NOM Issues Plan To Work With Donald Trump For “Inevitable Reversal” Of Same-Sex Marriage Ruling

And pretty much every other LGBT advance achieved by the Obama administration. From hate group leader Brian Brown:

Donald Trump has won a historic election, an unprecedented victory that has turned the establishment upside down. We heartily congratulate him and his team on their incredible win. President-elect Trump will now turn his attention to governing, and NOM is committed to working with him. We are confident that our voice and our views will be important in a Trump administration.

Here is our plan:

We will work with President Trump to nominate conservative justices to the U.S. Supreme Court, individuals who will adhere to the words and meaning of the constitution. Such justices will inevitably reverse the anti-constitutional ruling of the Supreme Court imposing same-sex ‘marriage’ on the nation in the Obergefell decision, because that decision lacked any basis in the constitution.

We will work with President Trump to rescind the illegal, over-reaching executive orders and directives issued by President Obama, including his dangerous “gender identity” directives, attempting to redefine gender just as he sought to redefine marriage.

We will work with President Trump to reverse policies of the Obama administration that seek to coerce other countries into accepting same-sex ‘marriage’ as a condition of receiving US assistance and aid. It is fundamentally wrong for a president to become a lobbyist for the LGBT agenda, and we are confident that will end in the Trump administration.

We will work with President Trump and Congress to pass the First Amendment Defense Act (FADA), which Mr. Trump supports. FADA is critical legislation to protect people who believe in marriage from being targeted by the government for persecution.

This is a bright and exciting time for NOM, and we are committed to taking full advantage of the opportunity we have. Our voice and our views matter to the incoming administration, and that means your voice and views matter.

To make sure that we can influence the policy debates that are coming, we need to step-up our communications. The first step is to grow our presence on social media. Please act today to follow NOM and me on Twitter, and to like us on Facebook.

It only takes a few seconds to follow us on Twitter and to like us on Facebook, but doing so will help us increase our ability to educate and mobilize our supporters.

We’re excited about the future, and we are looking forward to work with the Trump administration to restore marriage, uphold gender, protect religious liberty and promote families.

NOM remains the sole national hate group to support the First Amendment Defense Act. The Family Research Council, the Liberty Counsel, and the American Family Association all withdrew their support after new language was added which would also legalize discriminating against married straight couples on the the basis of “sincerely held religious belief or moral conviction.”

  • Frostbite

    What??? They forgot to mention rounding us up into camps and killing us.

    • Lazycrockett

      baby steps.

    • FAEN

      Is anyone else having a problem? Every time I click ‘load more comments’ it kicks me to the disqus home page. Has never done before or all day today. Just started. Any advice?

      • ZhyKitty

        Try signing out and then back in. Disqus does some fucked up shit to me sometimes and signing out and then back in usually fixes it, for whatever weird reason.

    • dcurlee

      They have to give us the tattoo first

    • AdamTh

      There was some preacher in NC a few years back that came up with a plan for that. But don’t worry, Mikey Pence is gonna cure us of “the gay” first…

  • ham hock

    Every trump supporter is now my enemy for allowing this horror to happen. They can all die in hell.

  • Homo Erectus

    Oh, and send money.

  • Earl

    If those people are on their way to heaven, I’d rather avoid that destination.

  • Steven B

    Is there any chance that my marriage could be invalidated?

    • houstonray

      Wondering the same thing here…if they overturned it, what is the constitutionality of invalidating millions of people already married?

    • bobbyjoe

      I share your concern, but I look at it this way: by the time they tried to even get a case before the USSC (if the USSC took it, which is doubtful), and the USSC ruled, it sure would be coming up on the end of Trump’s term, at least. And if we’re all still alive by the end of Trump’s term, I have a feeling there’s going to be a righteous reckoning against Trump and the rest of the Republican Party, with the next administration pushing back hard at anything Trump’s managed to do.

      My hope at least.

      • SammySeattle

        First they would need to have standing and a valid question to bring before the court. “I don’t like it” won’t fly.

      • Steven B

        But by then it will be too late to undo the damage done to SCOTUS.

    • JCF

      Very little.

      • Sk3ptic

        Forgive us for not believing the statement “the chance is very little” ever again.

        • JCF

          “Us”? Like I’m not one of you? Thanks for turning on one of your own.

          • Sk3ptic

            Uh, who’s turning on whom? I specifically asked for forgiveness, Mr. Touchy.

        • Dead Giveaway

          Deleted.

          • Sk3ptic

            Huh? What the fuck is wrong here? I was pointing out the irony of saying that something has little chance of happening AFTER SOMETHING THAT HAD LITTLE CHANCE OF HAPPENING HAPPENED.
            Nothing more than that was intended.

          • Dead Giveaway

            A fair point. I didn’t expect Trump to happen. I really feel like I somehow ended up in an episode of the Twilight Zone.

          • Sk3ptic

            Me too. In fact I’m reeling. I work in an office where 80%-plus of the people openly voted Trump. Today was particularly frightening with the gloating…from post-grad professionals all the way to support staff. I’m just raw is all.

          • Dead Giveaway

            I think a lot of those votes were because people were frustrated at a corrupt system. Trump was a wild card. They were tempted to see what would happen, and were tired of being ruled by the same families again and again.

            They felt the system was rigged, and despite voting, didn’t expect to be allowed to throw a wrench into the works.

            As far as the wall goes, it takes ages to build a highrise. There’s no way a wall will be built. It’s just not feasible in any stretch of the imagination. I do worry about the Supreme Court being targeted, but maybe the sky isn’t falling. Remember Trump’s words after the Orlando nightclub shooting:

            Our nation stands together in solidarity with the members of Orlando’s LGBT Community.

            This is a very dark moment in America’s history.

            A radical Islamic terrorist targeted the nightclub not only because he wanted to kill Americans, but in order to execute gay and lesbian citizens because of their sexual orientation.

            It is a strike at the heart and soul of who we are as a nation.

            It is an assault on the ability of free people to live their lives, love who they want and express their identity.

            It is an attack on the right of every single American to live in peace and safety in their own country.

          • StudioTodd

            Just stop.

          • Dead Giveaway

            You first.

          • StudioTodd

            I’m not the one trying to make excuses for the stupidity of the American voters.

          • Dead Giveaway

            You can’t always get what you want.

          • StudioTodd

            I guess not…because right now I want nothing more than for you to choke on your own smugness.

          • Todd20036

            I’m luckier. Most of my coworkers are Clinton voters.

            A few aren’t.

            My boss let me vent. I didn’t ask him directly if he voted for Clinton, but precious few black men would actually not vote for her.

    • Dramphooey

      NOM is jumping on a bandwagon for a money beg.

    • Ernest Endevor

      No. It’s a civil contract. Unless they want to outlaw marriage itself.

      • Steven B

        It may remain a civil contract but what about the rights that go along with that contract? The Federal Govt allows over 1400 rights and privileges to people who are legally married. Thanks to Obergefell plus the end of DOMA I can now enjoy those rights and privileges. What will happen if those are taken away? What SCOTUS gives, SCOTUS can take away.

        • Ernest Endevor

          We were married in Canada. Should they try to do this I wonder if our marriage would still stand. Isn’t it disgusting we even have to entertain such thoughts?

  • Mordred LeFey

    I just can’t wrap my head around why they care so much about what other people do. Are they that obsessed with power?

    • Stephen Elliot Phillips

      Circumcision is so prevelent in the usa because in the 1920s a cereal maker , john kellogg said it would stop boys from masturbating.
      so u tell me? they dont now or have they ever want us doing anything with our bodies or minds that they dont approve of.
      religion=control

      • Acronym Jim

        Oh shit. Circumcision in some cases and not on infants.

        “A remedy which is almost always successful in small boys is circumcision, especially when there is any degree of phimosis. The operation should be performed by a surgeon without administering an anesthetic, as the brief pain attending the operation will have a salutary effect upon the mind, especially if it be connected with the idea of punishment, as it may well be in some cases. The soreness which continues for several weeks interrupts the practice, and if it had not previously become too firmly fixed, it may be forgotten and not resumed.’

        And I’m seriously glad his other treatment never caught on.

        “a method of treatment [to prevent masturbation] … and we have employed it with entire satisfaction. It consists in the application of one or more silver sutures in such a way as to prevent erection. The prepuce, or foreskin, is drawn forward over the glans, and the needle to which the wire is attached is passed through from one side to the other. After drawing the wire through, the ends are twisted together, and cut off close. It is now impossible for an erection to occur, and the slight irritation thus produced acts as a most powerful means of overcoming the disposition to resort to the practice.”

        The man was so vile, I’m surprised somebody else invented Shredded Wheat.

        • Mordred LeFey

          I like how he says “It is now impossible for an erection to occur” when.. well… you kind of need an erection to make kids.

  • Sam_Handwich

    We should, of course, remain always vigilant. But i think the odds of Obergefell being reversed by SCOTUS are pretty slim.

    Roe, on the other hand, will continue to be chipped away at. Also, other things like corporate personhood, torture, campaign finance, voting rights are what i worry about.

    • Lazycrockett

      Soon only land owners will be able to vote.

      • Sam_Handwich

        (white Christian male) landowners

        • Nychta

          Just like the founding fathers intended. /s

          • Frostbite

            Just like the founding fathers Jeebus intended. /s

    • Herald

      Why do you think it’s slim? Ginsburg (83)–who should have fucking retired two years ago–will almost certainly die or retire in the next four to eight years. David Souter (77) or Kennedy (78) possibly as well. It absolutely will be reversed. It’s just a matter of when.

      • HanyBaal

        Did you mean Breyer? outer retired a while back

        • Herald

          Yeah, I meant Breyer. Trump will almost certainly replace them both, making six or possibly 7 far right wing conservatives on the Court. We’re fucked.

          • Steven B

            We are fucked for decades to come!

      • Sam_Handwich

        i have a difficult time imagining arguments that have not already been thoroughly exhausted in federal court

        • Herald

          That doesn’t make any sense. The same arguments will be made, and the ruling will be different.

          • Frostbite

            You could say the same thing about views on a lot of topics (slavery, abortion, women’s suffrage, marijuana use). Times change, views change, opinions change, laws change. What’s illegal today is legal tomorrow, what’s legal tomorrow is illegal the day after. Some times it works in your favor, some times it doesn’t.

          • Herald

            So, you’re cool with equality being overturned?

          • Frostbite

            No, I’m not. But you wouldn’t be crying about the EC right now if the situation were reversed (Hillary wins by EC and Trump by popular vote).

          • Herald

            Can you try to fucking focus on one topic, instead of just spitting out word salad?

          • Frostbite

            I am on one topic. You wouldn’t be a crying asshole if HRC had won, just an asshole.

          • Dee

            I am hoping they make divorce illegal so they so believe in the eternality of marriage. Not.

        • TominDC

          SCOTUS takes whatever case they want to take, and reverse what they want to reverse. Which isn’t necessarily a bad thing, if the judges rule your way.

          Surely you remember Lawrence v Texas in the early 2000s, when they reversed their previous ruling (Bowers v Hardwick, which ruled sodomy laws constitutional). That’s the one that struck down sodomy laws, and had Scalia throw a temper tantrum in his dissent claiming that they had opened the door to same-sex marriage.

          • Cboulder

            I think Lawrence was struck down on procedural due process grounds rather than on substantive due process grounds, contrary to what Scalia asserted. Meaning, anti-sodomy laws can’t be enforced against opposite- sex couples and thus violate procedural due process as they are are applied differently depending on the nature of the couple

    • S1AMER

      Actually, it doesn’t take a lot of effort to imagine decisions returning to state control the definition of marriage within their borders.

      More likely, though, is action through laws and eventual SCOTUS decisions that allow christianists to discriminate in any way they wish against married same-sex couples. Withhold workplace benefits for employees’ same-sex spouses? Fine. Refuse to hire LGBT workers? Sure, go right ahead if that gets you right with Jesus.

      As far as Roe goes, I’d guess it goes pretty soon. Once Trump has a few receptive justices on the bench, we’ll see multiple cases making their way to the Court (likely through the 6th), and there’s really no doubt about the outcome.

      • lymis

        I don’t see a complete reversal of marriage equality happening, even with the current court plus a Scalia clone.

        Even Roberts wondered openly whether the “right” way to address it was a sex discrimination rather than as sexual orientation discrimination. They’re not going to suddenly invalidate millions of marriages that didn’t cause the sky to fall.

        They got away for a generation with avoiding the issue because it wasn’t critical and there wasn’t a precedent. To agree to reverse it, they’d have to suddenly buy all the transparent arguments that boil down to one or two things – that couples who don’t procreate with each other aren’t validly married, or that gay people aren’t actually citizens who are governed by the Constitution.

        I’m not saying that Trump can’t eventually stack the Court with people who are willing to crap all over the Constitution, but for them to reverse Obergefell or Windsor, or even Lawrence, at this point, they’d have to flatly declare that gay people aren’t citizens.

        BUT.

        I really do see a conservative court giving unprecedented power to individuals based on their own personal “strongly held religious beliefs,” both as private citizens and as public employees.

        I honestly don’t think that they’ll declare we don’t have a right to marriage.

