Democrats Question Trump’s Mental Health

The Hill reports:

A growing number of Democrats are openly questioning President Trump’s mental health. Rep. Earl Blumenauer (D-Ore.) in a floor speech this week called for a review of the Constitution’s procedures for removing a president. He warned the 25th Amendment of the Constitution falls short when it comes to mental or emotional fitness for office.

Sen. Al Franken (D-Minn.) during a weekend interview with CNN’s “State of the Union” said that “a few” Republican colleagues have expressed concern to him about Trump’s mental health. And Rep. Ted Lieu (D-Calif.) plans to introduce legislation that would require the presence of a psychiatrist or psychologist in the White House.

The Democrats justify their questions by pointing to Trump’s habit of making demonstrably false claims. At a press conference Thursday, he said he’d had the biggest Electoral College win since President Ronald Reagan, for example, when his margin was lower than either of President Obama’s wins.

Blumenauer told The Hill he started taking another look at the 25th Amendment because Trump had casually repeated easily disproven claims, such as stating that it wasn’t raining during his speech on Inauguration Day when it was.

The Hill also points out this petition.

  • Joe in PA

    Pffft…. The Democrats justify their questions by pointing to Trump’s habit of making demonstrably false claims….

    If that wasn’t so pathetic it would be funny.

  • AtticusP
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  • Andy King

    Everything about Trump falls apart under critical inspection, so I wonder what’s going to happen if his mental health is actually evaluated.

    • Gerry Fisher

      When I used to diagnose in a community mental health clinic years ago, the suggestion was, in general, don’t diagnose personality disorders after only one visit, one diagnostic session. The idea was that personality disorders need to play out over time, showing that they are ingrained in the person’s character and not due to some temporary circumstance. Instead, we were supposed to chart things such as “r/o Narcissistic Personality Disorder” (“we think it’s there, but it has yet to be ‘ruled out'”) or “Narcissistic traits.” I think we could make an exception this one time, though.

      (We had this one clinician who was able to nail personality disorders with a single meeting with alarming consistency. She had a great feel for it.)

      • bzrd

        We’ve had “meeting after meeting” with BLOTUS for 15 months repeatedly lying to the point of fact check saying he was correct 4% of the time. His rants to beat up protesters, “I’ll pay the legal bills,” saying Mexicans are rapists, implying all Muslims are terrorists and fomenting hatred of anyone not white is sick, and didn’t take a person with a degree to tell most of us here on JMG that he is mentally ill.

      • NancyP

        Well, Trump has been in the public eye for decades, and plenty of observers have noted his off the charts narcissism.

  • Skokieguy [Larry]

    And while Trump plays the clown, our country is being dismantled. We’ve already all heard of the new law allowing coal plant sludge to be dumped in rivers? We’ve already heard of the disbanding of the committee the monitors election machine integrity being disbanded? Well yesterday, “….Congress took its first step toward repealing a ban on shooting wolves and bears from airplanes, along with other hunting activities that were halted by the Obama administration, across large wildlife refuges in Alaska….The banned activities on Alaska’s wildlife refuges included hunting tactics common elsewhere in Alaska and the US, but nevertheless troubling to wildlife advocates: baiting brown bears to draw them to hunters and shooting them; shooting bears ensnared in traps; and shooting bears and wolves in their dens with their cubs or pups.

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/dinograndoni/alaska-hunting-bear-wolf-airplanes?utm_term=.wuw98ReX0#.dfmNOD4V0

    Trump will be forced out to avoid tainting the midterm elections, but by the time his is, our country will be unrecognizable. And with more voting restrictions enacted Crosscheck quietly removing more and more voters and any oversight into elections dismantled, the cons are positioning themselves for a permanent dynasty.

    We do not have fair and democratic elections and its only getting worse. I don’t think its likely, but I really would like the UN to oversee US elections.

  • gaymex1

    Like we all haven’t been saying that since his campaign began.

  • Michael R

    Who is mind numbingly incompetent Donald ?

    https://s4.postimg.org/3xchky0nx/NOTME_not_me.jpg

  • Boreal
    • SO scary and so relevant…

    • karmanot

      WIN!

