told it wouldn’t work because constant winds of 45 mph would be necessary to crank out 2000 watts. That was the first lie. Even with a light 5 mph breeze enough is generated to recharge what we deplete from one of the lithium batteries. During and after snow storm we have to go out and sweep off the banks of solar collectors. But that’s not a burden or problem. I used worry about blowing out the system by running too many things at once. But its never happened, yet. The weakest link in the whole setup is the electric water heater. Keepin 40 gallons of water hot 24/7 is the dumbest idea ever poorly thought of. Nothing does as well as small on-demand gas hot water units that create as much hot water as you want as you need it.

          • Company we’re working thru now says there are on-demand gas-fired water heaters available. Guy who was here the other day to service our underfloor boiler (or try to…he was missing a pressure relief valve that needs replacing) mentioned in it in passing. Something about, “And we could just put a small unit on the wall for your hot water…”

            We knew about the electric on-demand heaters, but this would be new.

            Given your situation there, have you considered old-style solar hot water augmentation? We had one on our California place in the 90s and when it was sunny (which was most of the time), it cut our electricity use significantly. Heater was electric, but had an extra fitting to circulate water up to the rooftop panels whenever it detected it was warm enough to help. The panels themselves were simple copper plumbing in big black panel boxes w/plexiglass covers.

          • BTW, our current solar panels are in racks on dual-axis tracking poles. Snow falls right off. Handy, plus way more efficient than static rack units…which would indeed need snow sweeping if we had ’em.

          • Lars Littlefield

            That’s what I have. Heavy snow fall still collect on the panels. Not every snowfall, just evert other. .:-)

          • I’ll admit: I did need to get out the panel pole & brush once last winter. But we don’t get that much snow here.

          • Lars Littlefield

            Asa card-carrying old hippie in good standing, I had solar tubs for heatingwater that I got from the Whole Earth catalog back in the 70s. They worked, sort of. The water was never really hot. More extra warm. And only in the non-freezing months. I’ve had the small gas units in my two homes before this final retirement spot. I loved them. But I refuse to have a propane tank brought in just to heat the shower. However, the same individual room air conditioners with remote controls are GREAT! I have one in our bedroom and another hanging in the living room. Whisper quiet, unless you’re outside next to the compressors and fans. But very efficient. Again, I don’t understand the rational of having central air and cooling down an entire house when you’re using only one or two rooms. Even so, I rarely turn them on because my place is at about 6,000 feet altitude, we enjoy light breezes and since I don’t suffer allergies just opening a screened window or door works just as well.

            I do worry that the one or both of the storage batteries might fail by exploding because I don’t believe the lithium technology has matured enough. And rather than use the central heating that is all electric, I prefer to keep the house heated in the cold months with an antique wood burning stove and the three fire places throughout the house.

            My grandparents lived into their 90s chopping and heating/cooking with wood and keeping a small farm. I hope I can pull it off, too. But I’m not interested in living into my 90s.

          • The idea of the solar augmented is the hot water heater *is* electric, but has an add-on that circulates the water from inside the tank up to the roof whenever it’s warm enough to help.

            But the electric part carried most of the load, esp. at night obviously.

          • Lars Littlefield

            LOL/ I have my grandmother’s giant “Majestc” wood-burning stove that she had moved to her basement when she got a new electric range and oven after WWII. The stove has pipes running through the back of it which is where running water was siphoned for heating so everyone could bathe, shower, do laundry, etc. And they used it everyday of the year. So, imagine it’s July and 100+ F outside and to take a shower you have to stoke the wood burning stove in the house. That’s the point where I show what a wuss I really am. But my grandmother wasn’t a complete fool. They had a large pond separated from their house by a nice a nice big pad of lawn. My dad would complain to me how fucking cold that pond was in the summer mornings. He and my uncle were expected to wash and bathe in the pond before breakfast every day in the warmer months. Yikes.

