WISCONSIN: Elections Board Rejects Hand Recount

The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel reports:

The Wisconsin Elections Commission set a timetable Monday for a recount of the presidential election but rejected Green Party candidate Jill Stein’s request to conduct it by hand.

Unless Stein quickly challenges the agency’s decision in court and wins,the plan would leave it to officials in each of Wisconsin’s 72 counties to decide whether to do their recounts by hand. That could mean some counties perform recounts by machine and some by hand.

Citing the results of a 2011 statewide recount, commission chairman Mark Thomsen said this presidential recount is very unlikely to change the results in the state. “If nothing else this will give us a very good audit and this will reassure Wisconsin voters that we have a fair system,” said Thomsen, a Democrat.

The commission is made up of three Democrats and three Republicans. It adopted the recount plans unanimously. Stein is seeking to pay for the recount of the election — in which she received about 31,000 votes, or 1% — to make sure that Democrat Hillary Clinton really lost Wisconsin to Republican Donald Trump by some 22,000.

  • Ziad Baaklini

    Democrats love being pushovers don’t they?

    • Gustav2

      Maybe the D’s understand the real problem is voter ID, registration and purging of the voter rolls, not the count.

      • safari

        Or they don’t want to impose. Because that’d be unpleasant.

      • fuow

        Or, maybe, we Democrats need to grow a spine. None of the very valid problems you listed will be addressed under the rethugs.

    • fuow

      Sadly, yes – and I say that as a yellow-dog who has a spine and is not a pushover.
      I can’t tell you how often I enraged my fellow Democrats by insisting we make waves and push back against the blue-dawgs, never mind the rethugs.

  • Lazycrockett

    Well if the machines are the issue, then using them to recount isn’t going to shine any light on the problem. So much for democracy.

  • MusicBear88

    Gee, if I didn’t know any better, I’d think that somebody in the Elections Commission knew that there could be a major discrepancy and wants to make sure it stays covered up…

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  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    …and with that, the commissioners immediately ran to the bank to cash their checks from Trump. The End.

  • Bared Bear

    I hope the generation that can survive Florida being submerged underwater can undo the Trump years. It’s going to take that long. And maybe the Ice Age after.

    • Treant

      Cancel that Ice Age for at least fifty thousand years. It’ll be way too warm.

      • safari

        Actually there’s a good chance that major alterations to ocean currents could lead to an ice age. Some research indicates that it could come on within a a couple generations under the right circumstances.

        • Treant

          I saw that but, even if correct, it’d be like the Lower Dryas. You’d get glaciation across northern Europe and the eastern US, but the rest of the world would be primarily unaffected.

          There’s now some data showing that the warm currents may dive much further into the Arctic than previously thought (since they can still lose their heat budget there), and that the thermohaline cycle simply won’t be impacted that much.

  • safari

    In Michigan a marijuana legalization ballot proposal wasn’t placed on the ballot because the state said the clerks didn’t need to certify signatures after they demanded the petitioners verify the signatures for reasons.

  • bkmn

    Wouldn’t want to do the job properly now, would we?

  • SoCalGal20

    More from the Elections Commission chairman, from CNN.

    “If nothing else, this is going to give us a very good audit, it’s going to re-assure Wisconsin voters that we have a fair system, that we’re not counting illegal votes,” said Elections Commission chairman Mark Thomsen.

    He strongly defended the vote count.

    “To say we didn’t count them correctly the first time… that somehow illegal votes were counted… is really inappropriate,” Thomsen said. “I don’t think we’ll find in this that our fellow citizens counted these votes (in)accurately — going to reassure — not counting illegal votes … We’re not counting dead people’s votes.”

    http://www.cnn.com/2016/11/28/politics/wisconsin-recount/index.html

    • Bryan

      Sounds like he’s pretty biased, can we get rid of him and get a 2nd opinion? I don’t like this shithead railroading democracy.

      • Bryan

        Just reread and noticed he’s one of ours, yeah he sounds like a Trumpette, won’t the dozens of liberal Wisconsinites he’s trying to fuck over please remind him who he’s actually beholden to? Sue and add him to the list of names responsible for all the fraud, covering things up now are we?

        • Bryan

          No, seriously, he’s effing biased, he has no right to feel it’s inappropriate. I’m offended at his being offended. If he’s offended we’re saying human error may have occurred, then he’s part of the cover up. Nobody’s outright accusing you of fraud directly, guilty conscience much? I hope it gets shown, brought up in court and we’re allowed forward with a handcount. This is what all those extra millions were for folks.

  • not shocked at all. the rethugs have been tinkering with election laws for years, and dems have just sat by and done little or nothing during the few times they have any power in state houses to review and change some of the bullshit like this is. nope, “appearance of fairness” matters more than actual, scientifically valid enumeration that is actually fair.