        I do see them gutting what that means in practice by letting people choose to discriminate against us individually without consequences. The practical results of that may be horrendous.

        Marriage itself is too fundamental and too intertwined with our society for the Court to agree that marriages blink on and off as you move around the country. They can’t target LGBT people without damaging straight marriage too. The voters may not get that, but the Court will.

        But they can decide that individuals have a fundamental right not to sell us things, give us medical care, give us insurance, or a thousand other things. That’s what scares me the most.

    • AnotherJosh

      I’m not super hopeful about things at present, but one bright light is that Evangelicals believe in marriage for life, and now they’re married to Donald Trump (this technically makes them polygamous, because they’ve been married to every Republican president since the Religious Right became a thing, but ignore that and stick with me…)

      This marriage to Trump will only serve to speed the Chrexit of not only millennials but also anyone of any other demographic who still has a heart for minority groups and people outside the Evangelical bubble. There are fewer and fewer of them, meaning fewer and fewer people to take advantage of these discrimination-approving laws, should they be passed.

      So that’s the silver lining that I’m choosing to see in this cluster of storm clouds of shit.

      • Todd20036

        Big whoop. The simple fact that these God fuckers voted for Trump shows they don’t give a fig about marriage.

        They do care about making gay people second class citizens.

        • AnotherJosh

          That is completely true. From my position in the rusty buckle of the bible belt, though, it appears as though the number of people who care about making us second class citizens is shrinking, and is shrinking at an accelerating rate thanks to – among other things – the full throated Trump support of the remaining fuckers.

          • Matt

            It won’t keep the minority, however quickly shrinking, from demanding our rights be dismantled. They will get their wish with an idiot SCOTUS bench that Trump will install if he is given the chance.

            Remember when he said he’s be the best president for ‘the gays’ or whatever the word salad was at the time? Just another lie by the king of lies and stupidity.

        • lymis

          One minor, very tarnished and fragile silver lining (at the federal level, at least), is that LGBT rights were not a major factor in Trump’s election. I have no illusions that a lot of them hate us, but we may – may – have moved off center as their primary targets.

          They may be too busy trying to keep America skewed toward white people to focus too strongly on us. More and more polls – especially among the generations moving into prime voting age – show we’re no longer the biggest bogeymen any more.

          As long as they have someone else to make everyone afraid of, they may not bother to focus on us. If we can be collateral damage, they’ll be fine with that, but we probably won’t be central targets, at least for a while.

    • Steven B

      The odds of a President Trump were pretty slim too.

      • LAguy323

        NO, they never were slim. You may have been told differently, but hey weren’t in actuality.

        • Steven B

          She won the popular vote. It doesn’t get much slimmer than that.

    • ZhyKitty

      I’m going to remain vigilant and continue worrying for friends and family after tonight.
      Tonight, I’m just going to keep washing down my meds with beer.
      Bye-bye to 9 years of sobriety.
      I wasn’t even driven to drink when my twin sister died, but tonight, just this once, I needed a fucking beer.

      • David E. Montellano

        dont do it. you’ll regret it later. I feel the same way you do but I want to see my 10th year come to fruition. Hang in there

      • HanyBaal

        Please don’t do it. Cheeto Hitler is certainty not worth it.

      • Marc

        Please don’t, ZhyKitty. I was and forever will be amazed by your strength and courage to sift through the drecks of our society sober. Very, very few of us could have done that. You have the strength to endure this, too!

    • Michael Abbett

      I disagree. I can see a scenario where they get a conservative justice and then something “happens” to RBG and they get another. They’d be after Obergefell thisfast. I believe Pence is going to be taking the Cheney role anyway once Dump sees how difficult all of this Presidentin’ is, and he has always been about letting the states decide. Scary as hell if you’re in a red state like us.

    • Cboulder

      At least Whole Womens Health made much of the pro-forced birth arguments indefensible unless they have a sound scientific basis. Not that it will keep the theocrats from trying as they did with the bullshit “undue burden” standard, aka the ” with all deliberate speed” of reproductive rights

  • ElenorRigby

    Well let’s not panic just yet. Undoing a ruling like that would take years and a lot of work. The majority of the country now supports marriage equality and that number is growing. They probably don’t want to wake that sleeping giant and it’s not really worth it. Sure, NOM is looking for donations for something that isn’t going to happen… they often do that. The chances of them actually undoing marriage equality are pretty low. They have much more to do.

  • stuff like this is frightening, but i’m not sure that overturning Obgf is really going to be high on the list of goals for the New Order to accomplish. there are sooooooo many other things they truly care about more, that they will want to accomplish first.

    some of them really do hate us so much they want to put us all in camps. i don’t deny that. but i question whether this will be something they want to expend effort and capitol upon, when corporations and other right wing groups with actual money start lining up outside congressional office doors with their hands out demanding the end of all regulation, taxes, etc., at the same time as the NOMmies.

    bashing our community has mostly always been about motivating a certain segment of voters and/or distracting from the fact that in terms of policy, the thugs have no ideas. i don’t see the benefit in appeasing NOMmies at all right now. they’ve served their purpose and won’t make any thug, staffer or congresscritter any richer. and when you peel away the BS they have been coating themselves with to get the election result they did, that’s what most of them are in it for, in truth.

    • CottonBlimp

      Fair points, BUT, consider that attacking gay marriage is one of the few promises they can actually deliver on. Even if they don’t start on it right away, that pinata will be there for when they need a distraction for the failing economy and the lack of any borderwall whatsoever.

    • petewestcentral

      There’s CottonBlimp’s point, plus, I think, at least the appearance of tossing some red meat to the evangelicals.

  • Homo Erectus

    While you’re at it, Brian – why don’t you also overturn Loving v. Virginia?

    • Lawerence Collins

      Oh, I’m sure that’s on the agenda

      • Acronym Jim

        That’s probably above the Obergefell and Windsor decisions on the Trump agenda.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Ooh! Ooh! They made a movie out of ‘Loving’ starring the fierce girlfriend from “The Preacher”.

    • swimboy

      Talk about a head-scratcher for Clarence Thomas!!!!

      • Homo Erectus

        I know, right?

  • Dagoril

    I find it hard to believe that with as much corporate greed as we are about to see, and the corresponding giveaways that are about to come pouring out of the floodgates, that Trump will even have the time to bother with an insignificant little worm like Brian Brown and his gay sex obsession.

    • Homo Erectus

      You can rest assured that BB didn’t contribute to Trump’s campaign, so no attention will be paid to him.

    • garygdw

      Pence.

  • Chris Baker

    Really? First of all, lower courts are bound by previous supreme court decisions. So a lower court, and the subsequent appeals courts would have to hear a case that has a new, unique legal approach to the topic. (And who will sue? Will some state pass a new anti-SSM marriage law?). Second, they are currently replacing Scalia, so the court will have the same make up for a few more years. (The SCOTUS was my main concern during the election, in voting for HRC). Third, the court would have to overturn a decision made only a few years ago that would effect thousands of married couples. Are all the existing marriages dissolved? What happens to all the legal contracts drafted when they were married (home ownership, adoptions, etc.?) Do they remain married and no new marriages are allowed? It would be a legal mess.

    Did anyone even mention same sex marriage in the campaign, or anyone remember any mention of gays in the military? Those were not even issues. And remember, abortion (which is the “murder of babies”) hasn’t been overturned in 40+ years, even thought the court has changed and it the driving issue of the religious right in elections.

    I must admit, I was also one who said that Trump would never be President, do I could be wrong on this too.

    • T.C.

      This piece from The Advocate outlines exactly how they could overturn Obergefell. http://www.advocate.com/commentary/2016/11/09/election-frightening-what-it-means

      • that is assuming that another Justice goes thus changing the make up of the court and it also assumes that such a law that would be unconstitutional would be passed. To be clear I 100% know and recognize that we must defend the gains we have won…I just think that marriage equality is more secure then some people think.

      • Chris Baker

        Thanks for the link. That could happen, in theory. But are there enough republicans who care enough to pass that law? And would Trump sign it? I think a lot of people would see the legal mess it would cause. But who knows.

        • Todd20036

          No one cares about legal messes so much as they care about gays being crushed.

          Hitler did it as soon as he rounded up Jews.

          Trump will do it as soon as he rounds up Muslims.

        • Frostbite

          A whole lot of people didn’t think Trump would win either..

          • Matthew Delemos

            A whole lot of people ensured he barely won, and it wasn’t the people that elected him. Let’s not let panic make us think otherwise.

    • Frostbite

      Trump has said, more than once, that he would appoint judges who would overturn Obergefell and “return the decision to the states where it belongs.”

    • McSwagg

      At the very least they will begin to chip away at the rights and benefits that come with marriage. A coalition of states led by Texas have filed a case to prevent same-sex married couples where one is a public employee from receiving employment benefits for their spouses. They have court shopped for a sympathetic judge so they are likely to win the first round on the claim that the Obergefell decision applies narrowly to the right to marriage only and does not include any other benefits. Combine that with ‘right to discriminate’ laws and they can make same-sex marriage basically meaningless. They will never let go of this just like they have never let go of the abortion issue.

  • Lazycrockett

    Well Chris Hayes isn’t making me feel any calmer.

    • Tom000

      I’ve been avoiding ALL TV relating to national news all day. I really am so depressed I can’t take any more.

      • Dramphooey

        I should have avoided Twitter. Really kept me down at work. That, and listening to a Stein idiot in the next cubicle talk with a complete moron who whined that she forgot to vote.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          You should have a medal for that!

      • bob

        I agree completely ! All the media , even msnbc, is to blame for this. They never really pushed back on serious issues and statements. They made a fortune by putting him on tv for every little thing. And they wonder how this happened.

  • JCF

    Just talk. Am not worried about marriage equality.

    • Same here…many other things yes but marriage equality…no.

    • ByronK

      Considering the state of their finances, I think this message is just a lube up for a fundraising drive.

    • Giant Monster Gamera

      I don’t think Trump or the business interests care. They have other priorities.

  • FranFuller

    I can’t see them overturning Obergefell on its face simply because the IRS will have huge tax issues. I can, however, see the new SCOTUS relegating the marriage issue back to States rights, where it could devolve quickly. And possibly even to City rulings (thinking of Charlotte vs. HB2). It could get very, very ugly.

    • SoCalGal20

      As long as Kennedy is there I think Obergefell will stand. However, the moment one of the liberals is replaced by a conservative it will be gone.

      As for the IRS I wouldn’t be surprised if they plan to get rid of it.

  • houstonray

    I’ve come out of my self imposed cocoon of mourning. I’ve been through grief and now I’m enraged. It’s going to be a long 4 years but we need to stay strong and hold everyone accountable.

    Side note, can a President be recalled?

    • Helen Damnation 🍑™

      I wouldn’t b surprised if Trump “quit” most of his duties, after assigning them to Pence, who will become the most viciously anti-LGBT national leader we have seen in a very long time.

    • Dramphooey

      No on the recall and that is not a precedent I would want to set when the other party voted futilely about Obamacare many times. Sadly, the next one won’t be futile.

  • please….NOM is the group that opposed Trump for not being anti-gay enough for them and now they want to claim that he will work with them? Brian Brown is dreaming here….Trump may very well appoint an anti-gay justice to SCOTUS but it will not be becasue of NOM.

    • Dramphooey

      This is just Brian Brown posing with the old Donald cut out from Trump University!

  • Kenny Young

    Cunts 🙂

    • Treant

      This is an appropriate and acceptable use of this word…since I know you don’t mean it in a misogynistic manner.

      If the women want to call them “dripping dicks,” I’m also fine with that.

      • worstcultever

        As a woman who generally hates the c-word, I completely approve of Kenny’s post.

  • worstcultever

    All it takes is a repuke supreme court, and they’ve now got it.

    • JCF

      Once again: Scalia was part of the 5-4 MINORITY when Obergefell was decided. Drumpf doesn’t have a repuke supreme court NOW (I mean after his horrifying SCOTUS nominee to replace Scalia is confirmed). If someone from the 5 Justice majority goes (Kennedy, Breyer, RBG, Sotomayor, Kagan) goes, then MAYBE. But that’s only after a test case rises through the courts. And then the majority would have to overcome “stare decisis”. http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=2005 I’m not sure Roberts (at least) is willing to go there.

      • worstcultever

        Trump will get at least two picks. And Roberts giving a shit about stare decisis or any other judicial thing, as opposed to the furtherance of puke power – you’ve got to be kidding.

  • bob

    I’ve been trying to think of something positive about this nightmare , and guess what, there is nothing. I did question just how bad a trump in the white house would be. It appears we’re about to find out.

  • Lumpy Gaga

    Big protest on Broad Street on my walk home. I joined in many rounds of “FUCK DONALD TRUMP” and “NOT MY PRESIDENT”.

    It was better than I felt all day. If I’d-a known it felt that good, even at my advanced age, I would have been prescribing it all day.

    Then I had to stop at a store where teh teevee showed Anderson Cooper asking David Axelrod why the protesters didn’t just get over it.

    • Dead Giveaway

      How democratic of you to reject democracy when it doesn’t go your way. Maybe throwing a public tantrum is cathartic for you, but it’s still a tantrum.

      • worstcultever

        First Amendment right to peaceably assemble and protest IS democracy, dumbass.