          • Bad Tom

            You are correct about the power company charging you to transmit the power you are selling to it. In Massachusetts, the power companies are claiming it’s unfair! that they can’t charge us more.

            As for not being able to generate enough power– it’s all about the size of the solar / wind farm array, and being able to store the energy. Flywheels and ultracapacitors aren’t ready, but batteries are. Fuel cells are an entirely different deal.

            I’ve wanted solar panels on my house since I was a kid. I priced them out when I was a kid: $1 million plus, back in the late 1960s. Today, it was ZERO with subsidies.
            ——-
            I am an engineer. As we say, Do the Math. You clearly have, and the numbers came out in your favor.

      • SoCalGal20

        It’s not about actually rebuilding the power infrastructure of PR. This is about graft.

        I hope Elon Musk will have an opportunity to get them up and running on solar.

        • And in fact, the absolute worst kind of graft: That which prevents the actual need from being met, because it sucks up all the resources needed for it.

      • Bad Tom

        Musk has actual money and really makes products in factories you can locate on a map.

        • Lars Littlefield

          Whitefish just has a lot of bears.

    • Richard Spencer is from Whitefish I think. There was supposed to be a big neo-Nazi march there against the huge Whitefish Jewish community (probably all 5 people!) called by Andrew Anglin publisher of the Daily Stormer because Richard Spencer’s mother got involved in some civil rights controversy. The town had to revoke the permit because the neo-Nazis could not come up with the $60 march permit fee– but agreed to let the neo Nazis hold a march in the future if they can pay the money and show up. They have not yet. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/05/richard-spencer-whitefish-neo-nazi-march

    • Phillip in L.A.

      Well, I can tell you one thing, Whitefish Energy Holdings, LLC, is almost certainly NOT a “partnership” (if that is its correct legal name)

  • Ben in Oakland

    Whenever they are losing, they whine all about how people are bullied and politically correct. Yet they never e plain how it works.

  • HandsomeMrToad

    He probably fccks kangaroos.

  • SoCalGal20

    OFA is tweeting again. They’re teaming up with Eric Holder’s org to address gerrymandering.

    https://twitter.com/OFA/status/922462237478084608

  • JAKvirginia

    So… let’s see if I understand this. People are voting to deny a right to someone else then lying about it? My, aren’t they the “moral” ones.

  • Leo

    Good news! Kremlin’s INTERPOL infestation’s temporarily backfired.
    https://twitter.com/thehill/status/922658429222686720

  • Lazycrockett
  • Lazycrockett

    So Lawrence and Co. really do not think this tax cut is gonna pass the Senate.

    • Lars Littlefield

      Me too some wow.

    • If it doesn’t it’ll be for the same reason they can’t pass TrumpDontCare: Majority of GOPers will vote for anything their leadership puts in front of them. But some won’t because the tax cut is too egregiously nasty for everyone below the 99% income level, including small businesses like mine. And some won’t support it because whatever’s proposed doesn’t basically eliminate all taxes, kill every single social program (including Medicare/Medicaid & Social Security), skyrocket the defense budget, and explode the deficit enough to make ’em happy.

    • Leo

      They wanted this more than repealing ACA. I think they’ll get it done.

    • DaddyRay

      They are going to rush it through the Senate with no public debate and then once passed send it over to the House where it will pass easily – deficits be damned

      • Lazycrockett

        Corker is totally against raising the Deficit, McCain is playing Drumpf to see if he will attack. Giving cover to non insane republicans. Its not cut and dry as it seems.

  • gaycuckhubby
    • JCF

      🙁

    • Ernest Endevor

      This is why competition destroys mens’ souls.

  • Leo

    Also just gonna leave this here then I’m done for the night.
    https://twitter.com/thehill/status/922644071465791488

    • Lazycrockett

      Hes damn sure to make America stand alone.

    • The whole goddamned world now is like, “Get back to us after your madman is gone. We cannot work or negotiate with you Americans at all now. Bye.”