  • Blake Mason
    • crewman

      Uranium is that green thing that jumps in your pocket every day on your way home.

    • Halou

      Picture doesn’t convey the condescending tone that Trump used when talking to the reporter.

      • Acronym Jim

        “And the tone. You know tone. The tone is just pure hatred.”

        Donnie, projectile projecting onto the press corp at his blather conference.

        • Kenster999

          So much projecting! Projectile vomiting…

    • Cuberly

      The line he said, a little afterwards. “An apocalypse like no other.”

      He’s so addicted to his bullshitting superlatives he doesn’t even know when he’s being dumb-ass redundant.

  • Rex

    He fabricated the truth all through his campaign, and just now they’re questioning his mental health.
    Trump polled his imaginary friends and they all told him he was fine.

    • (((GC)))

      http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/41890-trump-accuses-media-of-not-reporting-voices-he-hears-in-head

      Andy Borowitz’s satire in The New Yorker:

      In a blistering attack on the media, President Trump said on Monday that the press has consistently refused to report the voices he hears in his head every day.

      Trump praised the “really terrific information” he gets from the voices, which often speak to him when he is roaming the White House in his bathrobe in the middle of the night.

      “They tell me that I won by the most votes ever and had the biggest Inauguration crowd ever,” Trump said. “These are fantastic voices and they’re doing a great job.”

      Trump said the refusal to report what the voices tell him makes the media “the most dishonest people on earth.”
      […]

  • Michael R

    Under all this Trump isn’t here to work , he just wants to
    be recognized for having won the election .

    Trump’s relationship with Marla Maples sounds just like his politcal ambition …

    ‘I was bored when she was walking down the aisle’, Trump later told a writer. ‘I kept thinking, ‘What the hell am I doing here’.

    ‘For him the getting was everything’

    • BearEyes

      he just wants the sash and crown.

      • Earl

        I can understand that. But that’s why we have those nice Drag Balls, and Mr Leather events. Isn’t it? 🙂

    • Hunter M

      Several people said that long before the election. I believed them then. He’s all about the challenge and has zero follow through. He’ll basically let his minions run things because he’s already “down the aisle”.

      • clay

        (except he hasn’t brought in enough minions, this time– the Executive branch is significantly short on appointees)

    • Halou

      I think there were stories about how his father never thought much of him, what with his constant business failures and bankruptcies always having to get bailed out. This is one big validation thing for him. “See, daddy. Didn’t I do well.”

  • Michael McReavy
    • Earl

      While I understood his point, I also think that Trump’s mental state – whatever the fuck it is – is too unstable to allow him to continue in his present job.

      It’s not just a threat to your nation. You’re becoming a threat to the rest of the world with that bozo in office.

      • Michael McReavy

        He’s obnoxious, erratic, narcissistic, etc. but to suggest he’s mentally ill is false and unnecessary labelling. There are enough reasons to oppose him and his actions on political grounds.

        • Earl

          I said he was mentally unstable. And he is. That’s not an illness.

          And yes, there are more than enough reasons to impeach him on political grounds, his authoritarianism alone should have done it.

          • Gerry Fisher

            He’s ill. Let’s not beat around the bush. “Unstable” usually means “someone who’s about to lapse into a diagnosable mental illness” or “someone with a mental illness who is decompensating” (which means that a chronic mental illness is re-entering an acute phase, causing problems in functioning, whereas they had been stable, often on meds, beforehand).

        • Gerry Fisher

          >but to suggest he’s mentally ill is false and unnecessary labelling.

          No it’s not. Narcissistic Personality Disorder is a mental illness found in the diagnostic manual. Just because the general public has a narrow–and often incorrect–idea about what constitutes mental illness does not mean that Trump isn’t mentally ill. Glance at the size of the diagnostic manual; there’s a heck of a lot more in there than “Schizophrenia with delusions” and “Delusional Disorder” (and Major Depression and Biploar Disorder).