    • NancyP

      The Dems have done what they could. The states with voter suppression measures have not had a Democratic majority. The only possible way to combat this was via the courts. The Republicans have refused to allow positions to be filled at ALL APPELATE LEVELS, not just SCOTUS. This is now a constitutional crisis. And – there is no way out.

  • SoCalGal20

    I hope Stein goes to court to get a hand recount. It will be interesting to see how serious she is about pushing for voting integrity.

    • Bryan

      ….#Courtthehandcount2016?

  • Mark

    Obstacles. And the GOP is counting on it.

  • justme

    Sorry Jill…
    They take their marching orders from Hair tRump…

  • SoCalGal20

    Jill Stein just filed for the PA recount!

    https://twitter.com/buzzfeednews/status/803295731138306048

    • Treant

      This will *not* be pretty. Just sayin’, as I live here and all.

      • Bryan

        You somewhere safe enough? I’m guessing you’re definitely of the mind they’ll have enough to flip PA too? I trust the word of the locals who are in the know and understand the energy in the air where they’re at. At least right now.

        • Treant

          Safe enough, I suppose. It’s a pretty well-to-do and multicultural neighborhood, so I don’t expect any direct trouble.

    • Moebym of the Rebel Alliance

      Good.

  • MBear

    Ask the fox if anyone is getting into the henhouse

    • Bared Bear

      The fox isn’t just getting into the henhouse. He’s salaciously wiggling his fingers underneath their hindquarters and dragging their eggs up his mouth… making sucking sounds like Hannibal Lector.

  • SoCalGal20

    People in IL, contact these state legislators to help get Rauner’s veto of automatic voter registration overridden. Apparently some of the GOP lawmakers who have supported overriding the veto are now being pressured by Rauner to not override it.

    https://twitter.com/taniel/status/803292190772342784

    https://twitter.com/taniel/status/803293193546715136

    https://twitter.com/taniel/status/803294835381768192

  • Given that even before the recount starts, Trump has already lost almost 5,000 of his original vote total in Wisconsin due to “errors” in just the 3 counties that were check out of 72 counties, I’d say that they had damned well better count those ballots by hand!

    • Bryan

      My point exactly, we raised a war chest to fight court battles, let the first one reign down. We demand a hand count, fuck some appeaser who got his fee fees in a twist.

  • Stephen Elliot Phillips

    well if I read correctly the above:

    “Stein is seeking to pay for the recount of the election — in which she received about 31,000 votes, or 1% — to make sure that Democrat Hillary Clinton really lost Wisconsin to Republican Donald Trump by some 22,000.”

    If stein had stayed out of the goddamn race we would not have to recount votes in the first fucking place. geeze

    • SoCalGal20

      Many/most of her voters wouldn’t have voted for Hillary.

      • Kelly Lape

        I certainly hope her supporters are very happy with the new Fuhrer.

  • The_Wretched

    I can’t say I’m surprised but we need hand counts since the machines are suspect. The WECs decision just means the cloud over their election will persist.

    • Bryan

      so we sue the WEC for being complicit and force the hand recount. They don’t have to like it.

  • Martin
  • The only part of this I’m enjoying is back in the spring when Bernie lost is that these same Hillary supporters that told us to “get over it” and that no it wasn’t “rigged” are now saying it was “rigged” and telling people to stop telling them to “get over it.” Karma is a fucking bitch.

    • Michael

      COMPLETELY!!!! Couldn’t agree more. Odd how they gleefully turned a blind eye when Clinton was obviously rigging the primaries but now they’re all up in arms when the tables are turned.

      It’s these people who were at fault for the Sanders supporters staying home.

      Sanders 2020

      • Ziad Baaklini

        The false equivalence is real.

        • Michael

          How so? Please, by all means, show me how Clinton stealing the primaries is somehow different from what happened here.

          btw, thanks for proving how you guys so gleefully didn’t give a f*ck when Clinton did what you’re accusing Trump of doing now.

          #hypocrisyiswhyyoulost

          • Ziad Baaklini

            So many assumptions.

            How did Hillary steal the primaries? The DNC showing some favor towards Hillary is hardly equivalent to stealing. At worst, she had an advantage, one leveraged by the fact that she is a lifelong Democrat as opposed to Sanders who had shown himself to be an opportunist.

            Regardless, Hillary won a supermajority of delegates and had a 4 million vote lead. Her win was clear. Sanders message failed to resonate with many because all he focused on was economy.

            In fact, Sanders won states that used a caucus system while Hillary typically won states that used primaries. The fact that the former is highly undemocratic and discourages participation due to its inherently time inefficient style led him to win several states where Hillary may have won. A perfect example is Nebraska, where Hillary won the primary despite losing the caucus.