    • DaddyRay

      Both the countries left happen to be run by dictators

    • KnownDonorDad
      • Phillip in L.A.

        Every single country on the planet besides us, Liberia, and Burma

  • Cuberly Deux

    Um, now Bill’O is blamin god.

    “Bill O’Reilly admits he’s ‘mad at God’ for not protecting him from sexual misconduct allegations”

    https://www.rawstory.com/2017/10/bill-oreilly-admits-hes-mad-at-god-for-not-protecting-him-from-sexual-misconduct-allegations/

    Holy shit is he pissed he was found out. It must have been REALLY bad.

    • safari

      $32M isn’t what you end up negotiating if there wasn’t something nasty.

      • Lazycrockett

        As a reporter said tonight on Chris Hayes, Bill splits a bill not pick up the tab himself. He’s fucking cheap so giving up 32 mil is gonna really rip his hole.

        • MBear

          Rip his hole? So it _was_ gay (guy on guy) porn?!?

      • $32M is when the accuser has iron-clad evidence and letting it go public will end your career forever.

        I really wish someday someone would say, “Fuck the money, I’m doing something right here. We go to trial.”

        • Lazycrockett

          “They included allegations of repeated harassment, a nonconsensual sexual relationship and the sending of gay pornography and other sexually explicit material to her, according to the people briefed on the
          matter.”

          When that is the best the lawyers can work around, then she deserved every penny.

          • Strepsi

            Mm hmm she has a phone-worth of evidence

    • He’s named his teeny-peeny ‘God’? My, that’s some serious compensation.

      • another_steve

        My teeny-peeny is “God’s vengeance.”

        If God loved me, it would work 100 percent, all the time.

      • Cuberly Deux

        His meltdown is uh, something to behold.

        Moses he ain’t.

      • Cuberly Deux

        The accusation that he sent her gay porn. Considering who we’re talking about I wonder if that’s what’s bothering him the most.

    • Ninja0980

      Predators never like it when the light is shined on them.

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      Maybe he should consider the idea that there either is no God or what God there is doesn’t give a shit about him.

      I know some here aren’t too happy I cap on religion but it’s because a lot of the religious honestly seem to think of God as their own personal genie/bodyguard/cheerleader and seem pissed at him when he doesn’t deliver like he’s a malfunctioning appliance rather than the awesome creator of the universe who’s freaking busy making galaxies and multi-verses.

      • Cuberly Deux

        I guess if gawd would have come through Bill’O wouldn’t be out 32Mil.

        An interesting spiritually. Not asking god for the strength to weather trying times. Apparently god was supposed to clear him a path so he could do his dirty unimpeded.

        I think Bill’O has some issues.

        • Skeptical_Inquirer

          I wish someone would ask Bill O if his God has horns, cloven feet and asked him to sign a super duper contract.

          I’m going to be honest. I think women in foreign countries need to be warned about him because I can see him eventually trying to get someone “traditional” he can bully with deportation and other cruel BS to stay in his dungeon.

          • Cuberly Deux

            Maybe an opera company should stage a performance of The Damnation of Faust, set in Fox News HQ.

    • clay

      If only God hadn’t tempted him . . .

  • Ninja0980

    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/c57243975ed7e5cbb88f2c3baa2e3575d23890979d6e31ececa6d1fcf83aa7f8.jpg
    Photo I took today of our tree out front.
    Going to enjoy it’s beauty while it’s last, once the wind and rain storm we’re supposed to get tomorrow comes through, it’ll be history till next year.

  • SoCalGal20

    The DNC might be having problems raising money but the Dem challengers for House seats currently held by Rs are not.

    https://twitter.com/OpenSecretsDC/status/922535846711980032

    • Lazycrockett

      Pelosi was on Chelsea a couple weeks ago and she seemed pretty certain that it is possible for the DEMS to take back the house.