        • Dead Giveaway

          There’s no need to be upset or resort to ad hominem attacks. Protesting the democratically elected choice is really just silly tantrum-throwing. The public has already spoken, and you were outnumbered. To try to effect change with a show of numbers you don’t have is absolutely hilarious. Sad!

          • Ernest Endevor

            How elitey! “There’s no need to be upset or resort to ad hominem attacks.” Ooo. How Upper-East Side! How fucking moronic.

          • RemusL

            Tantrum-throwing is just emulating your dear leader. Don’t you admire him for not sugar-coating things and simply speaking his mind without any political correctness?

          • houstonray

            “Technically” no, we weren’t outnumbered….

            CLINTON – 59,814,018
            TRUMP – 59,611,678

            An outdated electoral system elected Trump but the American people voted for Hillary, she won over the public.

            He has NO mandate.

      • pj

        get used to demonstrations against don the con troll.

        • Paula

          I am concerned that Trumpanzees will seek out theses demonstrations for counter demonstrations. That will be bloody.

  • hugh

    Wii I still be able to pray to my loving Jesus, he is so wise and knows so much and can handle a million requests a second, like Donald.

    • Treant

      The Donald can handle a megapop*?

      * One million Prayer OPerations per second.

      • McSwagg

        Sure, it’s not like he has to actually do anything in response.

  • Dreaming Vertebrate

    NOM announces “The Plan”, … aka the Bigot Agenda.

  • American citizens are now forced to confront that, according to the Associated Press, Donald Trump is the president-elect. But what does a Trump presidency mean for gay marriage, and gay rights in general? Trump has said he would try to overturn the gay marriage Supreme Court decision. This would be quite the feat, but it is possible: he’d have to appoint a conservative judge to the seat left vacant by Justice Antonin Scalia, as well as more judgeships that might open up during his presidency. Then, a case would have to be brought against Obergefell v. Hodges, the decision that ruled in favor of marriage equality, and the Court would have to rule in favor of overturning marriage equality. If Trump’s administration can do all this, then gay marriage could once again potentially go back to being a state-by-state issue, and the most conservative states would almost certainly prevent gay marriage from occurring.

    Donald Trump has flip-flopped on his views on LGBTQ rights since he first contemplated a run for the presidency in 2000. Sixteen years ago, he declared that “the institution of marriage should be between a man and a woman.” Since then, Trump has continued to state that he does not believe in “non-traditional marriages,” implying that he doesn’t support LGBTQ rights in general. He definitely doesn’t agree with the Supreme Court’s 2015 to make gay marriage available across the country, as he’s stated that he believes the question should be left up to the states.

    His running mate, Pence, is also notoriously against gay marriage. However, Trump has promised to protect the LGTBQ community from terrorism, as he declared during a speech after the Orlando shooting… whatever that kind of promise means. Given his inflammatory statements about depriving Muslim Americans and women of their rights, you’ve got to wonder whether he’d actually keep his word on any promise to protect queer individuals.

    • Ninja0980

      I honestly don’t think he gives a crap but either way, not happy he’s the one that will be picking the judges.

    • lymis

      Trump is not going to chose a Supreme Court pick specifically because they oppose marriage equality. It’s entirely possible that someone who wants to shore up corporate interests, doesn’t mind looking the other way at religious persecution of non-Christians, and won’t get in his way when he runs roughshod over other parts of the Constitution won’t also quietly have a personal mission to screw us over, but it won’t be on Trump’s menu. There are plenty of Republicans who see fighting our equality as a losing battle or even an offense to the system.

      And it won’t be a “reverse marriage equality” case that gets to the Court anyway. It will be a “religious liberty” case.

      Oh, he’ll damage the Court for a generation, but I don’t think we’re going to be high on the priority list.

  • Ninja0980

    Too bad Scalia couldn’t have died earlier.
    One more way he fucked us all over.

    • Silver Badger

      At least he didn’t try to kiss us!

      • Lumpy Gaga

        Pence took one for the team.

  • Chris

    I’m going to go out on a limb here and make a (hopefully true) prediction that social issues will barely be a factor in the Trump Presidency. For one, social conservatism is dying. The national “mandate” that came with Trump’s election had almost nothing to do with abortion, LGBT rights, gays in the military, or transgender bathrooms. People have largely moved on from these issues, aside from a very vocal minority.

    Don’t get me wrong. The next four years will be a DISASTER for the millions of sub-literates that voted for him. They’re only going to get poorer and their factory jobs ain’t ever coming back.

    But I would be VERY interested to see what this Republicans trifecta does re: FADA (if it’s re-written), RFRA, and Planned Parenthood funding. I’m calling their bluff and saying that no bill ever makes it to Trump’s desk. It’s easy to send discriminatory legislation to a Democratic President that would never sign it.

    I predict that the GOP House/Senate tells the evangelicals what they want to hear but turns around and does nothing.

    Now Obamacare on the other hand….

    • Ninja0980

      The ACA is history.

      • Lumpy Gaga

        And while we all focused on James Comey, let’s not forget our hard-hat, lunch-bucket buddies in the boardrooms of health insurers who decided that rates would go up anywhere from 22% to 100% just at the time when many people are making another very important election: next year’s “flexible” benefits configuration.

        “These jobs are leavin’ boys, and they ain’t comin’ back… to your hometown.”

        • Ninja0980

          That was the kiss of death for Democrats taking back the Senate even before Comey did what he did.

          • Lumpy Gaga

            Raw fascist fearmongering. A bullet pointed directly at the heads of peoples’ children.

            (But yeah, it was Debbie Wasserman Schultz’ fault…)

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          The subsidies would have went up as well.

          • AJ Drew

            Yes! Thank you. That is so rarely mentioned anywhere. I get why, cuz it’s still the insurance companies screwing us all over, and the gov’t shelling out more $ to cover their greed, but bottom line was the end-payer of ACA insurance policies would not have suffered a huge change in monthly payments.

        • Lazycrockett

          Some elected official from Michigan was talking bout how much Michigan is hurting cause all the paper mills are closing and his people need jobs. Well you know what society doesn’t use paper like we use too, those jobs aren’t coming back. It’s like people don’t want to educate themselves to do something else cause technology shouldn’t advance or some horse shit.

      • AJ Drew

        Yeah, ACA is toast, and that *is* a social issue, really. So… uff.

      • Lazycrockett

        Dumping 20 million people from health insurance isn’t going to make anyone happy, especially those who voted for the asshole.

        • Chris

          They don’t care. As long as there’s someone else to blame….

        • Todd20036

          Big deal. Trump will say he’s spending the saving of the ACA on “keeping America great” or some happy horse shit, and the deplorables will happily go on wheezing their last breaths in their double wides.

      • ETownCanuck

        I can’t wait to see the reaction his supporters have when it is yanked out from under them, only to realize that just maybe having coverage for their Type II Diabetes was a good thing.

      • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

        I spent two solid years helping people in Tennessee register for insurance through the ACA Marketplace. I saw the hope and relief if brought to people. I’m just sick to my soul thinking about those people losing their healthcare.

      • lymis

        The ACA is history, but all the individual components of it are hugely popular.

        The changes they make will be all to please corporate interests and insurance companies. But things like carrying your kids until they are 26, no lifetime limits, and no pre-existing condition denials are hugely popular.

        As far as the ACA goes, I expect to see something that is, in many ways similar to the ACA, but different enough so that they can claim they repealed Obamacare without pissing off the huge percentage of the electorate that likes the actual provisions of it.

        But I’ve been wrong before, especially when this is almost entirely being voted on by people it will never personally affect – mostly rich people, and all the elected people who have guaranteed government provided health care.

    • Lazycrockett

      We don’t have to wait 4 years, we can take the Senate in 2. That should be our goal and we should work everyday to make that happen. We can stop the madness before our country totally disappears.

      • Dreaming Vertebrate

        Exactly ! That’s the ticket!!

    • BobSF_94117

      I’ll have whatever you’re having, but a small glass… I’m not a drinker.

      It is precisely because he will not, cannot, deliver on his economic delusions that he will need to go after Muslims and abortion rights and gay rights. And, if the going gets really tough, the Jews.

      • Silver Badger

        Like his daughter?

        • lymis

          Didn’t stop Cheney with his.

    • jsmukg

      Chris, this is heartening. You may have a point re social fascism. 🙂

    • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

      Do you think there is any reason to hope corporate pressure will be a factor in keeping Congress in check at least over LGBT issues?

  • Ernest Endevor

    HE LOST THE POPULAR VOTE.

    • Silver Badger

      So did Bush II. So what?

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        “HE LOST THE POPULAR VOTE.”

        LOL I’m sure Hillary is at home, busy needle pointing that on a pillow.

      • Ernest Endevor

        He’s got a MANDY. Wait… MANDIBLE. Wait… MANSCAPE. Wait… MANUMISSION. No, wait… MANDATE! That’s it. Mandate. I miss that mag. Must drink more.

  • Blackfork

    Another money beg wrapped in a feverdream.

  • AJ Drew

    ahhh, Joe! I truly thank you for all you do, but for your sanity and ours, take a nap! Please! We all need to not stroke-out before January, much less before tomorrow.

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

    Oh wow… who had less than 24 hours in the pool? Anyone? Step and collect your winnings.

    • SoCalGal20

      Every other Deplorable came out today. Brian was probably feeling left out.

  • Dale Snyder

    Hey fat ass, why isn’t your first concern the sinful hell-bound gluttony you possess?

    Your fucking BuyBull is very clear on that subject.

    Secondly, what arguments is your fat ass going to present to refute Kennedy’s conclusion of the unconstitutionality of smashing the 14th amendment?

    Go suck a dick you fat piece of christian shit.

  • fuzzybits

    Brian Brown,get a fucking real job!!!

    • ultragreen

      That’s the last thing that he wants!

  • fuow

    This is as good a thread as any to offer a heart-felt ‘fuck-you’ to every gay man who either didn’t vote or voted ‘their conscience’ and went third party.

    • kevin vincent

      Trump probably has np idea who they are I doubt he actually cares in all honestly I say he will just ignore us he is awful but meh don’t think even he wants the backlash from being anti-gay marriage

      • xtal

        Why should we ever expect a president of ours to just ignore us? So tragic that that is a good thing for you, but you voted for Trump anyway..I can tell.

        • kevin vincent

          I voted Clinton

          • xtal

            You should have voted Trump. You would have a been a “racial realist” as they are called.
            I’m sorry, but not really – white americans trouble my heart. they are the biggest and worst trolls of our souls….

        • lymis

          I absolutely don’t want a president to just ignore us, or anyone else. I voted Clinton, and the idea of Trump as president makes me sick.

          But if the only practical choices are being ignored or being targeted, I’ll take being ignored.

          There is ZERO chance of him doing a damn thing that’s intentionally in our favor. That being the case, I’m happier if he just ignores us and leaves us where we are now until we can make changes to get different people in office.

      • Lumpy Gaga

        But it makes for excellent distraction. The best!

        • kevin vincent

          he has the scary Muslims and brown people for thsat

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            But victimizing them (alone) won’t keep his fundie base happy. They will demand BLOOD!!! Guess whose?!

          • kevin vincent

            he wil dump them post haste he never gave a shit abou thtem and they be happy just to hate brown [people and Muslims Racism is their real religon

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            I hope u are a very young person, because that is not how the mind of a bigot/fascist works.

          • kevin vincent

            I am 24 but again Trump will dump them he has no need for them and made it obvious and they were to stupid to realize

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            Then u have not seen true evil. Some of us have, and your casual dismissal of the evil that has beset our nation is troubling. I hope u are right, but I do not think so at all.

          • kevin vincent

            I’m a extreme cynic but Trump only cares for himself he is practically an atheist if he didn’t worship himself to me the Fundies thinking hr will care about them is funny they sold their soul but I developed a very dark sense of humor over the past year

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            You are assuming that Trump is somehow different from every other fascist in recent historical memory.

          • kevin vincent

            He has plenty of other targets that non Fundie racistd will happily go against as I said Brown people and Muslims I think outside Fundies most people just aren’t interested in fighting LGBT rights it’s easier to fight an ‘other’ that doesn’t have th echance to be someone you love

          • Kay

            He’s not a Fascist. He’s a populist nationalist.

          • Dee

            Not when he already have a list of people not supporting him in his pocket. Trump is infamous for being vindictive.

          • McSwagg

            Po-TAY-to … Po-TAH-to

          • Kay

            There is actually a significant difference. One sells out the people to the companies, the other sells out the companies to the people.

          • McSwagg

            Wrong. Try again.

          • IamM

            You’re not being cynical enough. We can sum Trump up in two phrases: Extreme Narcissistic Personality Disorder, and the banality of evil.

          • Kay

            Caring about jobs, wanting to get away from wars, and wanting to focus on domestic problems rather than playing world police is not evil.

          • StudioTodd

            He is the idol of racists, anti-gay right-wing Jesus nuts and misogynist anti-abortion groups…he is evil.

            This should be the first thing you apologize for, Kay. This is your fault.

          • Kay

            I’ll certainly take credit – I’ve been working hard to get Trump elected for some time, voted in a swing state, and helped steal voters away – particularly Bernie supporters.

