Conservatives Ponder Possibility Of “President Pence”

Politico reports:

Not since the release of the Access Hollywood tape, in which Donald Trump bragged about groping women by the genitals, have some conservatives thought so seriously, if a bit wistfully, about two words: President Pence.

The scandals clouding Trump’s presidency — including, most recently, his firing of FBI Director James Comey, his alleged leak of classified information to Russian officials, and reports that he urged Comey to drop an investigation into a top aide — have raised once more the possibility that Trump could be pushed aside and replaced by Vice President Mike Pence.

“If what the [New York Times] reported is true, Pence is probably rehearsing,” one House Republican who asked not to be named quipped Wednesday. “It’s just like Nixon. From the standpoint that it’s never the underlying issue, it is always the cover-up.”

Erick Erickson, a conservative pundit who was a strong Never Trumper but then pledged to give the president a chance, wrote on Wednesday that Republicans should abandon the president because they “have no need for him with Mike Pence in the wings.”

There’s lots more rumbling at the link.

  • Randy Ellicott

    The one and only reservation I have about removing trump is this a&&hat….

  • IAMBOWLINGGREEN
    • The New Paige Turner™

      Indeed

    • Silver Badger

      I’m torn. Should we learn from history or should we repeat it.

      • David Walker

        We’ll repeat it and repeat it and repeat it again. Some lessons are never learned.

        • Silver Badger

          Well, we have the pissant, Pence, Ryan, Tillerson, Sessions, I at least hope we rinse before repeating.

          • David Walker

            I think Reince is a bad as any of them.

      • AJ Drew

        based on THAT image? Um… that weapon doesn’t look too stabby, so I’ll go for being in-between. Ohhhh… you meant something else… the whole “Et tu” thing is bad.

        • Silver Badger

          I was just asking a simple question. I don’t particularly want anything. Or at least I’d never admit it in print!

          • AJ Drew

            Who da fook are you? Did that Ransom-thingy malware infect your computer… like it did mine?

          • Silver Badger

            No. I’m just a simple country boy from Denver. Ahem, make the country person.

        • northern_neighbour

          Paging Dr. Ben Carson, … Paging Dr. Carson ….

      • Todd20036

        Ive been to lots of orgies. Both learning from and repeating history has its perks

  • Butch

    I hate Pence almost as much as I hate Trump. His theocratic views are dangerous and even though he’s a dunce he knows the legislative process, and he’s already proven what he’ll do with LGTB issues. In a way he’s almost worse.

  • skyweaver

    Pence creeps me out in an entirely different way than Trump. Instead of everyone fighting Narcissistic Personality Disorder we’ll be fighting Institutional Misogyny. I honestly don’t know which is worse.

    • Hue-Man

      Pence has so many groups on his hate list that Institutional Misanthropy might be more accurate.

  • That_Looks_Delicious
    • safari

      They claimed that because he’s doing it voluntarily, it didn’t need his signature. They did back down, though.

      • That_Looks_Delicious

        Remember when we had presidents for whom these things were never an issue? Good times.

  • KCMC
  • vorpal 😼

    From an LGBT rights perspective, Pence would be a far, far worse president.

    As much as I dislike Ivanka, at least she does in a small part keep Trump from completely throwing us under the bus.

    • netxtown

      Pence got away with a lot of his holy roller crap because it was holy roller indiana. His anti-gay, jeebus-first corn-holery won’t fly at the national level.

      • Tawreos

        With the GOP in control of congress it just might.

      • pj

        it didnt fly in indiana either. they were glad to be rid of him.

    • skyweaver

      I agree. As odious as Trump is, his LGBT rhetoric comes from just wanting to impress his base by reflecting their hatred. I honestly don’t think he gives a shit. But Pence does, in a big big way

    • KCMC
      • AJ Drew

        is that early animation, puppetry, taxidermy, or some ewww combination of all of those?

        • KCMC

          Yes.