            In the end, Hillary never attacked Sanders while Sanders attacked her. She had a long history of publicized scandal while he didn’t. So all that “favor” she had from the Democrats acted to counterbalance all the bullshit right win talking points that Sanders willingly used against Hillary.

            So in a matter of speaking, one can justifiably say that Sanders stole the election from Hillary, because all of his actions in the primaries had a long lasting impression on his supporters, such as yourself, who apparently don’t realize they’re being hostile towards the people that are on their side.

            So calm down.

          • Michael

            You can copy and paste all you want but try this:

            Go flip a coin 10 times. What are the chances it’ll land on heads EVERY time.

            And this is exactly what should have happened in EVERY neck-to-neck race Clinton somehow won EVERY SINGLE TIME against Bernie.

            btw, thanks for proving the ONLY time she couldn’t rig it is when the causus system was used. Otherwise, she won EVERY time even though she somehow just edged him out.

            That, my friend, is IMPOSSIBLE.

          • Ziad Baaklini

            You’re referring to the Iowa caucus?

            https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/02/heres-just-how-unlikely-hillary-clintons-6-for-6-coin-toss-victories-were/

            “Update: The initial 6-for-6 report, from the Des Moines Register missed a few Sanders coin-toss wins. (There were a lot of coin tosses!) The ratio of Clinton to Sanders wins was closer to 50-50, which is what we’d expect.”

            Perhaps if you actually followed complete stories rather than extract those that suit your agenda, you’d actually learn something.

          • Ziad Baaklini

            And even if you were to discount all that, these are individual delegates in the case of a tie. They are irrelevant.

          • Michael

            They seem to have the whole “discount” skill down to a perfection.

          • Michael

            HUH???

            No, I wasn’t actually referring to that.

            Anything else?

            Again, it is just AMAZING how you guys have your heads so far shoved up your asses that you are all too happy to ignore what actually went down during the primaries.

          • Ziad Baaklini

            You are trying to use “statistical improbabiliity”( and 6 coin tosses wins are hardly impossible…that’s a 1/64 chance) to try to generalize the entire election process. You’re talking about a few delegates here.

          • Michael

            Wow, I am just amazed at how you guys strive so hard to avoid the obvious.

          • Ziad Baaklini

            You are not providing anything as obvious. Using one instance reliant on probability to try to form a general conclusion is fallacious reasoning.

            “You’re not likely to be struck by lightning, therefore you can never be struck by lightning” sort of thing.

            If you want to talk about a real statistical anomaly, compare that to every single poll in the dust belt just happening to be wrong while most others were more or less on point.

          • When the election process favored Hillary i.e. closed primaries they were all for it but you know the EC is bullshit all of a sudden.

          • fuow

            Ah, the troll has slimed it’s way out from under the bridge.

          • Michael

            That’s odd. Still can’t believe you can see me how you’re still having to look up from that same slime pond.

            Tell you what, why don’t you look for the rope Stein just threw you guys so maybe you could climb out because God knows you could never figure out how to do so on your own.

        • As Glenn Greenwald said recently: False equivalency now operationally means: “you criticized Democrats”

          • Michael

            It’s amazing how, now that the race is over, Clntonites are still complete d!cks.

            How many times did Sanders supporters basically get the middle finger from them with the “oh, we don’t really need you anyways” tune?

          • Yeah I bet they wish they got those votes in the rust belt now.

          • Michael

            Yup. As I like to say, 4 years of Trump is better than 8 years of Clinton.

            It’d be almost fun watching them squirm now if the mess they created couldn’t be the downfall of us all. There was absolutely no hope with Clinton, at least with Trump we could hope he was still, somewhat, the huge liberal he was before he ran for office.

      • OhNo,Sweetie

        Sanders 2020? The first campaign run from a nursing home.

        • Michael

          Gee, there goes the “total d!ckhead comment” thing again.

          And do you have to wonder why we stayed home?

          And what’s even more classic is you guys are still being d!cks to the ONLY person trying to do the right thing here.

  • Michael

    Are some people on here really still bitching about Stein?

    WTF people? She’s doing you a HUGE favor. Wake up.

    • Bared Bear

      The orange menace is against her… so she’s got that going at the very least. Anything above that and I promise to never bitch about her again. Not that she was actually ever on my radar. But still.

    • If she wanted to do the Democrats a favor, she would had dropped out and asked her supporters to vote for Hillary Rodham Clinton on Nov. 8th.

      Stein has her own motives in asking money for a recount, mainly to raise money and to try to attract supporters to help the Greens in the 2020 Presidential Election.

      Dr. Jill Stein was pretty horrible in the 2016 election, and was as cagey and disingenuous as any politician with her doublespeak from Vaccines, Wifi, Vladimir Putin, Julian Assange and other issues, like Student Loan relief.

      • Michael

        If you think Stein could have swayed her supporters to vote for Hillary then I really don’t think you can even start to comprehend why they were supporting her to begin with.