          • Michael McReavy

            As Allen Francis – he’s the man who wrote the criteria in the DSM IV that define narcissistic personality disorder – noted in his letter to the NYT, Trump is not mentally ill “because he does not suffer from the distress and impairment required to diagnose mental disorder”. I would suggest that we in the gay community should know better than to label our political opponents as mentally ill. It was not so long ago that we were regarded as obviously sick and mentally ill and in need of treatment.

          • stuckinthewoods

            Disagree. Labeling a diverse group as mentally ill is not the same as questioning the behavior of a single individual who cannot distinguish observable reality.

          • Michael McReavy

            Individuals carrying the same diagnosis of a mental illness are at the same time a diverse group. For example, no two people afflicted with schizophrenia are alike. It’s a question of do they meet the established criteria for the disease. You might suggest loosening up those criteria but then you can get into the problem of diagnostic inflation. You suggest that Trump cannot distinguish what is real from what isn’t. Can’t distinguish or doesn’t want to distinguish?

          • David L. Caster

            Trump is habituated to exaggeration because he has made a career as a virtual carnival barker for his enterprises. This has made him wealthy and delivered to him a drug like euphoria he craves. Trump is addicted to that thrill as clearly evinced by his reaction after yesterday’s press conference: what the rest of us saw as a meltdown he found exhilarating and satisfying.

          • stuckinthewoods

            Either. Your post indicated because we were once mis-characterized as mentally ill that we should now refrain from joining myriad others in questioning the mental health of Mr. Trump.

          • Mark_in_MN

            Hogwash. I think Allen Francis is either engaging in some special pleading or has lost his way amongst the trees to acknowledge the forrest, either in terms of diagnosing people or in terms of ethics. Someone has to be distressed about their own mental state before they can be diagnosed? So if you’re happy with your mental condition, however much outside healthy it might be for yourself or others, no diagnosis is possible? He needs to think about that again, and not just stick with what he thinks “proper” established criteria might be. What about distress for others? One has to stop in wonder at the claim that there is no impairment, much less no impairment publicly evident, here.

          • (((GC)))

            Don’t medical professionals have an obligation to intervene when someone is a sufficient danger to themselves or others?

    • clay

      mental illness is not the only mental health grounds.

      there’s also the question of mental competence. He doesn’t seem able to form new memories. He doesn’t seem able to complete a thought. He doesn’t seem to be mentally competent, but that’s not the same thing as crazy.

      • Michael McReavy

        There’s a whole section in the DSM on organic mental disorders. Those too require a meeting of the criteria for a diagnosis rather than a casual observation.

  • Michael McReavy
    • Texndoc

      That was one of the most interesting pieces I’ve read in a while. Saw it last week. In short, it is written by the Psychiatrist who wrote the definition of “malignant narcissist” for the diagnostic manual. His conclusion: Trump is not mentally ill. It’s worse.

      “”Most
      amateur diagnosticians have mislabeled President Trump with the
      diagnosis of narcissistic personality disorder. I wrote the criteria
      that define this disorder, and Mr. Trump doesn’t meet them. He may be a
      world-class narcissist, but this doesn’t make him mentally ill, because
      he does not suffer from the distress and impairment required to diagnose
      mental disorder.

      Mr.
      Trump causes severe distress rather than experiencing it and has been
      richly rewarded, rather than punished, for his grandiosity,
      self-absorption and lack of empathy. It is a stigmatizing insult to the
      mentally ill (who are mostly well behaved and well meaning) to be lumped
      with Mr. Trump (who is neither).””

      • sadoldguy

        So if you have a bunch of money or your dad’s employees to cover for you and keep you out of trouble, you can’t be mentally ill?
        Maybe the ‘simple’ assumption that mental illness always results in
        “he does not suffer from the distress and impairment required to diagnose“
        is flawed.

        • Michael McReavy

          Perhaps the best diagnosis: Trump’s a schmuck.

        • Texndoc

          I think where the professor is coming from is that to be mentally ill there has to be a distinction from your normal. In Mr Trump’s case, there’s not one.

        • lymis

          He’s not saying that Trump isn’t mentally ill. He’s saying that people are misdiagnosing him. He’s not mentally ill with THAT disorder.