            As for apologizing, certainly not. Obama has been an absolutely horrible president, and Clinton promised 4 more years. Fuck that.

            I voted for hope and change. It’s not her turn, it’s ours.

          • StudioTodd

            So you admit that you are PROUD to have elected the most unqualified, thin-skinned, unintelligent ill-suited candidate in the HISTORY of this country–a man who is lauded and supported by the most deplorable, hateful, violent and oppressive groups in the world. A man who has been proven to tell lies more often than he tells the truth.

            And you condemn the man whose leadership brought about the end of DADT, ushered in marriage equality, led the only successful effort in the last 50 years to make doctors and medicine available to people who had no hope of ever having access to healthcare, saved this country (and possibly the world) from financial collapse in the wake of the disastrous policies of the last republican administration, did to Bin Laden what all the lying, tough-talking republican war criminals could not or would not accomplish, helped restore our nation’s reputation and image on the world stage after the previous administration had destroyed that image and who appealed to the best, most hopeful and most idealistic aspects of America and encouraged us to be compassionate, inclusive and tolerant?

            Fuck that? No. Fuck you. Trump became president on a wave of lies, hate-mongering, false promises, racism, misogyny, fear-mongering and divisiveness. You choose to be counted among the gullible deplorable idiots who fell for his grift and the despicable hate groups who cheer his victory. You should be ashamed.

            I know you aren’t, though, just as I knew you wouldn’t issue apologies for the emboldened groups which are already promoting their plans to oppress the targets of their hatred. Anytime they speak out, the fact that they are suddenly relevant again, any success they have is your fault. You are responsible. You made it possible.

          • Kay

            You don’t rise through the ranks in politics by being honest and altruistic. Given the reality of that framework, I don’t want someone who is well-suited to a long career in politics.

            I don’t care who else happens to support the candidate. The KKK is generally democrat – not surprising giving their education levels, general level of poverty, and the history. I don’t assume that every Democratic politician is a racist because of it.

            Clinton used DADT and DOMA for reasons of politics. Bush ran an anti-gay platform for reasons of politics. Obama used gays too. Sure, he instructed his DOJ not to defend the law, for which he should get some degree of credit. He didn’t “evolve” his beliefs on marriage until the political zeitgeist went the other direction. He was anti-marriage until equality was popular – Bill and Bush would have been pro-marriage, too, if it was the popular thing to do.

            Obamacare was a disaster from day 1. It made things worse, and killed any chance at real reform. It forced individuals to do business with private companies, or be fined. That’s Fasicm, and I will never support a candidate who does that. I support socialized healthcare, and ObamaCare made sure that’s not going to happen. It is why I lost insurance, along with my employees.

            Honestly, I don’t give a shit about trying to appeal to the world. I support American values, for Americans. If Europe likes the direction the US is going, we are doing it wrong. The US has a history of individualism, of exceptionalism, of producing, of inventing. There’s a reason that aviation internationally is done in English, and in imperial units (something that the US could improve on). Invention after invention, Pax Americana. Was it perfect? No, and there are lessons to learn from history, but the solution is not to destroy American exceptionalism in the interest of international thinking, rather, it’s to make the blessings of that environment available to all within the country borders.

            It’s not our job to better the world – it’s our job to better ourselves.

            You can call Trump a liar – it remains to be seen. You can call him a racist, but racism is just a liberal cry to silence critics. Disapprove of Obama because he’s a horrible president? You’re a racist. Think that voter fraud shouldn’t be easy, and that it’s a problem that California is on the honour system? You’re racist. Think that borders exist for a reason, and that illegal immigration undermines worker protection? You’re a racist. Think it’s a bad thing that union manufacturing jobs went overseas for price, and that taxes should be used to help bring those jobs back? You’re a racist.

            The term has lost it’s meaning, and in so doing, it’s losing it’s power. Fine, this gay Mexican is a racist and a homophobe. This Mexican immigrant who wants lawful immigration is an anti-Mexican racist. Feel better?

            I have no reason to be ashamed. I know who and what Trump is. I also see who Hillary is, and I voted for the better candidate. He is inexperienced, which means I don’t know for sure how he will govern. Maybe Michael Moore is right, and he’s lying. Maybe history is right, and the same man who has done good deed after good deed (even when nobody is watching) really means what he says. Time will tell, and for that I have hope. For the first time in my life, there is a chance that things actually might get better in the country.

            With Clinton, we know what we would get, and we don’t want that. That’s why we voted. That’s why we, the people selected someone else. The military votes haven’t come in yet, and there are more votes in Utah and AZ to be counted. Perhaps it will be an absolute majority, perhaps not. The people have spoken, and I am proud to have given Change a chance.

            One thing I do believe is that Obama was right – “[Hillary Clinton] will promise everything, and change nothing.”

          • StudioTodd

            “The KKK is generally democrat”–You’ve made that shit up. The KKK was democratic in the distant past, but today it is a right-wing organization. They are not standing up for inclusion and tolerance, which are integral planks in the Democratic platform. They are all for keeping the U.S.A. intolerant and segregated, which sounds like your position as well.

            BTW, it’s “Democratic Party,” not “democrat party.” By using that term, you are exposing your Republican leanings. It’s a dog-whistle term and is meant to be derogatory. Also, it is absolutely possible to be a racist with Mexican heritage and a homophobic homosexual (you’re usually called “self-loathing,” although it sounds like you would fall more into the category of “other-loathing”).

            “You can call Trump a liar – it remains to be seen.” Wrong again. He is a documented, proven liar. Politifact keeps up with these things and determined that what he said was true or mostly true only 15% of the time. Compare that with Hillary Clinton, was documented to have said true or mostly true statements 51% of the time Hell, you just have to do a simple Google search to view his many lies. You seem to think that his predilection for lying to serve his own self-interest will magically disappear once he take the oath of office. That is some fantasy fairy tale self-delusional bullshit. Trump is concerned with Trump. Always has been. Always will be. As far as he is concerned, anyone who isn’t on board with that can go to hell.

            You are willingly ignorant if you believe racism isn’t a huge problem in this country today. All those strawman arguments you presented as evidence that racism is passé mean absolutely nothing. You are only proving how ravenously you’ve drank from the right-wing kool-aid. Voter fraud? It’s not a thing. Since 2000, voter fraud has been determined to occur and 0.2%, and that includes even the most remote and questionable allegations. Disapproving of Obama is not inherently racist. No serious person would ever make that claim. But dog-whistling to a racist base–while not as blatant–absolutely is racist. The same applies to the rest of your flimsy straw-men. They only exist in right-wing fever-dreams.

            Racist acts and statements are racist. Period. And Trump has a history of statements and behavior which prove him to be racist. And homophobic. And misogynist. I notice you never really address the latter two, by the way, which is problematic for a purported lesbian, as you will no doubt soon discover.

            You don’t like Obamacare? Join the club. I would have preferred a single-payer system as well. But for millions of people, Obamacare gave them access to medical care they did not have and would never be able to afford. Those with pre-existing conditions and those who were unemployed and diagnosed with major illnesses are able to be treated now, when it would have been financially impossible before Obamacare. Just because it is not ideal or not what I would have preferred does not mean it is not a good first step.

            To simply throw out and dismiss all those who are benefiting from the ACA is cruel and selfish. Trump will not replace it with a single-payer system after it is repealed. YOU MUST KNOW THIS, RIGHT? So how does it make sense for you to use the ACA as an excuse for voting in this nightmare?

            I don’t know you, but I’d be willing to bet that most of the reasons you cite for not choosing the more sane and rational candidate do not even affect you. Her emails would never have had an impact on your life. But her advocacy for women’s rights would have. Her Supreme Court Justices would have had a huge impact (get ready to have your rights to abortion and marriage equality challenged–with NO support from Trump–and say hello to more rulings along the lines of Citizens United). Her experience with diplomacy certainly would have made an impact (what do you think will happen when Trump feels insulted or challenged personally by a foreign leader? That he’ll simply take it in stride and completely forego his aggressive customary response style? If you believe that you are not paying attention).

            And, btw, when Bill Clinton left office (not that it would have been his administration, but still relevant), this country was in the best condition economically that it had been in more than 50 years. That was immediately destroyed by the following administration, which included many of the same players that Trump is tapping as key players in his administration.

            Finally, it is a no longer feasible to be exclusionary in the world today. Countries cannot simply isolate and expect to thrive or even survive. The world financial infrastructure and security systems are too interdependent. You only need to remember back to the near-financial collapse of 2008 to be reminded of this fact. Our reputation internationally matters. A lot. Nations who view the U.S. unfavorably will not be a likely ally, nor will they be inclined to do business with us.

            I’m curious as to what you are describing as “good deed after good deed” that Trump has demonstrated? His charitable contributions and almost nothing and he’s not a public servant or known for his volunteering, so what are you talking about?

            So far, your reasons for voting for this monster seem extremely flimsy and influenced by the scandal-mongering of the right-wing. If you don’t feel ashamed yet, you will in the near future–unless you simply have no empathy for anyone who isn’t Donald Trump. Or maybe you won’t–you are, after all, one of his deplorables. Your value system disgusts me to my core.

          • bitwise

            You should read up on Reagan. He wasn’t an evangelical, but he sure ended up giving them a lot of power and thousands of gay men died as a result.

          • IamM

            Dreaming is correct. He doesn’t care about any of his supporters or the promises he made, but he doesn’t care about anything besides getting what he wants either or think very far ahead. He’ll run us or anyone else over if he decides it’s the path of least resistance.

          • Raising_Rlyeh

            Oh yeah, that’s why the poem “First they came for the jews” doesn’t exist. Fascists never stop unless a bullet or noose is involved. And no, I’m not saying Trump should be assassinated

          • Kay

            He had the fundies, but they weren’t his base. He walked back the abortion comments, and hasn’t said anything about LGBT issues. The only carrot he fed them is a plan to let the churches lobby.

          • Sean Williams

            until he realizes I could marry a scary brown man and get him a green card

        • petewestcentral

          Also, Mike Pence is a theocrat who said his VP role model is Dick Cheney. Power…

      • Piercedchrlz

        tRump has lied every time he has opened his mouth throughout this entire election cycle. I’m hoping every hope he ever gave them of letting them undo the steps toward equality that we achieved in the last eight years is a lie as well.

        That’s my hope anyway, it’s something to hope for, I guess…..

        • lymis

          In part, it comes down to how strongly the people who have his ear are actually against us. I don’t see his kids caring, unless they need to hurt us to score political points. Pence is a scary wildcard in that – hard to say how much it’s personal with him and how much it was pure political calculation as the governor of a red (and redneck) state.

      • SelectFromWhere

        He probably doesn’t really care–but he has brought this with him and now they will expect some payback for helping elect him. That’s how it works, yet another aspect of politics he has no clue about.

      • Trump said the Obergefell ruling was “an appalling decision” and he had to go to bed with the evangelicals to get elected. He will give them what they want. Reversal of Obergefell by a SCOTUS consisting of entirely evangelical Republican judges.

        It will be starting over again I’m afraid.

      • jayjonson

        I doubt that he will tackle the anti-gay marriage meme head on. But his Supreme Court picks will be vetted by Tony Perkins et al. to make sure that they are sufficiently anti-gay and anti-marriage equality. He will also probably withdraw Obama’s executive orders protecting LGBT people from discrimination by federal contractors. And he will try to undermine the EEOC’s determination that sexual orientation discrimination is included in the anti-discrimination prohibitions of the 1964 Civil Rights Act. He will promote “states rights” insofar as “religious liberty” and transgender rights are concerned.

    • R.M. Renfield

      i don’t vote ever for (im)moral reasons, but this is precisely the scenario i was hoping for! may the black rein of our dear leader trump last for 100 years! look upon his works and despair!

      • agcons

        Go eat some spiders, Renfield.

      • Stephen Elliot Phillips

        Firstly he is 70. Dont think his rein will be 100 years. Secondly this is not a fun fantasy video game with orcs and trolls that you find intriguing.
        Yes in the movies sometimes you wanna see what would happen if good doesnt overcome evil.
        Meanwhile in real life 20 million will lose health insurance. Socio-economic disorder will become much worse. The ultra rich will suck up more of your disposable income.
        If you like voting urself into poverty then go for it.
        But remember this isnt a movie or a game. And you just gave away your legitimate future to a naive despot who wont even know when he is being manipulated. And worse he wont care

      • Paula

        Are you using the black reins on your horse? Why are you talking about horses? Are you meaning to use the word reign?
        Doesn’t this mistake embarrass you?
        https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/f9916ff851bfcb2fb3edfc38be9a5a486b440f830077c70890d05afaca0c18b7.jpg

    • andymac3

      On all the battleground states, FL, OH, PA, MI, WI, the vote for third parties was twice or sometimes three times the difference between Trump and Clinton, so third party conscience or protest vote really did screw us all again.

      • Steven B

        Don’t forget the electoral college. That needs to go.
        Here’s a petition to do just that.
        https://actionsprout.io/39C3FE/thanks

        • Frostbite

          People only have a problem with the EC when it doesn’t go their way (pretty much like everything in life)..