  • safari

    Pence is VP because Bannon told Donald his plane broke (it hadn’t) and that he should spend more time with the govenor.

  • another_steve

    Apart from the possibility of impeachment (which would take forever), Trump may simply say “fuck this shit” and resign.

    “For the good of the nation,” of course. /snark

    He’s probably not making a 16th of the money he was making as a fully-employed criminal businessman. This “presidency thingy” is impeding his lifestyle.

    • safari

      He’s giving a speech on moderating Islam in Saudi Arabia that is written by the architect of the Muslim ban. I don’t know if he’ll last through his trip.

      • another_steve

        “There’s my Muslims over there! I love my Muslims!”

      • Butch

        You’re just trying to cheer me up.

      • Skokieguy [Larry]

        Just as he trolls the left, I believe this is intentional. Maybe a shoe will get thrown, some Muslims (and most likely the more extreme) may riot in the streets, validating the Muslim = violence = terrorist narrative that Trump has promoted and makes his base salivate.

        • netxtown

          I’m counting on ‘shoe’ being plural……LOTS of plural…

          • Silver Badger

            Do they have stiletto heels over there? Would they like some?

      • That_Looks_Delicious
    • Natty Enquirer

      I can’t see Trump resigning. That would be losing.

      • GeneInSJ

        No, he’ll spin it to blame everyone else.

      • That_Looks_Delicious

        The ghost writer for his “Art of the Deal” book, who spent a lot of time with Trump, says just the opposite. He thinks he will resign precisely to avoid impeachment, because that to him would be “losing” whereas he could make resigning look (in his own mind anyways) like it would be his choice.

    • Steve Teeter

      Even if he does a “fuck this shit,” I don’t think he can go back. Suppose he tried to go back to the real estate mogul thing? You need banks for that, and there isn’t a bank in the world that would touch him now. No, he’d try to go back to those rallies with adoring crowds, saying over and over how he got a bum deal, but having let down his base so completely I don’t think he’d get any crowds. There’s just nothing for him if he resigns. He might even wind up poor. (By his standards.)

      • another_steve

        American Capitalism is amoral. Not “immoral,” amoral.

        Trump would do just fine were he to return to the marketplace.

  • Silver Badger

    We are in the same situation we had with Bush II. As bad as he was, at least he wasn’t Cheney.

  • Lazycrockett

    Pence is just as guilty as Drumpf when it comes to the Flynn/Russia ties.

  • Tawreos

    Well if the investigations keep going, maybe we can clear out a whole bunch of top tier GOP people, Pence included.

    • My thought as well. Pence and Ryan are just as complicit as Trump in this.

      • Ben in Oakland

        Edited.

      • Todd20036

        I actually would be ok with President Hatch

        • Beagle

          As would I, but only in the sense of “the other options are even worse.”

    • AJ Drew

      There ain’t many top-tier folks cuz DT hasn’t appointed them, so, easy targets!

  • james1200

    We can NOT have Mike “Sharia” Pence along with a GOP Congress; it’ll be The Handmaid’s Tale but for real. They WILL get their extremist agenda through, including the Dominionist stuff, if Tweetolini resigns. As opposed to right now, where the virus that is Trump has completely paralyzed DC and especially his own party. They won’t be able to get shit thru with Trump (I doubt they’ll get even the budget thru.) We can’t let Trump leave, not until the Dems have had a chance to take the House back so we can keep a check on Pence’s insanity. This is a fucking nightmare.

    We need to figure out a way to downplay talk of impeachment and seriously figure out a way to prop up Twitler.

    • Ragnar Lothbrok

      It IS nightmare James. Good thing we have cool dogs :

      https://twitter.com/AnimalsNonstop/status/865385646445256704

      • james1200

        How sad is it when a dog has a more important job than you do. Damn.

        • David Walker

          This is one they can’t blame on illegal immigrants and/or Muslims, though.

        • sword

          Your job is lower than chasing birds?