        • CatApostrophe

          I’m inclined to agree with you. There are a lot of circumstances (wealth, sycophants, etc.) that protect him from distress, but his behavior is not, IMO, that of a person who’s comfortable with his own psyche. He has angry tantrums easily and frequently, he lies compulsively in the hopes of gaining attention and reassurance, he keeps weird hours, he seems to be obsessed with TV, he has a really short attention span and can’t sit through meetings or phone calls. These are not things healthy people tend to do habitually, and trump does all of them a lot. So, yeah, I might be one of the “amateur diagnosticians” the doctor mentions in his article, but I’ve also been treated for mental illness myself for about a decade, so maybe I look at these things a little differently (doesn’t make me an expert, but still). In this case, because we’re talking about the president and not any old psych patient, we probably need to take into account the ways in which such a person might indeed fit the criteria. Maybe he actually doesn’t. Either way, this is an unusual circumstance and once size does not fit all.

      • clay

        “he’s not insane; he’s a fucking asshole.”

      • Beagle

        In other words, Dump isn’t mentally ill — it’s a carrier?

      • MichaelJ

        That is one of the best things I’ve read about Trump, and the situation is far worse than Trump being mentally ill. He’s evil.

        • JCF

          I have a friend, a proudly “mentally different” blogger, who says the same thing: Drumpf is “Bad, Not Mad!”

      • Mark_in_MN

        Causing distress should and disruption should be just as worthy of consideration as the individual experiencing distress themselves. Being just fine, thank you very much, with one’s mental state shouldn’t be something that prevents a diagnosis. A medical diagnosis wouldn’t hinge on whether someone has pain or is bothered by symptoms. Why should mental health diagnosis be different?

        • Treant

          I’m with you on this one. My crazy-ass* cousin couldn’t give two shits about the distress he’s causing you, but that doesn’t keep him from being crazy-ass. Or diagnosed with bipolar disorder** and borderline personality disorder.

          * Not an official diagnosis.

        • Michael McReavy

          I would say that causing distress or disruption for others, as a sign of mental illness, is tricky. Consider criminal behaviour, or, closer to home, consider gay or trans kids. Some parents are significantly and genuinely distressed when they discover their kid is on a life path less travelled. But we don’t then diagnose their kid as having the problem.

          I think you’re on firmer ground with your objection if you’re talking about some distress or disruption for others caused by impairments in a non-insightful loved one. One can see those situations most clearly with regard to psychotics. They can do crazy, hurtful things because of their extreme or cartoonish interpretations of reality. Where the individual’s situation is less starkly out of touch, and absent their personal unhappiness, I’d say it becomes a difficult judgment. Then I think you’re talking about assholes…like Trump.

          Diagnosing a physical problem is usually more straightforward. Even if the signs are silent, e.g. in high blood pressure, they are usually objective in nature. No such luck with regard to most mental problems.

          • Mark_in_MN

            You’re misconstruing the point to argue against it. I am not saying that causing distress or disruption should lead to a mental illness diagnosis in itself. That would indeed be a problem. Lots of healthy and normal behaviors cause distress or disruption for other people. But if, indeed, distress or impairment is necessary condition for diagnosing mental illness, in addition to specific criteria for a particular diagnosis, then limiting it to the patient’s own distress seems far too narrow and doesn’t keep in mind the interconnectedness of human beings and their communities. I’m not entirely sure that causing distress (for one’s self or others) should be a fundamental and necessary condition for a mental illness diagnosis. It should be treated like other medical conditions, in that a diagnosis should be independent of discomfort, distress, or disruption. Whether much of the diagnosis can be based on objective signs rather than subjective reports seems immaterial. There is much in medicine that also relies on subjective components rather than just objective ones. Tests and physical examination, as important as they are, are just a part of the whole picture. Distress and impairment may matter in terms of care for an individual and treatments to be pursued, but incorporating that into diagnosis seems to impose inappropriate and logically suspect (if not simply improper) criteria.

          • Michael McReavy

            Interesting that the absence of subjective distress was a main factor that lead to the American Psychiatric Association changing its stance on homosexuality back in 1973. Those opposed to the change argued it was astounding that subjective distress could provide a standard to determine the presence or absence of psychopathology.