          • Steven B

            Wrong. I’ve had a problem with it ever since I learned about it in high school. The EC was put in place to protect us against the vote of an uneducated public. When have they ever stepped in to intervene? Never! And they will not step in even now when it’s needed more than ever. I accepted Bush as a President when Gore got overruled because at least Bush was a sane, if less than competent, choice. The purpose of the electoral college is to protect us against people like Trump. But that won’t happen so it’s outlived its usefulness. And now it’s 2016, with the internet and smartphones in our pockets and the world at our fingertips the argument of protection against an uneducated public can no longer be supported.

          • jimbo65

            And from my understanding of the EC, rural areas are given more weight than urban. Seems kind of an upside down way to elect a president.

          • You’re Wrong

            Well, yes and no.

            The number of Electoral Collage votes a state gets depends on how many representatives the state has in Congress. Therefor, California gets 55 EC votes because it has 53 representatives in the U.S. House of Representatives and 2 U.S. Senators. Where as say Alaska gets 3 EC votes because it has 1 representative in the U.S. House and 2 U.S. Senators.

            That said, California should have 65 EC votes *if* EC votes were given out proportional to population. That is, if each Electoral Collage vote was equal to each other.

            Wyoming, for example, would only have 1 EC vote based on population, but gets 2 extra EC votes. Since EC votes are based on representatives in Congress instead. Hawaii would have two based on population, but gets 1 extra EC to start (since every state starts with 3 EC votes) and then also get 1 more extra EC vote because they have a second U.S. House representative.

            Because EC votes are allotted to states based on representatives in congress, instead of population, it means 1 vote of a registered voter in Wyoming is effectively worth 4 votes compared to that of a registered voter in California because of how the Electoral Collage works.

            The concern, when the constitution was being written, was that the most populous states would entirely over shadow the least populated states. It’s an admirable attempt to attempt to try to balance things, but is it ultimately fair? No way, because the Electoral Collage is fraught with problems.

          • shawnthesheep

            And you just explained why the EC favors rural areas. Wyoming, with it’s population of about 600K, gets 2 electoral college votes for its 2 senators, or 1 EC vote per 300K people. California, with its population of 38 million, gets 2 EC votes for its 2 senators, or 1 per 19 million people. It’s fundamentally unfair an disproportionate representation.

          • EC Guy

            Wyoming has 3 EC votes (2 U.S. Senators, 1 U.S. House member). Or, 1 EC vote per 200k people.

            California has 55 EC votes (2 U.S. Senators, 53 U.S. House members) Or, 1 EC vote to 690k people.

          • lymis

            Not only rural areas, but unpopulous states.

            Even though electoral votes are apportioned by population, each state still gets a minimum of three. Doing the math, that works out that the electors in, say, Wyoming, have three times the influence per voter than the electors in, say, Illinois.

            If the electoral votes were apportioned by actual population, setting the least populous state at one elector and then scaling every other state up from there by population (instead of setting a max number of electors), and they weren’t winner-take-all, but proportional, it might work better.

          • You’re Wrong

            Take any sporting event. Would you be ok if 5+% of the time the loser was given the victory instead? Through the electoral collage you could gain the presidency from just 22% of the popular vote.

            But you don’t even need 270 electoral votes. The house determines the president from the top 3 EC vote getters if no candidate gets a majority of electoral votes or the EC vote perfectly ties.

            Would you be ok with McMullin becoming US President even though he only only obtained say 375,000 popular votes and just 6 electoral votes because that can happen with the electoral collage.

            Would you support the Electoral Collage if HRC won 270+ EC votes, but Trump instead won the presidency because of turn-coat EC voters?

            This is all possible with Electoral Collage. And it’s all indefensible.

          • Frostbite

            You’d be supporting th EC if HRC won because of it even though Trump had the majority of popular votes. Like I said, people scream “down with the EC” every time it doesn’t go their way, and when it does, not a peep.

          • You’re wrong dude

            So you’d be fine with Trump losing the 2016 US presidency if EC votes pledged to him turn and vote instead for HRC or Bernie Sanders?

            You’re really OK with the EC just because *someone* will be happy with the results, not because the results are fair or represent the will of the people.

          • Frostbite

            I never said I was Ok with the EC or that I felt it represented the wishes of the people. I only pointed out you wouldn’t be making a peep about the EC if it had gone the other way for this election.

          • You’re Wrong dude

            So I’m not allowed to express disinterest and dissatisfaction in the Electoral Collage even if HRC gained presumptive nomination to be the next president? I shouldn’t even have to word it that way. It’s a broken system that has to be exploited to gain the presumption of presidency. Even without the EC i’ve got problems with US elections. Since voting for anyone but the nominee of the two current major political parties is a waste. But that’s an entirely different topic.

            So, rather I likely would be “making a peep” because HRC would only have pledged votes EC not actual votes. I’d still be explaining how HRC could lose and Donald being elected because the *actual* election for the president has *NOT* happened.

          • bitwise

            I’ve been against the EC since I learned about it in civics class. It’s an outdated, unnecessary and ultimately undemocratic institution that has made too many elections unrepresentative. Let’s be rid of it at last.

          • gary47290

            The EC is a different kind of democracy. It is not anti-democracy even though we dont like the results of this election.

            We elect the President of the United States not the President of 330 Million Americans. Electing our leader by the states emphasizes the federal nature of our republic and is still important in 2016 not a relic of tradition.

            On a practical level it is important. In a direct popular vote we would have a national recount nightmare. Imagine Florida 2000 in all 50 states and DC! With electoral college, the decision is clear and definitive in just a few hours for all but one or two states.

            Save the Electoral college the save our Republic.

          • lymis

            I’ve had a problem with it since I first heard of it. But I was naive enough at that point to think that politics was about principle, and overlooked the fact that any time there was a popular/EC split, there would be a just-barely-not-majority of people who got the candidate they wanted and would have lost if the EC had been abolished. Twice in recent memory, the Republicans won because of the EC.

            Remember, abolishing it requires not only overwhelming support in a (now) Republican congress, but also has to win majorities in three quarters of the states. There are far more red states than blue ones. Population doesn’t factor into it.

            It’s not going anywhere any time soon.

        • DenverKen

          Sorry, petitions are a joke. When people are willing to go camp in their Congress persons office for a few days we’ll get some attention.

        • Nic Peterson

          Not a bad idea. While we are at it let’s start developing the next candidate that will inspire enough Americans that we win the way the Constituation says we will win. I will never forget the night I saw PBO speak for the first time. I looked over at du jour and said that man will be the next president. Let’s do that again.

          • Cboulder

            Booker might work. I don’t think anyone should be in a hurry to go ahead with Warren. Booker would piss the GOP off enough to make them prematurely jack in their pants and overplay their hand. Additionally, Warren can call out the indolence and inaction of the new GOP while they attempt to undermine his agenda. Maybe he could add a Castro to the bottom of the ticket.

      • MassageBear

        Then there are things to consider like the effect voter suppression laws had and the nearly 900 fewer polling sites across the country.
        https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0c835e974aac7eef30af1696f519742268b6a3a5f8248f69ba5368483c61e2f4.jpg

        • Lumpy Gaga

          Hate. Fried and served on a stick.

          • Librarykid

            sharpened to a point on the end and full of splinters

    • Todd20036

      Or actually voted for Trump

      • x10 if they actually voted for Trump. In states where the margin wasn’t that close in some cases the vote for Stein or Johnson or McMullin didn’t matter. But a vote for Trump is a vote for Trump. Let’s prioritize the blame. It’s not good to vote third party in a close race but to actually vote for that sleazebag is unforgiveable and I mean that. I will not ever forgiven anyone who voted for him gay or not. That includes immediate family.

        • Sadly you and I will NEVER know who voted for Trump and YES there are LOTS of gays (even some right here on this website), whites, blacks, men and women who voted for Trump but WILL never say one word about that…they will continue the farce of HOW shocked and disgusted they are and this reality is REAL

      • Nic Peterson

        None of them should have as much as a grudge fuck for the next four years.

        • David F.

          Next forty works better for me.

    • JohnnyToro

      Yeah, ++++1. I’m so fucking over the goddam apathy in this country. I’ve lived how difficult it is, through the 70’s, 80’s (I’m 58). Why fight anymore, no one seems to care. Frankly, I’m rich, have home abroad, don’t need to worry. Y’all get what you deserve imho, just sick of how pathetic the turnout across the board was to allow this festering pustule to become the president elect. Move to Spain, the water is fine . . . and I’ve long had more legal rights here than I ever had in the country of my ‘birth’. And I may soon have no insurance in the US due to a pre-existing condition (cancer survivor). Hasta la vista suckers.

      • LAguy323

        LOW VOTER TURNOUT
        Clinton received less votes than Obama, McCain & Romney but Trump received less votes too.

        Hey, wasn’t there a Democrat candidate in the primaries who attracted huge crowds, great enthusiasm, record donations, & high voter turnout?
        https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/b6c4ea64f0e6d03ba11328da7dc432b96f963ed4d9ea7b38a2f0ef1d37db1820.jpg

        • 60% of the voters voted BUT 100% of the voters have an opinion about this election…

        • StSean

          but it was “her turn”!

          • jayjonson

            Inasmuch as she got far more votes in the primaries the “exciting” candidate, she deserved the nomination. Bernie was unable to attract minority voters. It is a fantasy to think that Bernie could have beaten Trump.

          • IamM

            Exactly. Nothing against them but I don’t give a fuck about Clinton or Sanders or the Democrats or turn’s or the bonus of how historic it would have been to have our first female president, the election isn’t for or about them.

            I like Sanders, I like that he moved Clinton left on some issues, I’d have voted for him or almost anyone against a GOP nominee, but I don’t think he’d have been a better candidate or president than Clinton.

          • StSean

            Hillary, too, apparently.

        • Gerry Fisher

          I like the recent posting from Michael Moore about “take over the Democratic party…it failed you.” Instead of making it about blame over two specific personalities, let’s make it about general party philosophy and control. Yes, we need to get the Democratic Party back to the left. (I voted for that in the spring, but the party wanted to stay moderate.)

      • Jerry

        Yeah, only 47% of registered voters bothered…and my uncharitable view after this disaster, so far, has been “I’ve got mine, the hell with the rest of you.” I’ll eventually go back to being a sharing and loving person, but not right now.

    • seant426

      It’s times like these when I wish Anonymous would make EVERYONE’S vote public. A huge undertaking? Yes. But if Wackyleaks can do it with emails, Anon can do it with votes.

    • Mark Cross

      And as a bisexual man and a Libertarian I’d like to offer an equally hearty ‘fuck-you’ to every American who has insisted the 2-party, first-past-the-post, majority rule, winner-take-all, non-proportional-representation voting system we currently have is the only way to go.
      The Democratic party nominated an insider, the Republicans wanted someone who would offer regressive change, and your response is to blame…the third party supporters.
      https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo

      • Cboulder

        The orange one won by basically repeating Bernie’s stump speech throughout the period during the debates up until yesterday. You’d think Trump was camping out in Zucotti Park in a luxury tent with gold curtains during Occupy WallStreet . I’m surprised the credibility-lacking cable news opinion networks didn’t call Trump on plagiarizing Bernie like they did with Melania.

      • lymis

        I think the country would be healthier with a robust and functional multi-party system.

        But when it’s clear that the third party hasn’t the slightest chance of actually winning, and the damn-near-tied candidate is Donald Trump, then on election day, having a robust third party system isn’t an option, and it’s ludicrous to pretend that it is.

        Give me a chance to do something that supports a real three party system, and I’m there with you.

        And seriously, let’s have a third party show up with a prepared, qualified, serious candidate, and we can talk. The two that turned up this cycle were both transparent jokes. People vote for a candidate, not a nebulous principle of how things ought to be, and President Johnson or President Stein would have been jokes no matter how important a change to the system might be, or even how valuable actual Libertarian principles or whatever-the-hell-the-Green-Party-thinks-it-stands-for might be in the running of our country.

        Third party voters are not the only people to “blame,” not by a long shot. Not even as one of the biggest factors – the media that let Trump’s flat out lies be treated as less important than the hugely overblown email “scandal” and gave every single Trump appearance full start-to-finish live free coverage bear far more, and I’ll never forgive Comey for what he did.

        But no, you don’t get to pretend that in THIS election, third party voters did anything but throw it to Trump.

        • Mark Cross

          Hillary won the popular vote! So YOU can’t blame voters who chose other candidates for her failure to become President.
          The electoral college, and the first-past-the-post system are the problem.

      • fuow

        Enjoy the next four years, dahlink – you got what you wanted.

        • Mark Cross

          I got what I wanted just as much as you got what you wanted, dahlink – which is to say, neither of us did.

    • Gigi

      Twinks For Trump CANNOT suck my dick!

    • LAguy323
    • StSean

      Or just assumed it was “her turn”.

    • Jerry

      Speaking of fuck-you’s, I got another email today from EventBrite for events around the Philly area…included a Milo appearance in Media, PA for $10. I now realize I am getting these emails because I attended a paid event during the DNC in July…but all 7 levels of hell would freeze over before I attend a speech by him, much less pay for it.

      • McSwagg

        Check the fine print of the email. It should have an ‘unsubscribe’ link. It’s usually at the top (header) or the bottom (footer). That is, unless you wish to continue to receive their emails.