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    • Gay Fordham Prep Grad

      There is something to be said for both arguments. But Trump is a fiasco for the GOP and once the BIG MONEY that props that party up decides they have had enough of T, then out he shall be tossed…and there is nothing any of us peons can do to stop it.

    • AJ Drew

      ok, You are right to fear Pence, but at least we’d know what to expect from him and that’d be easier to resist than this current “who knows what’s next?,” debacle. And if, IF, DT gets outed (or resigns… perhaps more likely,) Pence will have to walk back his real stance for appearance-sake if nothing else. I welcome the gamble of Pence if it means DT is gone.

      • FAEN

        I agree. His crazy is within the parameters we understand.

        In addition, and I’ve said this before, if Cheeto resigns or is forced out Pence will be a lame duck of sorts, inheriting a party damaged and weakened by scandal.

      • I would prefer to wait until after the new Congress starts work in 2019 for ANY impeachments – and I would hope there is enough evidence to have both Trump and Pence impeached. A Democratic Majority Congress would have a Speaker who would likely fill the presidency well enough – so I would urge Democrats to soft-pedal and delay on the impeachment thing (i.e., if the GOP wants to do it before the 2018 elections, Democrats in the House should NOT cooperate)

        In 2019, though, impeaching both Trump and Pence might be possible – there is already evidence out there sufficient for both of them to go down. It is just a matter of waiting.

        • AJ Drew

          Will anyone (even DT) be impeached? Probably not, honestly. Can shaming and fear of not being re-elected make them all resign? Possibly. 2018 is key for ALL OF US to vote, and there are more local elections before then. I’m there… will my neighbors be? I actually am chatty with my neighbors, and they are all (now) anti-GOP. WIll it play out at the polls locally and nationally in 2018? We’ll see. An actual (deserved) impeachment or criminal proceeding would move that along …

      • Queequeg

        I agree with you. Trump is making the country a world wide laughing stock. Pence is a religious extremist, but I’m not sure how far he’d get with that.

    • Well this is what happens when you side with NeoCons (Never Trumpers). It’s Bush/Cheney all over again.

    • Nic Peterson

      Pence is just as dirty and needs to be taken out at the same time. That leaves us with Ryan, which isn’t much better.

    • Jerry

      He is also complicit in all of the scandals, and should also be out the door when Trump goes.

      • james1200

        There’s no way in hell they’ll both be removed. I wish it could be so but there’s no way.

        • Jerry

          There’s plenty of evidence that Pence lied repeatedly about Flynn, and Pence had his own Russian problems, so I think it would be good to go after them simultaneously.

      • The Sentinel

        Joy Reid thinks so and she knows her shit. http://bit.ly/2rAjcqa

      • JCF
    • Chucktech

      If Trump’s ultimate fate is impeachment, you can rest assured that the gears of the machinery that would make impeachment happy will almost assuredly grind so slowly that we’ll see the 2018 election first.

      • Queequeg

        I think you are corect. Even the Chicago Tribune had an opinion piece suggesting that we should move slowly toward impeachment. Meanwhile not much is getting done, which is good, in this case.

    • I recommend impeaching both

      • JCF

        Seconded!

    • Gerry Fisher

      I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect this to unfold as neatly as you want it to. (And I totally get why you want it that way.) I think that the best we can do is to expose Pence at the same time we’re exposing Trump. Pence is guilty, too. Nixon didn’t have an innocent, untouchable VP either (though it’s handy to have the VP implode before the president).

  • Mike C

    This is exactly why Pence was selected for Trump (from a pile of stuff) because it was always clear he wasn’t going to be Trump’s first choice. Remember how they had to stall his jet on the tarmac?

  • safari

    I’m worried how easily voters will accept Pence in the midwest. My mother liked him “because he is quiet”. I had to correct her.

    • james1200

      Me too. He terrifies me. He’ll be able to sell quite competence, especially coming after the Orange Twat currently in charge.

      • PickyPecker

        and there will be the throngs of loud voices saying GIVE HIM A CHANCE!!!