            If you’re looking for objectivity in psychiatric diagnoses, well, good luck. There are probably few fields that have been, and are, so subject to fashions in thinking.

          • Mark_in_MN

            Maybe that suggests that psychiatry needs to become more objective and throw out much of its history as a source for how things should be regarded. Perhaps its scope should be more narrowly focused rather than be as broad ranging, and maybe the DSM rather than nearly 1000 pages in length should be more like 100.

            Whatever arguments they used back in the early 1970s to get homosexuality removed from being a pathology could be regarded as what was politically necessary for the change to occur. The fact is that it shouldn’t have been included in the first place, since the stance of homosexuality as pathology was not based on anything objective but entirely subjective from the start.

          • Michael McReavy

            More objectivity is an interesting goal and with the DSM III there began an attempt to achieve classifications that were just that. But ultimately I think psychiatry starts with an individual’s subjectivity. Their identities, inhibitions, what makes life meaningful, their fears, fantasies, loves and hates, hopes and dreams. All those things that distinguish us from mere objects. All those things that cannot be observed from the outside. And those we can only find out with empathy and in dialogue. But those ‘instruments’ are not objective. How could they be? They are shot through with the assumptions of the larger culture and embedded in the historical moment. Striving for objectivity is a bit of the will o’ the wisp.

            I guess in a long-winded way I’m circling back to the importance of distress. One may have all the external indicators of a mental disorder but the subjectivity of the individual can’t be ignored and is, I think, decisive in making a diagnosis.

          • Mark_in_MN

            But I would also note that behavior, both that seen by the diagnostician themselves and that which might be reported by others, is actually observable, and thus objective, and even subject to legitimate research and statistical analysis. Perhaps “mental” disorder diagnosis should be based more on observable behaviors than on self-reported subjective signs and symptoms. But I would again remind you that subjective reports are significant, and sometimes indispensable or key, factors in diagnosis of “physical” medical conditions. Perhaps we give them some greater credence because they are seen as a description of body rather than mind, which has so often been seen as not physical in nature.

  • robirob

    He came off as insane from the start. Did people think it was just an act he drops as soon he’s POTUS?

    • Derrick Johns

      I absolutely agree, robibob. Did Trump ever truly want the job to begin with?

      • Jeffg166

        No, he never wanted the job. He wanted to win.

    • Acronym Jim

      Unfortunately many people DID believe it was an act. In fact, every time he refrained from tweeting for a day or two, it was being reported that he was “pivoting to appear more presidential.”

      They thought he was pulling off some P.T. Barnum shtick and never realized he was the crazy clown that he had been portraying himself as all along.

  • NOW you ask? Where the hell were you during the campaign? Anyone who has ever watched more than 30 seconds of The Apprentice knew The Beast was out of his fukkin mind!

  • GayOldLady
    • GayOldLady
      • TuuxKabin

        Shades of Rudy Giuliani.

        • GayOldLady

          Rudy almost looks sane next to trump, doesn’t he?

          • TuuxKabin

            Uh, no, not weally. He was one mean raging stronzo as mayor. For one day, or two, just after September 11, when asked “do you know the death toll” and he answered, “far than any of us can endure,” I thought, well maybe he has a heart afterall. That lasted all of a day or so.

      • Acronym Jim

        To be fair, I had that same expression and used the same gesture when I woke up on November 9th to the news of the new administration.

        • I’ve had that same expression when the after-effects of too much salsa kick in. But we all KNOW I’m fulkkin nuts!

  • narutomania

    The CIA has posted a job listing announcing that it is seeking new instructors to teach foreign languages in the DC metropolitan area. What is quite interesting about this job posting is the following statement:

    “All applicants must successfully complete a thorough medical and
    psychological exam, a polygraph interview and an extensive background
    investigation. U.S. citizenship is required.”

    I find it interesting that the Federal Government would subject applicants for a language teaching position to a much more thorough screening process than it would for the office of the president. There is no way that Drumpf would pass an extensive medical or psychological exam, or even a polygraph.

  • billbear1961
  • Talisman

    NOW they question his sanity?

    The Washington bubble must be a cobalt shell.

    • clay

      Is it a DC thing, or a Legislative branch thing?