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I think that money should be donated directly to the candidates. I know I may get some pushback but I think the DNC really needs to answer for seriously fucking up a lot.

      • Lazycrockett

        I think the DNC would be more than happy with that.

      • Ninja0980

        The DNC has people on a “unity” committee who go on Faux news and bash Democrats.
        Why should I give any money to them?

  • Hue-Man

    O/T U.S. Ambassador to Canada (finally) takes up her position. BTW, former astronaut, Julie Payette, has been in office since October 2nd.
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/eb49cc2d022133a6cbb97a3f56a1e668312e3f48ffa7606899c1bda4ab1df14a.jpg
    Caption: Ambassador of the United States Kelly Craft, left, shakes hands with Governor General of Canada Julie Payette in Ottawa on Monday Oct. 23, 2017. Craft is among several new diplomats who are formally submitting their credentials to Payette at Rideau Hall. THE CANADIAN PRESS/Adrian Wyld

    • BeaverTales

      I just read that Craft is married to a coal billionaire, and believes “there’s truth in both sides of climate science”. NAFTA is predicated on the fact that climate change is real, so this will get interesting.

      Trump also wants to pull out of NAFTA, so these smiles will soon be frowns.

  • Lazycrockett
    • safari

      I don’t know what writing a “thought” into the constitution means.

      • DaddyRay

        Thought is something Trump will never be accused of

      • Adonisus

        It’s sort of the progression of the ideology of the Communist Party of China. Originally it was Marxism-Leninism, then Marxism-Leninism-Maoism, then Marxism-Leninism-Mao Zedong Thought….and kept going until now it is Marxism-Leninism-Mao Zedong Thought-Deng Xiaoping Theory-Xi Jinping Thought.

    • Adonisus

      This also just in: “Mao Zedong has crawled out of his mausoleum and choked Xi Jinping in his sleep”.

  • safari

    It’s quite blustery out tonight. I like it.

    • Ninja0980

      Same here as well.
      Means there will be a lot of leaves to mulch in the morning.

    • Phil2u

      Tornado watch in central NC.

      • AJ Drew

        It was a stormy night, and morning light reveals a lot of branches and such on the ground but thankfully nothing worse here.

  • Tom Furgas

    It’s called “political correctness” because, well, it IS correct. As opposed to being hateful and denying marriage simply because one finds it distasteful.

    • DaddyRay

      My standard line during the Marriage Equality fight

      When our side wins we celebrate Love and Equality
      When their side wins they celebrate Hate and Discrimination

      • AJ Drew

        Anti-gay-marriage folks somehow ignore the het-marriage 50% divorce rate, and yet think gays willing to join the supposed “building block of society” construct of marriage would be a bad thing. I don’t get it: despite their own failings, you’d think they’d want us supposedly icky promiscuous ones to embrace the ideal of monogamous marriage.

    • I’ve come to the conclusion that when a right-winger makes reference to “politically correct,” it’s actually code for “socially acceptable.”

    • greenmanTN

      If I didn’t already have cats…

  • Skeptical_Inquirer

    OT: Someone mentioned sugar gliders. From what little info I’ve read, they’re very affectionate, but poop a lot, are nocturnal, prefer to have company of others, and do need some special care.

    https://youtu.be/Rz1r0ZFqCuk

  • G’nite kids. See y’all tomorrow.

    • safari

      Sweet dreams

    • Ninja0980

      Night!

  • Lazycrockett

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSjL2alKIbI

    Boom goes the Trevor Dynamite

  • Paula Key

    Go feed the poor and house the street people – that’s the work of Christians and people of good will

  • DaddyRay
  • SoCalGal20

    This thread is awesome. It put a smile on my face. And unlike many twitter threads, the comments are worth reading too. This guy is responding to conservative douchebag claiming nobody goes to the library anymore.

    https://twitter.com/halpernalex/status/922552320403021824

    • safari

      I’ve also read this week that millenials are flocking to newspaper media.