        • Chucktech

          And again, my refrain is “Just like you gave Obama.”

      • Vista-Cruiser

        Barack Obama was quiet competence. Mike Pence is quiet malice.

      • Gerry Fisher

        If you talk to people in Indiana, they’d say “not for long (will he be able to sell quiet competence.” That’s why it’s important to start tying him to Trump with a tightly locked chain. For example, he knew about Flynn.

    • Chucktech

      The midwest is (largely) responsible for giving us Trump in the first place.

  • Gustav2

    They are pushing this shit hard. Pence was out of the loop, he didn’t know all the awful things with Russia, he was the head of the transition team and new nothing!

    Cut the crap, all they want is lower taxes, to kill Obamacare and judicial appointments. It doesn’t matter who is POTUS.

    • That_Looks_Delicious

      There have been a whole lot of “articles” to that effect in the last couple days. The establishment GOP has given up on Trump and decided to push the Pence is innocent narrative.

  • PickyPecker

    Why does he always have that expression on his face….like he just crapped by accident on the priceless oriental rug and is awaiting punishment. sheeesh.

    • safari

      He’s been trained well by mother.

      • David Walker

        By which you mean his wife.

        • Silver Badger

          Would that make her his mother/wife?

        • Butch

          According to news accounts, he refers to his wife as “mother” in conversation.

          • AJ Drew

            Didn’t someone else who was POTUS do that? Hmm, he must be Presidential, then!

      • james1200

        Mommy made him wear a diaper until he was 18, didn’t she? She probably changed him every night and powdered his white ass, too. And I’ll bet his wife continues the tradition.

        No judgment!

    • Silver Badger

      More like he’s hoping the current victim’s innocence isn’t proven until after the execution.

    • Tawreos

      TO me, he always looks like he has bad news for you and he can’t wait to tell you about it.

    • netxtown

      he crapped alrighty – but it was while he was wearing his sheep outfit.

    • Bungee

      He just wants you to think it was an accident.

      ♫ Poops, I did it again… ♫

    • Jon Doh

      Like he’s waiting for mother to hurry up with that strap on.

      • northern_neighbour

        Wow … so she would therefore be a motherfucker in the active role.

    • Cuberly

      That’s his O mommy face.

    • Gustav2

      It is a demonstration of the prayerful Midwestern pain of having to deal with the real world.

      • safari

        You have to remember, we midwesterns deal with the world via “midwestern nice” — our reactions can be subtle.
        https://www.thrillist.com/lifestyle/nation/my-life-living-midwestern-nice

        • Gustav2

          Yes, as a Midwestern pastor’s kid we called it “church face.”

          • safari

            It can be exhausting.

          • Gustav2

            I’m not kidding, my older brothers would tell me to put on my ‘church face’ every time they thought I was looking too expressive (AKA sissy)

            But I use it often for many, many people

          • AJ Drew

            “trying not to fart” face makes you look hetero? Heh!

          • Gustav2

            Yes, it is a ‘serious’ look.

          • Ben in Oakland

            Gives a whole new meaning to “butts in the pews.”

    • Yalma Cuder-Zicci

      He always reminds me of Ricky Schroder in “The Champ”.

  • David Walker

    Maybe, just maybe, they should watch a little Rachel before they go whole-hog on Pence, or at least have “their people” research her sources. He ain’t exactly pure as the driven snow.

    • Tawreos

      in the GOP he is as pure as they want him to be. He looks clean, but they have enough dirt on him to keep him in line.

    • Prost Seattle

      I always say I’m as pure as the driven snow. In a New York gutter, but was driven hard and put away slushy!

      • David Walker

        !!

  • MBear

    >gag<

  • Ragnar Lothbrok

    Gross! What a horrible thought. Would his wife be called ” First Mother ” ??

  • Max_1

    Mike Pence, the man who claimed he was lied to…
    … Lied to the American public about backing TREASON.