  • geoffalnutt

    Jeeeeezzzzzzz!!! He was characterized years earlier as a “black hole”…indeed, all light and reason and truth disappear when he enters a space. This was known!

  • Tiger Quinn

    Actually….this is the perfect narrative for the Dems.

    Not because it’s mean, or makes fun of him – because it puts the onus squarely on HIM in all future interactions.

    In short, if you went to a boxing match, and was told that one of the fighters was certifiably, actually insane, you’d spend the entire time scanning both of them trying to see which was doing the “crazy stuff.” This is the lens Trump will exist in, and it will drive him (ironically) NUTS. He hates any attention that isn’t fawning, and the narrative that he might be already suffering from Alzheimers is out there and he knows it. He’ll either get so tense trying to not be crazy that he will go crazy, or get so tired of not being crazy that he’ll go crazy.

    Either way.

  • Michael McReavy

    “And Rep. Ted Lieu (D-Calif.) plans to introduce legislation that would
    require the presence of a psychiatrist or psychologist in the White
    House.” And who would pick the shrink to fill that position? Imagine someone like Fox News’ Keith Ablow in that situation. Yikes!

    • Cuberly

      Or Charles Krauthammer. Yikes!

  • Mark

    Question???? How much more ‘symptom’ do they need?

  • BobSF_94117

    I wish someone would calmly ask him why he openly lies. And not let it go.

    • canoebum

      The next phone call to his BFF Putin would contain a request for some of the polonium that worked so well on Litvinenko.

  • Cosmo Tupper

    I question his blind followers mental health, but they have been duped by the best – Trump and Murdoch.

    • Xuuths

      Why blame mental health, when it’s just stupidity?

      • Cosmo Tupper

        Successful brainwashing is a mental illness – you make people think things are real that are NOT. ie. religion.

  • Xuuths

    All the press corps needs to do is just laugh out loud directly to his face when he says something egregiously false or stupid. His head will explode.

    • Jeffg166

      Then they would be called biassed by the fake news people.

  • DesertSun59

    Demonstrable delusions come from the pulpit, too.

  • Mike Knife

    Trump is crazier than the psychiatrist.

    • Michael McReavy

      That can depend on the psychiatrist.

      • Mike Knife

        R U ONE OF THEM?

        • Michael McReavy

          I worked in the mental health field but no, I’m not a psychiatrist. Crazy? Well uh…

          • Mike Knife

            What did you do in the “mental heath field” and how many people did you kill?

  • Matt

    It’s hard to be a leader (which he never was anyway) when your main focus is on making money and being popular/liked. This is as good as it’s going to get with him. He literally doesn’t care about the well-being of the country as long as someone is praising him. The GOP is going to support him as long as its a benefit to them. I can only imagine what cheeto will have to do to get them to actually turn on him entirely.

  • chris james

    Dr, Bornstein, Trump’s wacky looking doctor, has prescribed a hair growth drug for Trump and one of the side effects is loss of mental acuity. Need I say more?

  • Jeffg166

    For some strange reason presidents want to be loved. Trump’s need for it is the worst I’ve ever seen. His knowing he hasn’t the support of the majority of the country is killing him. Driving him of the deep end for sure.

    • Beagle

      Most politicians (indeed, most people over the age of about 14) realize that not everyone is going to love them. Dump never realized that. It doesn’t just want everyone to love it, it expects not just universal love, but universal adoration. It then compounds the problem by saying and doing things that very effectively alienate large numbers of people. And it may not even realize that its own words and actions are causing its unpopularity.

  • karmanot
  • Richard B

    Trump’s genius to beating his republican opponents in the primaries and Hillary in the general election is he speaks and bullies like someone at about the 6th grade level. He connected powerfully to a angry disenfranchised have-not segment of the white electorate that did not share in the abundance of our country. That and with the Russians assistance got him into the White House. The problem is he is as mentally fit and prepared to run the country as the electorate who put him there.
    Our election process failed to produce a intellectually fit candidate in 2016 and we need to push for a reset.

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    The man is, if not certifiable, at the very least in dire need of treatment; preferably as far away from the button as possible.