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

    Can we all just talk about something else?

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Yeah, well, I downloaded a full audience-capture of Lady Gaga’s NC speech and performance, but by the time it finished, The News had dropped, so I couldn’t even distract myself with THAT. Didn’t even want to watch.

      It’s gonna take time, but yeah, some high-camp headlines might help.

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        I tried watching that live but all of the audio was just the canned muzak. Not that it matters now, but there was an engineering problem with the live feeds for both rallies.

        • Lumpy Gaga

          No, I think it was rights for music retransmission — TV networks does not haz dem.

    • Treant

      It rained here today, the first in ten days. We’ve been inches low every month since May, so this is very welcome. Even if it is only a quarter inch.

      My husband and I are finally tying the knot formally tomorrow (we figure we better do it before Trump gets his teeny fingers into the pie, and really, we’ve been planning it forever). We’re doing the Quaker license in PA so there’s no officiant–neither of us feel that anybody else needs to or has the right to pronounce us married. We do that, and we did it fifteen years ago this October.

      I washed the sheets today and tried something new–Purex Lavender. I like it.

      The soap I made for Christmas is now past its initial curing period and I’m testing it. This formula is magical, with gorgeous hand feel, fantastic lather, long-lasting bars, and great scents. It took five years, but I finally got it nailed.

      • Lumpy Gaga

        The washers and dryers in my building have, for months now, been eating coins and nt working unless I take a hammer to smash the drawer in, and the back of it to pry the tray back out.

        Any hints from Heloise on why the fuck that’s happening suddenly on four different machines?

        • AJ Drew

          Heloise says: cuz someone’s been smashing the machines with a hammer.

          • Lumpy Gaga

            I didn’t start the fire. The coins don’t drop IN with anything less.

          • Silver Badger

            How far away is the laundromat? Have a plan B before taking drastic action.

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            LOL – simple, causal explanation !
            Occam’s razor.

          • AJ Drew

            yeah, I need to sharpen that. It’s on the to-do list.

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            Yeah mine got dulled a bit carving big chunks out of orange pumpkins – it was very therapeutic.

          • AJ Drew

            Hmm. I need to try that. Many rotting pumpkins sitting by neighbors’ front doors… hmm.

        • Silver Badger

          The coins allow the collector to be pushed in far enough to activate the start mechanism. This part breaks regularly. Try pouring super glue on your quarters. This will force either a repair or removal of the washers and dryers.

          • Lumpy Gaga

            But they have repeatedly come, and even put a few clearly new coin units in. Is it these wussy new quarters I’m getting from the bank?

          • Silver Badger

            Do they have Trump’s picture on them? The machine might be rejecting them.

          • Lumpy Gaga

            I really don’t see why they won’t take my sovereign citizen tokens.

          • Silver Badger

            Blind Prejudice.

        • Treant

          You might try the tiniest bit of WD-40 on the tray’s contact points. Given the humidity in most laundry rooms, they do tend to get a little sticky at best, and rusty at worst.

      • AJ Drew

        your description of your soap is almost erotic… you really like your soap, and I think I do too.

        • Lumpy Gaga

          Manly, yes, but I like it, too.

        • Treant

          A properly done soap is a sensual experience, from the way it feels in your hand to the richness of the lather, the scent, and the way it makes your skin feel.

          I am *not* a proponent of any American or European brand of soap. They feel flat, the scents are overly perfumed, they dry the skin, and they have no softness to the hand feel.

          • AJ Drew

            Intentional or not, you are a subliminal marketing genius. I want your soap so bad. lolz.

          • Ernest Endevor

            As a vegetarian I creep out at the lard aspect.

          • Treant

            So many do, but it’s more environmentally sound than its plant-based alternative, palm oil. That kills orangutangs, plus encourages rainforest deforestation.

            On the up side, pigs are never killed for lard. It’s a waste product, and if I didn’t use it, it would end up in the landfill. We produce megatons more than we need per year.

          • Ernest Endevor

            I totally get it. My problem, not yours.

      • Ninja0980

        Congrats on your marriage!

      • Lumpy Gaga

        My husband and I are finally tying the knot formally tomorrow

        Way to bury the lede, why don’t you?!?!?!.

        Mazel Tov cocktail!!!!

        • AJ Drew

          Truly! and yes, congrats to Treant!

        • houstonray

          CONGRATS!!!!!!!!

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        OK. I have to know. Why does all the popular air freshener from Febreeze all smell like Gain laundry detergent? Is that a thing? Did someone make Gain happen?

        • AJ Drew

          why yes, Febreeze did!

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            STOP trying to make Gain happen!

          • AJ Drew

            lolz… I hate Gain, and Febreeze. I can tell you which of my neighbors use it, just from walking by their homes.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            Have you ever been near someone a damp or humid day and they smell like a basket of wet laundry? Now they add scent boosters on top of that and additional layers of scented body, hair and skin care products and then cologne and perfume. It’s not just me, right?

          • AJ Drew

            I’m not even sure what your question is. Umm… may I have some frozen waffles and margarine, please?

        • Treant

          The same base oils, obviously. 🙂 I tend to avoid soap scents (or scent in my laundry detergent) that are overly ozone or airy. They’re so common.

          They’re also associated with “fresh” or “rain,” so you see them a lot in stuff like Febreze and Gain.

          I make my own air freshener (I know what’s in it, and it’s harmless) out of peppermint and ginger.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            No, people purposely want to smell like Gain. They intentionally adopted the smell of wet laundry as their essence.

          • Treant

            Yep. The ozone scents are relatively new (1980’s to 1990’s), so they’re still a popular fad. Things tend to go in cycles, and I notice a lot of ozone notes in perfumes and colognes and air fresheners these days.

            I’m old-fashioned and prefer the wood scents, the sharper florals, and grassy notes.

          • wayne

            In colognes, I’ve always loved Aramis. It’s the scent of my first love. Scents can trigger memories as much as photos. That was back in the seventies, but just opening the bottle makes me think of him.

        • Ernest Endevor

          Febreeze was first made with no scent. It absolutely killed bad odors but no one liked it. Then they added those cloying ‘free!’ scents and it became a mega hit.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            That’s why I loved it. I still by the no scented spray. It’s great.

          • Ernest Endevor

            Do they make such a thing? I’ve not been able to find it. Would love to use it because dogs.

      • SoCalGal20

        Congrats! (On your marriage and perfecting your soap recipe!)

      • Silver Badger

        Congratulations to both Trent and Lumpy Gaga. May they have many happy years with their spouses. Or is that spice? Better if it’s both!

        • Lumpy Gaga

          No, no. Treant’s getting married. I’ve had the ball and chain with me legally since 2010.

          • M Jackson

            Congrations for getting hitched to ol’what’s-his-name.

      • NZArtist

        Congratulations on your marriage, soap, and laundering.
        Sounds like you’re a very lucky man. 🙂

      • Todd20036

        Congrats Treant.

        I took my frustrations out in a good spin class. Not as impressive as your news, but it helped me feel a little better.

        It’s 10pm, and after being up until 2am yesterday, I’m exhausted.

        Take care JMGers. I think I’ll be only coming to this page for awhile.

        I just cannot take the trolls who are going to gloat over their raping, bigoted, ignorant, fascist, misogynistic, inexperienced, conniving CheetoMonster.

        • Ernest Endevor

          Darling, one can always do the blocky-thingy. And this is not the end of the world. It’s not even the beginning of the end. We have two felony trials for fraud. We’ll miss you.

      • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

        I’m very interested in taking up soap making. Do you make your own Castille base or use a premade product? I have 10 nieces and nephews, and I plan to make bubble bath and bath bombs as part of their Christmas presents. One has very severe skin allergies, so I am trying to find extremely natural and gentle recipes. Poor baby has never had a real tub full of bubbles.

        • Treant

          I make my own from base oils and lye (no lye, no soap…no lie–the gentleness is in the correct balance). Castille in its formal definition (pure olive oil) is not a favorite of mine. It feels terrible, has a low, sparse, and sticky lather, doesn’t clean very well, and never dries out.

          • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

            Thanks for the information. I obviously have much to learn. Of course now that I no longer have any interest in reading/watching the news or going out into public with the masses who supported this mess, I have time on my hands to work on my new hobby.

          • Treant

            http://www.soapmakingforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=11

            You’ll find these people invaluable and very, very helpful (I’m also over there under a different name).

            I definitely suggest some safety equipment for handling lye–I always use rear-venting goggles–but also don’t be terrified of the stuff. I’ve gotten lye splashes and as long as you know it happened (you will if you’re paying attention) and rinse immediately and thoroughly, it does no harm. Just don’t get it in your eyes. Ever.

          • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

            Thanks for the tip!

          • McSwagg

            The chemist in me wants to tell you that lye is the main ingredient in Easy-Off Oven Cleaner and Draino. You should definitely be cautious and wear goggles, gloves and a water resistant apron when working with it (think chemistry lab) but don’t be any more afraid than you would be cleaning your oven or unclogging a drain. Good luck in your endeavors.

          • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

            Thank you for the caution. I am just beginning this little project. My only experience of lye is from my childhood when they had lye soap demonstrations at Silver Dollar City (now Dollywood) in Pigeon Forge. I have lots of research to do before I start. My new hobby list is growing. In the last three days, I have bought the materials for arm knitting, book folding, bath bomb making, bread baking, and homemade Christmas ornaments. I may be slightly manic. It’s definitely possible.

          • McSwagg

            Wow! You’re really ambitious.

          • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

            Stressed… the word you are seeking is stressed. Also, I’m thinking I made need a trade in the post-apocalyptic society. I fear my retirement may be a thing of the past, and English teachers will probably not be especially necessary.

          • McSwagg

            I hear you. I am certified to teach Science and Math, but am totally disillusioned by the educational system in my state. It’s all about watering down the curriculum and passing the students as social promotion. Then the politicians complain because so many college freshmen are so ill prepared they have to take two years of remedial courses before they can begin even begin to handle entry level college work.

      • Ernest Endevor

        Good for you. The first 35 years are the worst. After that you lose the will to live. Just remember, a good marriage has to find room for hatred. And that is my marriage blessing on you.

        BTW. Have you ever tried lavender oil? Sprinkle a little on a piece of cloth or paper towel and toss it in the dryer? To my nose the manufactured products sweeten up the scent. I love how sharply bracing lavender is till it warms from body heat. But since you make soap you’re likely much more knowledgable than I.

        • petewestcentral

          Ernest, thank you for the nice laugh. That sure felt good today.

      • lymis

        Congratulations on getting hitched!

        • Treant

          Thankew, thankew!

    • Silver Badger

      I look at this as a grieving period. People have to get it out to get over it. I’d much rather talk about sex myself, but it is what it is.

    • AJ Drew

      umm… what’s your favorite color?

      • Dreaming Vertebrate

        Absolutely no one better say “orange”!!

        • AJ Drew

          ha!

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        I’ve always favored blue. You?

      • Treant

        Blue.

        You know that blue color the zenith turns in midsummer about 30 minutes after sunset, while the day-blooming flowers are still open and scenting the warm air, but night is definitely on its way?

        That blue.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          and you’re just now getting married? that’s your roll? and it hasn’t happened until now? i had to take a breath after I read that.

          • Treant

            I don’t expose that part of my personality very much (I’m actually usually called utterly logical and a little cold). But it’s there, and I’m off-kilter enough the last day or so for it to be leaking through a bit more.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            I meant that to be a compliment. It’s one of the most beautiful things I’ve read in a long time. Anybody can write about a place. Very few can take you to that place with their writing.

    • NZArtist

      Heading into summer here. Went for a naked walk in the forest. It was very pleasant.

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        Sounds wonderful! Winter is upon us here. The mountains here in SW Virginia are beautiful, but cold.

        • jsmukg

          Are you anywhere near Mt. Rogers, Jal? I used to love going there and up the trail to the top.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            No, that’s down near the NC / VA border. I’m up near the Roanoke Valley on one of the beautiful, but nameless and nondescript mountains.

          • jsmukg

            Yes. I know exactly where. I’m from NC originally. sigh.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            If you’ve ever heard of Floyd County, Copper Hill or Bent Mountain then you know where I am.

          • jsmukg

            Yes indeed. I knew someone who lived in Floyd.

      • Treant

        Pix or it didn’t happen.

      • Lumpy Gaga

        Ticks, girl.

        • NZArtist

          No ticks here. New Zealand is very safe for naked forest walks. No snakes, no poisonous spiders, no bears or wolves… Well there was one bare bear in the forest today, actually.

          • M Jackson

            New Zealand? Get ready for an influx of lots of Yanks.

          • NZArtist
          • Ninja0980

            Hmm.. the hubby and I might have to try that sometime.

          • NZArtist

            I own 100 acres of private safe forest. You’re welcome to stop by and do whatever obscene things you like, naked in the forest. 🙂

    • Lumpy Gaga
      • Lumpy Gaga

        (There’s a photo on this page where you can totally see Norma Shearer’s nipples.)

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        I had no idea until I watched the movie “Big Stone Gap” that she almost died right here in SW Virginia by almost choking on a chicken bone.

        • kelven

          Have you seen this comedy classic?