  • j.martindale

    I think tRump is such a danger to world order, I would rather have to re-fight our LGBT battles than see the chaos this incompetent could wreak on us. Also, keep in mind that Pence backed off the religious freedom act in Indiana. His christofascist tendencies were held in check at least that once.

  • Gregory Phillips

    Pence terrifies me more than tRUMP ……. “Religious Liberty” …. frightening

    • netxtown

      The incredible folks at ACLU know how to put them in their place….
      Just be prepared to endearingly support them (ACLU)

  • Cuberly

    There are no good options. Even if Trump stays the zealots are going to start applying the screws to Hair Furor to push their hate bills. Ivanka is no fucking saint, she’s not out to save us, not by a long shot. And, considering Donnie’s efficacy on getting anything done is lagging I’d be shocked if he doesn’t sign off on some right-wing bill that’s against us, just to show he’s doing something.

    I will say one thing, I think Donnie is more dangerous over the long term. Not only for the US but for the world in general.

  • MassageBear
    • KCMC

      love this. love Vincente. so. hard.

    • Silver Badger

      That’s too good to be true. Maybe we should take up an international collection, though.

    • ted-

      They have a hot president!

  • MikeBx2

    I don’t know why the article uses words like “far-fetched” and “unlikely” regarding Trump being removed from office. Trump is NEVER GOING TO CHANGE. The scandals will only grow, multiply and intensify. If Republicans don’t do the right thing, Democrats will after the 2018 election. Nothing far-fetched or unlikely about that.

    • safari

      Lindsey Graham wants to renew investigations into Hillary’s email in Congress because the FBI is taking charge of Russia/Donald. They will do anything to distract.

      • MikeBx2

        Lindsey Graham is a moron.

  • DisT

    Maybe it was scheming-Pence who’s been spilling the beans from the White House all these times.

    Expect a torrent of “Religious Liberty” bills one Pence is in office.

    • That_Looks_Delicious

      The #1 suspect for the leaks among the Breitbarters is still Priebus. They really want him gone.

  • PickyPecker
  • bkmn

    President Pence is precisely why we need to work our asses off to try to take back control of the House and Senate. No one among us will do well under a President Pence.

  • William

    It there ever was a punchable face. We could pay off the national debt. Three punches for a dollar.

    • Ross

      Brilliant idea! And I have $20 in my wallet.

      • William

        Put those brass knuckles away!

  • Last night it looked like Rachel Maddow was shifting her sights to Pence in preparation for such an event.

  • sfjohn

    He’s neck deep in this shit,too. Not gonna happen

  • Hank

    Pence KNEW about Flynn and most probably, the Collusion with the Russians and their influence on the election. Let us hope, that Mueller gets him, as well!!!

  • geoffalnutt

    Pence is most likely going down, too. So is Ryan. It’s just a matter of ‘when’.

    • Gay Fordham Prep Grad

      That would give some credence to the blog report that Orrin Hatch (as #4 in the lineup) is now getting NSA briefings.

    • JWC

      thats why the story that orin Hatch has been considered the first 5 were all complicit

  • JWC

    With the small little aside Pence is as complicit as Trump He has been down the rabitt hole every step of the way Wake up GOP this ship has sailed

  • Capritaur
    • netxtown
      • netxtown

        and also notice –
        no plate
        no silverware
        no napkin

        why…its like she just ain’t there!

        • That_Looks_Delicious

          Photographic proof! Call Ghost Hunters.

        • grada3784

          We see dead people!!!

      • Treant

        Please…somebody…photoshop out her reflection in the mirror.

      • safari

        Spooky

        • Paula Key

          Would somebody cover that Christian amount of flesh above the knee?

      • netxtown

        and why does it appear the wifey’s bangs start at the back of her head? and what the hell are those lobes on either side?

  • Cuberly
  • RJ Bone

    It’ll be worse for the community, for sure. He’ll seem put together and nice – but that is usually what the absolutely evil asshole with no compassion or conscience looks like as they’re filleting you with a rusty knife.