        • So, they are zombies?

          I am not really pissed at those who voted for Jill Stein, they were the batshit crazy 1%, who believed in chemtrails, no vaccinations for their children, and have a nice collection of tinfoil hats.

          I am pissed at the 46% of the electorate that didn’t vote in the 2016 election..

          • Michael

            Really?

            Well that’s odd because we’re all pissed Clinton rigged the primaries.

            Let me get this right. Clinton riggs the election, her supporters are total d!cks to Sanders supporters, Clinton gives the ultimate middle finger to Sanders supporters AFTER she gets the nomination and then you get all pissed we stayed home because there was no way in hell we’d ever vote for someone like that?

            It’s like getting all pissed your date didn’t take you out again after you gave him herpes.

          • If you want to be pissed off with your delusions that the primaries were rigged, go ahead.

            It is not “Clinton Supporters” versus “Sanders Supporters”, I would had supported either candidate if they won the Dem President Nomination. It is about pushing a progressive agenda, nominating Supreme Court Justices that have long term impact on much of our lives, (From campaign finance, environmental law to gun control)

            There can only be one candidate for the Dems. Hillary won, I am not the biggest Hilary Rodham Clinton supporter, but I supported her, there are parts of Sanders that I liked in the primary, and others I didn’t. The goal is to push for liberal and progressive agenda for the US, not acting like shrews in the winter about the Dem primaries..

          • Michael

            Actually, no.

            It’s about supporting a candidate who has NOT changed his position on the issues depending upon whether or not it will get him more votes.

            Let me ask you this: What was the current public opinion poll on gay marriage when Clinton finally came out in favor of it? It’s a safe bet it was about 51% in favor of it.

  • Sam_Handwich
    • Bryan

      YES, good news!!!

    • Lazycrockett

      She may be batshit crazy but she’s a tough old broad. term used in the best most possible way.

      • Michael

        So she’s doing you guys the biggest favor possible, completely out of left field, and you’re still being total d!cks to her.

        Gee, no wonder your candidate lost.

        Usually “thank you” is the most appropriate way to respond to the ONLY person who has a chance in hell of actually getting your candidate in office.

        • Lazycrockett
        • She is not doing the Democrats a favor. She has her own motives in doing this. Recounts are don’t find tens of thousand votes discrepancies. I see this all as a PR stunt.

          However if it pisses off Donald Trump, and shows how he is batshit crazy, I am all for it.. The recounts in three states, shouldn’t change the outcome of the election. It may make liberals and progressive feel good, but it is going to be a short term buzz before the January 20 inauguration of President Trump..

          • Michael

            ARE YOU F*CKING SERIOUS???

            Wow, I really have A LOT of respect for Stein now seeing she’s doing this knowing damn well this is the reaction she’s going to get from the Clintonites.

            Thankfully there’s a whole ‘nother generation or three who are nothing like you guys.

          • Recounts don’t find major discrepancies in the final results to overturn tens of thousand vote difference on the results from election night. I lived through the months long ordeal of the 2004 Washington State Gubernatorial recount, which had a two machine and one manual recount. The tally results found hundreds of ballots not counted, not tens of thousands..

            When the recounts are done in three states, then you wave your arms in impotent fury at me, if I was mistaken, and it did make a difference..

            What did make a difference were voter suppression laws in those three states, and the false equivalency argument that Clinton was as corrupt or worse than Trump.. a few thousand votes difference is not the outrage as much as 46% of the electorate didn’t vote.

          • Michael

            If you’d like to figure out the cause of the outrage go wink at yourself in the mirror.

            I am unfortunately reminded today just what total d!ckheads you guys are. It wasn’t that long ago you guys were being total assh*les to Sander supporters. You thought your queen would be crowned no problem. Well, hello, meet “problem” next time you go brush your teeth.

          • Will you stop with this Clinton supporters versus Sanders Supporters? I was about winning the Presidential Election with whatever candidate won the Dem nomination. I care about the agenda.

            Right now, Clinton and Sanders supporters are the same boat, the Republicans control all the House, Senate and White House. I am focused on stopping the idiots who now control the asylum, not on DNC emails or the California Dem Primary..

          • Gianni

            All of us are “total dickheads”? If we’re all total dickheads, you don’t sound any better than us. A little bit of mirror might help you, too.

      • Oh now you guys like her.

        • Boy Elvis

          I don’t fucking like her. I think she’s doing this to feather her own nest. But there’s a non-zero chance this will do some good, and I’m OK with that.

  • LesbianTippingHabits

    The real question re Jill Stein is simple: How does she tip?

    Remember, tips are good karma. And karma never lies.

    And only the wait staff knows for sure. Thank you.

  • Falconlights

    A hearty thank-you to Ms. Stein.