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FvmEeLjmBCo

          • TimCA

            Oh Wow! I looked for this online about a year or so ago. I was never able to successfully find it. Thanks for posting!

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            LOL

          • Texndoc

            Remember watching that LIVE with my father laughing so hard he had tears in his eyes. In those pre-South Park and internet days, that skit was considered mildly shocking for it’s blatant making fun of a real celebrity.

    • M Jackson

      “This Is Us” on NBC? At what point in the hour will you bawl like a baby?

    • Ernest Endevor

      I planted 250 tulips over the last few days and 50 daffodils. Now I’ve got some slick hellebores to put in – they’ll bloom in Feb, pushing up through the snow. I also planted an autumn blooming clematis where it will climb into a broken down crack willow outside the dining-room window. Next September it will be covered in tiny white star-like blossoms heavy with scent. Tomorrow I’ll put in another, a pale lilac that will bloom in late June. The willow itself sets catkins that look like pearls in the early spring.

      Here’s a happy girl in the tulip garden a couple of years back. We have allies now. This is not the end. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/c83d0953863e503adcfbec184b02b11cc129bfb3608e0fa94b726da35c46c917.jpg

  • Silver Badger

    NOM is using psychological warfare. If they can convince us loss in inevitable, we won’t fight as hard.

    • Ray Muñez

      He has been pissed off for years by our side saying that marriage equality is inevitable, so he is just trying to throw the word back at us. But the truth is that reversal of Obergefell is not only not inevitable, it isn’t even likely

      • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

        For this moment, and we obviously can’t predict the future, there is only one vacancy, Scalia’s. That doesn’t change the numbers from the Obergfell decision. I think all we can do is hope for the continued good health of RBG.

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

    Joy Reid is beyond pissed off. This was her retweet.

    https://twitter.com/tvrasche/status/796442557546954753

    • Lazycrockett

      She has been on a rip the whole day. Go Girl.

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        I’m watching her timeline. She’s re-tweeting and tweeting some extraordinary things.

    • And the church failed to reply “get thee behind me Satan!”

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        IDEK I would have to look it up. I just posted it bcuz it’s Joy.

        • She is referring to the Gospel of St Matthew, chapter 4, verse 8, leaving the reader to recall verses 9 and 10.

          1 Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted[a] by the devil.

          2 After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry.

          3 The tempter came to him and said, “If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread.”

          4 Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.’ ”

          5 Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. 6 “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down. For it is written:

          “‘He will command his angels concerning you,
          and they will lift you up in their hands,
          so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’ ”

          7 Jesus answered him, “It is also written: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’ ”

          8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendour.

          9 “All this I will give you,” he said, “if you will bow down and worship me.”

          10 Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’”

          (New International Version)

  • NZArtist

    Aren’t a couple of his kids due to come out as gay any day now?

  • That_Looks_Delicious
  • Ninja0980

    Someone pointed out on my local news the harsh fact that no matter who was running, it is almost impossible for a member of the same party to win a third term, so for Biden or Bernie bots to say either of them would have won… tall order.

    • ScubabearLA

      It’s happened though, in my lifetime… Reagan/Reagan/Bush the First.

      • Ninja0980

        Only once…not the best of odds.

        • ultragreen

          And FDR, FDR, FDR, FDR, and Truman. And Harding, Coolidge, and Hoover. And Jefferson, Madison, and Monroe. And so forth.

      • houstonray

        And some might say Clinton/Clinton/Gore…

  • M Jackson

    Tony should have spent another paragraph explaining Twitter and Facebook more thoroughly to his hundreds of elderly supporters. They should all have the opportunity to learn something new before they die.

  • NZArtist

    Thanks, Obama.

    • DaddyRay

      Actually we do owe him a great deal of thanks – by forcing it to go to the Supreme Court it makes overturning Marriage Equality a very tall order. Executive Orders will be reversed the first day Trump takes office

      • NZArtist

        Yup. I’ve been thanking him all day for the past eight years of being the best damned president you have ever had.

        • houstonray

          And sadly, may NEVER have again…

          • NZArtist

            Awww… c’mon. One glitch in the Matrix doesn’t mean the world isn’t still progressing.
            Okay you’re going to have a shitty president for four years. Then you’re back on the path to progress. People were saying the same about George Bush, but then there was Barack Obama. Just imagine who you’re going to get after Trump.
            Religion is dying out world-wide. Science is advancing at a phenomenal rate. One arsehole as president for a few years is just a glitch. We’ll get through it.

          • Todd20036

            This shitty president has no qualms about using nuclear weapons.

          • NZArtist

            Of course he has qualms about it. He said lots of shit that he’s not going to do. Do you believe what he said about protecting gay rights? Of course not. He just talks through his arse.
            Nuking something would be bad for his hotel business. Not going to happen.

          • Talisman

            You hope.

  • Dramphooey

    I just heard on CNN some fool was riding through the big protest in NYC and saying “stop protesting! Go to WikiLeaks!” The Left looked for transparency but apparently they are preparing us for tranquilization.

    • That_Looks_Delicious

      Vaccines! Cell phones!

      • ByronK

        Gay hornets!!!

        • EweTaw

          Con trails with glitter!

          • AJ Drew

            oooh, pretty! What, something important is happening?

          • EweTaw

            SQUIRREL! 🙂

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      I’m surprised they let Ghouliani out this late.

  • Branwynn1900

    You are some scary ass motherfuckers. Get a life. Worry about your own house and stay out of our lives.

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      LOL Says the brave little tin soldier who came into our house and interrupted us while we were worrying about our own lives. I can see why the orange anus won. You people are literally (and I literally use that word to mean literally), stupid.

      • Treant

        Like, literally literally?

        • EweTaw

          Literally.

          • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

            f’ing literally. yo.

          • AJ Drew

            YOLO! oh…

  • moebym

    Reading the comments section of a post-mortem analysis on Daily Kos, I was not surprised to see the old Bernie vs. Hillary battles being rehashed, and Bernie holdouts/reluctant Hillary supporters wagging their fingers in an arrogant and patronizing if-only-they-had-listened-to-me-we-would-have-won fashion at her campaign and blaming the loss on her being uninspiring or herself arrogant. Some even lament that Biden or O’Malley weren’t chosen instead of Hillary. These people just couldn’t help demoralizing and dividing us even further by launching into their criticisms before the blood was even dry.

    Stop. Just stop. I’m exhausted and grieving, as is everyone else in our camp. I know we’re all on edge, but we don’t need this shit right now. This can wait.

    Oh, and try not to make personal attacks when making your point. That doesn’t really help.

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      Which is why I suggested midway down here that we talk about something else.

    • friendlynerd

      I had it out hard with a couple Bernie people today. I’ve never encountered anyone more fond of “told you so,” despite no real facts, than that crowd.

      • moebym

        Sooo convinced he would’ve defeated Trump, not arrogant/boring/scandal-ridden Hillary. Easy for them to say NOW.

    • CottonBlimp

      There’s a time for the blame to go around, but I agree this isn’t it. We know who deserves this anger, and for the moment, it’s not ourselves; we voted for decency. Who knows whether Bernie or Hillary would have been a stronger candidate? It’s almost a ridiculous question to ask when Trump was the worst candidate imaginable and he still fucking won because idiots didn’t care.

      In the years ahead, we can talk practically about how the DNC needs to change its strategy. But right now, we should all just agree, that it shouldn’t be Hillary or any other Dem candidate’s job to keep the voters from destroying their own fucking country. Republican voters need to start taking some fucking responsibility for their dipshit decisions. They knew this orange puke was a rapist, a neonazi, a russian plant, a liar, a fucking criminal, and they voted for him anyway, either because they like those things or because they’re such monumentally vapid imbeciles they just thought it might be fun to have a reality TV star running the country.

      The next time there’s a Dem surge after Republicans totally destroy our country (assuming there IS a next election) we need to remember this anger and make those stupid mother fuckers own their fuckup.

      • moebym

        Wish I could upvote this multiple times.

        • CottonBlimp

          Thanks. I think we all forgot the unity we had during the Bush years. Well, it’s time for that shit again. Our differences with other liberals are nothing compared to the gulf I feel towards any fucking person who voted to give that Orange Scrotum the keys to the whitehouse.

      • TrollopeReader

        part of the blame will be assigned (by me) to the 44.6% of those who didn’t vote. shameful — no matter who they might have voted for.

        • CottonBlimp

          I feel that. At the same time, this election went the way it did because the average American voter is such a monumental brainless slug that they’ll base their vote for President on who’s the bigger celebrity (see Reagan). With that in mind, anyone too fucking stupid to not have voted last Tuesday is maybe so stupid they SHOULDN’T vote.

      • petewestcentral

        Has Comey resigned yet. I want that anger satisfied now.

      • People who voted for Trump were probably not going to vote for any Democrat. Another Democrat means more of the same. That’s nonsensical when the sitting president has a 55% approval rating but people are idiots.

        • moebym

          I read about “Trump Democrats” earlier. Depressing.

        • CottonBlimp

          Agreed with your last point, but not your first. Many people who voted Obama last election voted Trump in this one.

          We have to acknowledge a truth that you will never hear in the media; the center of this country are not laudable temperate-minded moderates. The center of this country is made up of fucking know-nothing imbeciles, and Trump won their support not because of his agenda, but because they’re the kind of vapid irresponsible fuckwits who would vote for the funny clown off the TV.

    • Biden didn’t run. I wonder if he might have done better in the rust belt. But would it have been enough. And would he have gaffed his way through the election? Probably. They actually took him off the campaign trail in 2008 for saying things off-message too many times. O’Malley was a nonstarter. Cute, but not particularly exciting.

    • LAguy323
  • Ray Muñez

    Brown is seizing on this because he is desperate to avoid closing up shop. I can’t wait to see NOM’s financial disclosure when he files it next week. It’s probably going to be terrible. Anyway, Trump has no use for NOM and even refused to sign their “marriage pledge” last year.

  • That_Looks_Delicious

    OMFG. Salon is reporting that Sarah Palin and Rudy Giuliani are probably both going to be in Trump’s cabinet. Today is almost worse than last night.

    • SoCalGal20

      Are they going to make Sarah Secretary of the Interior?

      • AJ Drew

        No, that would be Melania, and the job description will be completely revised.

    • M Jackson

      Irwin Allen Productions should be planning his administration. The problem is, we’re all going to be Shelley Winters.

      • AJ Drew

        Poseidon ahoy? Oh, and great, now I have that damn “Morning After” song in my head.

    • moebym

      Sarah Palin.

      oh, god, why…

      • Max_1
        • moebym

          in the interest of not breaking my phone, I will refrain from watching.

        • AJ Drew

          ok, I couldn’t resist, and that was actually very well done and kinda fun (although it does require a mental break from current reality to appreciate it as “fun”.)

      • TrollopeReader

        Will McCain be an enthusiastic supporter? Bristol as head of Abstinence?

        • petewestcentral

          Hey it would be amusing to see Bristol blasting out F bombs on the White House lawn.

        • McSwagg

          Bristle will ‘pull out’ at the last second …

    • AJ Drew

      y’know, so much bs on just day one. Not even day one of DT admin, but day one after the election… makes me hopeful that this amount of incendiary nastiness will burn itself out before January even arrives. Naive, maybe. I’m not letting my guard down, but this much bs so quickly… hmm.

      • Treant

        He may be loathed by almost half the population before he even takes office…and the first President openly booed at his inauguration.

        It risks eroding the respect people have for the Presidency. I’m willing to take that risk in this particular instance.

        • Ninja0980

          Me too, especially if he takes his party with him.

        • petewestcentral

          Trump himself was the bandleader for scads of people to disrespect the Presidency. Seems like a done thing.

        • After the last eight years we are under no obligation to show the least bit of respect for Rapey McTrump.

          • Treant

            And I never will. 🙂

          • McSwagg

            I prefer Rapey von Trump. It fits him better.

    • Dreaming Vertebrate

      Trump’s Idiocracy in full bloom.

    • TrollopeReader

      OMFG indeed. what about bachmann?

      • McSwagg

        Marcus wants to be Secretary of the Interior. He has such grand ideas about redecorating the White House. What’s that? It’s not about decorating but rather the forests and the prairies and dealing with Indigenous People? … [Never mind]

    • ultragreen

      So the cabinet from Hell is beginning to take shape.

    • CottonBlimp

      It seriously feels like we just elected the League of Doom.

      You know how Donald and a lot of his ilk flipped their shit that a bunch of black kids wouldn’t be executed for a crime they didn’t even commit? How can these people be okay with such wretched villains being rewarded? How can they find out that Trump ripped off America and molested women and possibly a child and colludes with a foreign dictator and etc etc etc and not, on some visceral level, want him to pay for his crimes, just to feel like there’s some kind of justice in the world?

      I am praying to nonexistent God that our next Obama comes down on these criminals with the full force of the law. It’s because the Bush gang got away with their horror show that it emboldened all other lying bastard scum.

    • coram nobis

      How long will Sarah last? She runs her mouth too many times off-message, as Secretary of the Whatsis, and “You’re Fired!”