    Disturbingly it’ll still be mildly better than Drumpf.

  • liondon#iamnotatraitor

    Mike ” I did not cause an HIV pandemic” Pence would be a nightmare for our country… too many people get goo-goo eyes for the grandpa shtick… but he is a true believer in all this evangelical horseshit… very dangerous.

  • Bryan

    “While Pence may not be as commanding a figure in Trump’s White House as Dick Cheney was in George W. Bush’s, Trump has leaned on him heavily.

    “Lobbyists who set up meetings between Pence and their clients must warn them that the vice president may be an hour and a half late or have to leave after 10 minutes because Trump is constantly calling him into the Oval Office to confer with him, according to one Republican lobbyist.”

    But he was kept in the dark about Mike Flynn.

    Right.

  • Goggles

    Pence is far, far worse. All the terrible policies of Trump and the GOP, minus even the veneer of having to maintain any of Trump’s campaign promises, and plus a modicum of competency. Also, despite what you might have read on Twitter, no, Pence would not be impeached along with Trump. Trump deals far more damage to
    Republican prospects in future elections.

    All those mainstream media outlets currently offering token resistance don’t disagree with Republican policies, they only take offense at Trump’s lack of decorum and eschewal of norms. Facing Pence they would fucking crumble and lick boot. Under a fake return to normalcy Dem reps and senators would “bipartisanship” and “confirmed adult in the room” this country into a christofascist hell in no time at all.

    • Paula Key

      “I am a Christian first, then a Republican American.” (Or words to that affect).

  • sword

    Pence is ‘second-liar-in-chief’ at the White House. He was the head of the transition team. At that time, Gen Flynn told the transition team that he was also working for the Turkish government. He was still hired. Recently, Pence said he only knew about it a few days before. Either he is lying (quite common in the WH) or he is incompetent…hiring people known to be working for foreign governments.

  • juanjo54

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-JGINJGxlE
    Dice are rolling , knives are out

  • Michael

    Pence is damaged goods. Based on what has been reported, his handling of the transition regarding Flynn was either monumentally inept or complicit.

    • Based on Pence’s statements, behavior and obviously glib ability to tell baldfaced lies in the most aggrieved and patronizing tone possible, my money is on ‘complicit.’

    • The Professor

      Lord no then we get President Ryan!!

      • -M-

        I think he’s even less popular with the dumb caucus than Trump or Pence.

      • The_Wretched

        Ryan would resign or not take it. They don’t have another person who can or would lead in the House.

  • May Pence share the fate of Spiro Agnew, but without giving Donnie enough time to appoint someone else to fill his place.

    • The_Wretched

      As a headless body on a futuristic cartoon?

      • I was thinking of “resigning in disgrace” but love the Futurama reference!

  • Jerry Kott

    That faux Piety face is begging for a Pie !

    • alguien

      or a dick

  • marshlc

    No, no, not good. We need Trump to stay in charge until just before an election, as he’s happily destroying the Republican Party.

    Pence can masquerade as a sane adult well enough to fool those who just vote Republican reflexively.

    • Hank

      Hair Drumpf is too Narcissistic and Self-Absorbed to resign. So, he will be around, at least for the mid-terms in ’18. Hopefully, we can reclaim the House… at least!!!

      • Paula Key

        I have this thought – Trump does not want to be President. His ego got him the job – numero uno. It’s too hard for him – he’ll resign and go back to being the bully without restraints.

        • Hank

          I agree with you, to some degree. He never thought he would get the nomination nor the election It was all a ploy for Free Advertising and improving his “brand” so he could make more $$$ However, his ego would never let him quit, no matter how over his head he is in the job.

  • The Professor

    President Pence would be far worse for the gay community than Trump. Though we may live to fight him of course. With Trump who knows?

  • -M-

    Let me fix that,

    …acknowledged leak -without getting anything for the U.S. in return- of highly classified intelligence, provided by an ally’s valuable & vulnerable asset, to Russian officials whose military and diplomatic goals in the region are opposed to ours.