      • SoCalGal20

        Good for them!

      • OdieDenCO

        NYT millennial subscriptions up 110%.

    • whollyfool

      That was great. Pretty telling that the jackass thinks no one goes to the library. Looks like he would benefit from going.

      • SoCalGal20

        He would end up being one of those people complaining about the library carrying unacceptable books or something lbr.

    • AJ Drew

      I am finally fortunate enough to live in a town with more than one library, and the local branch is always crazy busy; rarely a parking spot, and once in, rarely a computer available, and lots going on and lots of folks there.

      • SoCalGal20

        I live in a town with one library and it’s one of the town gathering places. In addition to books they have music performances there, lectures, art shows, etc. It’s a place where you can drop off your absentee ballot during election time. The Friends of the Library runs a great used bookstore there, too! People who don’t go to the library are missing out. It’s about so much more than books.

        Oh, and I took this photo at the library reference desk.

        https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b6b409157ef6bbfbb8b4d0ec56a87b88fd15598c65d8d4808317535789c73ad1.jpg

    • greenmanTN

      Here’s a good article by Matt Baume about how libraries are making Comic Cons possible in smaller towns.

      https://www.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/4xppmb/how-libraries-are-making-comic-conventions-accessible

      • AJ Drew

        Pretty cool… though I suppose it might depend on the average age of the attendees… hmm.

      • Randy503

        Librarians are the unsung heroes in the culture wars. My friend Alex Sanchez wrote books in the mid-90s about gay teenagers and he toured the US giving lectures and talks to small towns and big. Kids all over the country read his books and sent him poignant messages about how much the books helped in accepting themselves and coming out.

        he told me that his books were listed by librarians as highly recommended for school libraries, and so librarians bought the book in droves. They often had to fight local school boards that wanted the book banned, but they stuck to their guns.

        Librarians are fierce! They WANT freedom of thought and fight against censorship in any forms. They want information that will help you, regardless of who you are. I’m not at all surprised that they have a safe space there.

        Librarians are our secret weapon. Don’t tell Tony Perkins, or else he will aim to shut down libraries. But always thank librarians for what they do. Quietly, of course.

        • greenmanTN

          Everything you say is true. When I wasn’t working in bookstores I was working in libraries. After 9/11 when Homeland Security made noises about tracking library book histories every library system of which I’m aware disabled the feature in their circulation software that listed previous patrons who’d checked it out, to protect civil liberties.

          And despite their prim reputation librarians tend to be fierce and funny, with quite a few hellraisers thrown in.

  • Bad Tom

    So Cory Bernardi will only accept a No vote for marriage equality.

    That’s not an election, or even casting a preference vote; that’s a small group dictating what you will do.

  • Barry William Teske

    Oh look!
    Cory Bernardi thinks gay marriage is about him.
    Love doesn’t live in him anymore.
    So as a consequence, he envisions a great many people, huffing and puffing the love of others down, who do see it as part of their lives.
    So no potential consequences in his act of political terrorism is his hearts desire.
    How very lonely.

  • AJ Drew
  • AJ Drew

    Joe finds the most apt images of politicos, USA and across the globe, to post here!

  • BeaverTales

    China’s Xi gains Mao status, adding to power with name in constitution
    https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/chinas-xi-gains-mao-status-adding-to-power-with-name-in-constitution/article36700515/

    China’s Putin? I bet Donnie Trump is jealous

  • Karen

    Google is paying 97$ per hour,with weekly payouts.You can also avail this.
    On tuesday I got a great New Land Rover Range Rover from having earned $11752 this last four weeks..with-out any doubt it’s the most-comfortable job I have ever done .. It sounds unbelievable but you wont forgive yourself if you don’t check it
    !tp53d:
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  • Gerry Fisher

    They’re not lying because of that vague boogeyman “political correctness.” They’re lying because they did something shameful and feel ashamed.

  • Hue-Man

    Bigots are everywhere.

    In a Facebook post Monday, Chilliwack [British Columbia] school trustee Barry Neufeld denounced members of B.C.’s education system as “radical cultural nihilists” for their policies on gender rights and education.

    “At the risk of being labelled a bigoted homophobe, I have to say that I support traditional family values and I agree with the College of Pediatricians [anti-LGBT group] that letting little children choose to change gender is nothing short of child abuse,” wrote Neufeld.

    “If this represents the values of Canadian society, count me out! I belong in a country like Russia or Paraguay, which recently had the guts to stand up to these radical cultural nihilists.”
    Neufeld included this meme with his Facebook post.
    https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/99e57db3ffdd32a3b9a658f2671322c28a17b89ff636dc44adbb855bc56118c0.jpg

    • AJ Drew

      Well, I’m not going to look for that post, but somehow I think if I challenged Barry Neufeld to define each word of that quote “radical cultural nihilists” (and ok, especially “nihilists,”) he and I would start our arguments there.

    • the good old days of the conservative 90s? um, ok. these people are so annoying and never get anything right, even (especially?) when they try to be ironic or humorous.

    • Halou

      “I belong in a country like Russia or Paraguay”

      Great, we can crowdfund a one-way ticket just for him.

    • JCF

      “I belong in a country like Russia”

      до свидания, asshole!

  • Matt G, Rochester

    Seems typical Trumpian propaganda to me. Start calling the results different from the polls before the election. Then it is easier to manipulate the results t be what you want. Regardless of the actual vote, I’m sure it will “fail” when it is tallied.

  • Halou

    If there is a no vote, it will be the indisputable will of the people by democratic process, how dare you oppose this!

    If there is a yes vote, well… It’s just an “opinion survey”. It is non-binding. It wasn’t done through parliament. People are too scared to vote the way I want them to. We’ll have another vote, and another, and another, and will keep doing it until I get what I want. Waaahhhh!!

  • Reality.Bites

    Keep in mind, that this is the “leader” of a one-man fringe party. His opinion is as meaningful as Eugene Delguadio’s

  • Clive Johnson

    “I think there are a great many people who are deeply concerned about the potential consequences of changing the marriage act.”

    But, being a conservative in the standard mold, you don’t learn. You lack the rational resources see through the distorting lens of your beliefs. There are no problems in the US or other countries stemming from same sex marriage. You could, you know, as a basic procedure of inquiry, look around a little and see this. Instead, you must play out your ignorant fears. You must project your false beliefs and not have sufficient self-insight to see that you’re doing so.

    • James

      The “consequences” are that people like him won’t be able to continue to deny that same-sex relationships are equal, at least in the law, and that bugs the shit out of them. They’re also worried that they might not be able to discriminate against same-sex couples in all the ways they might want to. Those are the only things they really fear.

  • Friday

    I think the only problem for this Christianist hater’s wishful thinking is that the results so far aren’t polls *about* the poll, they’re the results actually handed in and tabulated so far. (Unless I have heard wrong.)

    Of course he admits he’ll ignore any result he doesn’t get right and keep defying human rights and popular will to impose his injustice anyway, so why should he care, except for trying to legitimize the spike in hate speech and violence the Christianist hate-campaigns have generated?

  • LaChatSayWha

    O/T but related: A 91-year-old Aboriginal Aussie urges Australians to vote ‘Yes’.

    https://intomore.com/impact/91YearOld-Aboriginal-Man-Comes-Out-in-Support-of-SameSex-Marriage-in-Australia/065097dfa1304deb

    This guy is amazing. He looks and sounds as if he’s a hale and hearty 70 year old. And he gave me a much-needed lift in spirits.

  • wds

    If he’s being that much of a drama queen, then THIS must have really gotten under his skin …LOL ( there’s a great B’way Bares clip in the side menu! LOLOL)
    https://youtu.be/C9g9RhnbIUA