    • -M-

      And Erickson is a tool.

  • Vinnie NYC

    That was the plan from the beginning

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    Thing is, a president Pence would also come under investigation, would he not?

    • JWC

      Just depends how Ryan and Turtle adjust the scale but yes he is complicit as hell and they all know it

  • joeintexas

    This is exactly why I’ve never promoted impeach him, Pence is far more dangerous. Keep the idiot and ride it out four years rather than get President the republican congress desperately wants.

  • Steven B

    Is anyone taking bets on whether or not Pence and Ryan will get tangled up in Mueller’s investigation?

    • DrRobY

      Both! . . . Which means . . . President Hatch

    • -M-

      Pence definitely.

  • danolgb

    My hunch is Pence would resign first anyway. Much like what happened under Nixon.

  • Paula Key

    In 1991, Karen (Pence’s wife) wrote a letter to the editor in the Indianapolis Star, expressing her dismay about an article that ran in the paper’s “Children’s Express” section. She claimed it “encourages children to think they’re gay or lesbian if they have a close relationship with a child of the same sex” or admire a teacher of the same gender, according to the Washington Post. “I only pray that most parents were able to intercept your article before their children were encouraged to call the Gay/Lesbian Youth Hotline, which encourages them to ‘accept their homosexuality’ instead of reassuring them that they are not,” she wrote.

  • Halou

    Mike Pence is pretty deep in the scandal as well, if he takes the office after Trump he might beat William Henry Harrison for the shortest presidency in American history.

  • Mike

    Be careful what you wish for. Churchy McGee Pence, grown-up Davey of Davey and Goliath, is worse than Trump.

  • MichaelJ

    Leaving aside the question of whether Pence will also have to leave office because of an obstruction of justice scandal that manages to ensnare Trump, I believe having Pence as President is far preferable to having Trump remain in office, particularly if Trump were to be removed from office against his own will, whether through impeachment or forced to resign.

    Trump is an asset to Republicans because he has a loyal following and can convince large numbers of Americans to support a far-right political agenda. They would lose that asset even if Trump were simply to disappear. Pence cannot replace Trump in that regard. If Trump leaves office disgraced in the eyes of most American (not in the eyes of his loyal supporters of course), there will be real damage to Republicans and their political agenda. And if Republicans have anything to do with getting Trump out of office, you can be sure that the vindictive Trump would probably attack Republican Party leadership with as much venom as he spits at anyone else.

    I can think of three other reasons – one pragmatic, two more conjecture – of the importance of having Trump removed from office even if Pence becomes President. 1) We’d all rest easier knowing that an unstable hyper-egoist was nowhere near the nuclear “football.”

    2) Any investigation that uncovers facts that Trump, the chronic liar, continues to deny (and he would go down not admitting any truth he doesn’t like, let alone any guilt) it would counter one of the worst traits in American culture, willful ignorance, which Trump epitomizes.

    3) It would be great if Trump is somehow punished through impeachment, and not just because it would be so satisfying to see the bully get punished. Trump has more blatantly than anyone else disrespected any notion of how democracy works and flouted all norms of acceptable behavior. Sure, democratically elected governments all over the world have always compromised the ideals of democracy and in practice have often been corrupted, so having politicians follow norms of acceptable behavior only does so much. But I believe it would be good to reinforce the norms. If what comes out of an investigation is that Trump has far more tie to Russian investors that he would ever admit, some people will think twice about voting for someone who won’t release his tax returns. It would be good to re-establish that office holders should not use their positions to make money by not allowing Trump to do so; it would be better yet to punish him for doing do. Allowing Trump to continue holding office would not bold well for the future of any measure of democracy in the US.

  • Happy_Housewife

    It’s a shame Leslie Nielsen is not longer with us…..

  • Marti386

    I can put up with Pence for now. He’s an assh0le, but he’s at least smarter than Trump.