    • KnownDonorDad

      Oh look, a climate change denier might head the EPA:

      http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/who-is-in-president-trump-cabinet-231071

  • SoCalGal20
  • That_Looks_Delicious
  • Dreaming Vertebrate
  • EweTaw

    If Bryan ever got more that twelve people to show up for a NOM rally/demonstration I might worry. That’s not to say “other” evil evangelical assholes might try to pull something, but let’s just remain alert and not lose our heads.

  • Ninja0980

    My husband has finally calmed down after last night.
    All I can say is we’ve been through hellish elections before and survived, we can certainly do it this time.

  • lukefromcanada
  • justme

    Funny how the KOch bro have just faded out of everything… Their monster is now loose on the world and they hide away behind their little wall of money and greed..
    The question now is.. ARE YOU HAPPY with what you’ve done NOW!!!

    • moebym

      They failed to buy Harry Reid’s Senate seat for Heck, so there’s that.

      • Ninja0980

        Harry Reid needs to bring his magic to other states like he did there.
        Republicans in NV got crushed last night.

    • ultragreen

      I don’t think the Koch brothers funded Trump. They didn’t like his position against NAFTA and other free trade deals. Instead, they focused more on the senate races, I think.

      • justme

        No they made HIS rise possible..

      • TrollopeReader

        Bill Koch did, but not his brothers.

  • Steven B
    • NZArtist

      What you really need to do is work at the state level to promote Proportional Representation system of government. When enough states are on board with it, it will become the federal system of elections as well.
      Here in New Zealand we have MMP. The beauty of proportional representation is that even minor parties get a share of power. You are no longer wasting your vote if you vote for someone other than the major parties. This means you’re no longer voting a party out, you’re voting the party you want *in*.
      It tends to make all parties more centrist and less crazy.

      • TrollopeReader

        one of our political pundits (Norm Ornstein, (i think) thought we could try the German model — have 100 of the Congressional seats in the House as at-large seats, so as not to have constant total gerrymandering … i don’t know if those would be at-large across the nation, or at-large per state (2 each) similar to the senate ….

    • Treant

      I’m not a hundred percent on this one. There’s a faint–very faint–chance that the EC would undo a truly terrible mistake (like this one) by voting for his opponent.

      • Earl

        Hardly a democratic point of view. I thought you Yanks loved democracy?

        • Treant

          We’re a representational Republic, not a democracy. Which you’d know if you read the Constitution.

          • Earl

            I’m Canadian, I used to love to watch the old movies too.

            Your nation is rather well known for advocating a democratic from of government too.

            I’ll read your constitution if you read ours. 🙂

        • CottonBlimp

          You think it would be undemocratic if the electoral college backed the candidate who won the vote?

        • IamM

          It’s a mechanism not a suicide pact.

    • ultragreen

      The Republicans will never go along with it. They just won an election because of it.

      • KnownDonorDad

        This will be the fourth time it has happened for a Republican nominee.

  • moebym

    Pantsuit Nation members are sending letters and cards to Hillary. I may join in. It’s a nice way to start the healing process.

    And they’re also strongly encouraging everyone to make commitments to fight for the causes likely to be impacted, whether it’s by making donations or volunteering.

    I am committed to doing my part to make this country a kinder place by engaging in acts of kindness and compassion each day.

    • CottonBlimp

      I really didn’t like her during the primaries. Now I just feel so bad for her. No one deserves what she went through this election.

      • coram nobis

        She still needs to look at real estate in Paraguay.

  • Clive Johnson

    What the Christian right doesn’t realize, and won’t until too late, is that this bigotry will prove a fatal blow to it. The culture has changed in a remarkably short period of time and it’s not settled yet. There’s still momentum in support of LGBT justice and fairness. But if these Christian bigots align themselves with something as odious as annulling marriages or stripping away other basic rights, they will lash themselves to the reputation of intolerance and hatred. The demographic trend line for Christian belief among young people is already steeply in decline. If the Christian right pushes its luck, they will find themselves on the defensive like never before.

    • KnownDonorDad

      I never, ever underestimate them. They’ve got one of their own as Vice President of the United States.

      • Clive Johnson

        I hear ya, but I think what they want to do is such a flagrant act of political violence that the protests that will erupt will scare the shit out of them. At least, they should be designed to do so.

        • KnownDonorDad

          Oh believe me, I hear you as well: I’ve had to console a few friends who thought that the overturn of Obergefell was imminent. It’s roughly as hard to do as overturning Loving v. Virginia. But they have other things they can accomplish – federal level ENDA is dead for at least four years, for example, as are, probably, any pro-LGBT executive orders from the Obama era. I think the trans community will probably bear the brunt of it – Trump was elected in no small part as a backlash to “PC culture.”

    • Bigotry and blatant hypocrisy. Like being anti-gay wasn’t bad enough but screaming about illegal immigrants and then moving one (Melania) into the white house? And Rapey Trump? What did Sondheim say…Careful the things you do, children will see and learn? As an atheist I’m sometimes accused by theists of trying to destroy religion but honestly there’s nothing I could do even with super powers that would be more effective than what they are doing to themselves.

  • Skeptical_Inquirer

    http://jezebel.com/a-list-of-pro-women-pro-immigrant-pro-earth-anti-big-1788752078 This article has a list of organizations you might want to donate to though some are of questionable value. FFRF was mentioned in the comments.

  • Joe Tralongo

    Will be interesting to see how much influence his kids have on him over this subject. They’d also need to go back and have the Supreme Court overrule its own ruling, even with the appointment of another conservative justice, the vote would still be 5-4.

  • Lazycrockett
    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      She’s on it tonight. She has no fucks to give and is actually tweeting fucks. I love her.

      • Treant

        So she’s borrowing fucks to give.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          No, she’s retweeting tweets with “fuck” in them or signs with the visible word “fuck” in them. I’ve never seen her like this.

    • Paula

      I had one of the girls (Hispanic) come up to me and Say “Miss Welsh, will you be my deportation buddy?” We had a good laugh.
      I told her I was born in Canada and wold try to finagle my way back and that I would adopt her and take her with me.

      • medaka

        Paula, you’re one helluva great teacher — that’s obvious. You’re in Texas IIRC?

        I’m having interesting experiences with my college students here in Nippon. I went into my classes today really, really down, and they could tell by my body language and voice that something was different. I said that I didn’t feel so peppy and that I hadn’t slept last night, and asked them if they knew why. A few did. The older ones and the exchange students said “Trump?” and then a few laughed, more in the freshman classes. I shut the smiles down fast and explained to them what it could mean — the loss of marriage equality and abortion rights in the US, the re-militarization of Japan, economic chaos, etc. I gave them worst-case everything. And I told them that, yeah: I’m actually glad I’m old, but I feel bad that they’re young and that their country and the whole world will feel the effects of the next four years for a long, long time. Then I put them into groups to discuss all of this with some very pointed and difficult questions. Resulting discussions were great, but very sombre. This in a culture where “good feeling!” is paramount.

        I got to open many eyes today, and it made me very happy to be a teacher, even though I had to do it through the fear that comes with the truth. You got to make that one student feel safe and free from fear. I think we both won the day. 🙂

  • Macbill

    There is no one who cares more for the gays like Donald Trump.

    Don’cha feel the Love?

    • Treant

      It feels a lot like a butt fucking without lube.

      • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

        Now see, that writing took me somewhere. 😉

        • AJ Drew

          once again with the margarine… sheesh.

    • Max_1

      I feel his love like a supermodel feels his hand when he grabs her pussy…

  • TexasBoy

    Had a long online convo with several people I went to high school with, who voted for Trump. They said they really didn’t like his rhetoric or positions, but that they voted for “change.” They also said they “trust the system” to not allow wholesale rescission of GLBT rights, discrimination against Muslims, and so forth.

    Honestly, this is how brainwashed these people are . Weep for America.

    • Lazycrockett

      Remind them of that when the Congress burns in mid March.

      • leastyebejudged

        You are all doing the same shit that’s a demonstrable failure, time maybe to stop the perpetual bullshit and actually listen to people for a change.

        Pull your heads out of the echo chamber you made for yourselves.

        • TrollopeReader

          sanctimonious prick.

          • leastyebejudged

            It’s not sanctimony, it’s observation, and thanks for agreeing by the default in the bankruptcy of your contributions..

          • Todd20036

            You don’t get it, Least.

            The other side voted for Trump primarily because they are bigoted against a specific minority. That’s pretty much it.

            They hate Obamacare, but don’t realize that their medical coverage without it will be a lot worse.

            They hate illegals, but don’t realize that most illegals are here legally, but with expired visas.

            They want a wall against Mexico without realizing it will break the country.

            They want to end abortion on demand, they want to end gay civil rights, they want to end race based scholarships, they want to gut the Civil Rights Act.

            They don’t want to make America “great” again. They want to make America “White and Christian and Straight” again.

            It’s not an opposing side. It’s fascism. And it really could be the end of America.

            And you really don’t believe me, or even care.

          • Gustav2

            We know exactly what they will do, but somehow we are not listening. What BS.

          • leastyebejudged

            Todd you are just repeating the echo chamber here.
            A parrot would accomplish the same thing.

          • pablo

            So all of those states that Obama won that Clinton did not, turned nazi? No, they didn’t.
            https://theintercept.com/2016/11/09/democrats-trump-and-the-ongoing-dangerous-refusal-to-learn-the-lesson-of-brexit/

        • David L. Caster

          Listen to them say what? Repeat mindless sound bytes like “he tells it like it is” and when you ask them what “it” is, they just repeat the same thing. Some think, and have an answer, but the vast majority don’t have a coherent picture of reality.

          Those that do, I listen to so I can check the basis of their feelings and beliefs. Feelings and beliefs are not facts, so I go further and try to get to what they are really thinking, and even fewer still seem to have a grasp of what’s so. Finally I get to the 5% of them that have actually done some research and can give facts that are defensible as the basis of a soundly formed opinion.

          Often at that point I notice that they are just saying things that many people know to be true but with different words and tinted with a slant that re enforces what they would like to be true whether or not it is. After the filtration process, I can have intelligent conversations with the remaining 2% of real conservatives that have done their homework. I may not agree with them, but I can respect their intellect because they have actually challenged the noise and picked out a shred of truth to hang their arguments on. It is this sliver of conservatives that I want to interact with and would be willing to work with to form a true, based in reality, and soundly reasoned consensus.

          • The framing bias and confirmation bias are astonishing amongst his supporters.

        • Gerry Fisher

          There’s a difference between how we talk among ourselves and how we’d have conversations with others. This conversation here is fine, IMO. When it comes to talking to “them,” I think it’s important to talk gently about how effective political change works, how random and radical change often affects people, to “bear witness,” and to display for them the consequences of the election. Gently drawing connections between the election and what came from it, all without blame, but more in a spirit of educating someone who doesn’t understand how political change really works.

          …and then we can come back into JMG to vent a bit.

          • Trog

            well said!!!

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I loathe how cavalier they are. It’s not like they’ll apologize if they’re wrong.

      • AJ Drew

        but they’ll scream bloody murder when it suddenly has an impact on them.

        • Todd20036

          And blame us anyway

          • John

            The CIA Got It Right Once more. This Is the Undeniable Proof …

            http://isisprep.top

            This is The CIA’s the majority of stunning declaration yet,

            However the mainstream media isn’t saying a word concerning it!

            Exactly what are they really attempting to conceal?

            I’m sending this to all my close friends, family members and also patriot siblings …

            As quickly as I could …

            Because it’s the ONLY video I have actually seen that discloses the “April Surprise” no one is speaking about …

            This is larger as well as far more harmful than ISIS could have ever before come to be.

            And it’s gone to YOUR neighborhood …

            MEANS faster than you believe.

            P.S. A few of America’s richest are currently spending numerous countless dollars to plan for this …

            And when you watch this presentation you’ll comprehend why.

        • Gerry Fisher

          And it will. “How did this HAPPEN?!”

        • Orly

          Exactly. I’m going to take a wait and see approach. It’s not like we have any choice.

      • Gigi

        Their lives won’t be changed so…whatevs.

        • Todd20036

          Some people are like that.

          I live in a blue district.

          I have single payer medical insurance.

          I have a stable job.

          I have a funded pension.

          I’m too old to be eligible for a draft.

          So why do I care about those less fortunate or unlucky enough to be in a red state?

          Because I have a soul, and because a big part of why I’m in such a good place financially is pure luck.

          Luck got me born into an upper middle class family. Luck gave me enough mathematical talent to get a needed mathematical job.

          Luck gave me a job that has the best medical insurance possible. Three months of HIV meds should cost me $5000. It costs me $100.

          And luck has me in such a democratic stronghold that I will never lose my individual freedoms – so long as Congress butts out of my business.

          But luck can be a fickle mistress, and I don’t consider myself better than most of my brethren, merely more fortunate.

          So yeah. I donate to homeless gay youths whose families throw them away. And I weep for people who will lose medical insurance and other freedoms because this country is not the same country I thought it was not too long ago.

          • Gigi

            You’re a good man.

          • I forget who it was who observed “I don’t have children, but I’m happy to pay taxes to support the school system. Why? Because I don’t want to live in a nation of ignoramuses!” That general concept can be expanded, as you have, to allow for supporting all kinds of services for other people not as fortunate as you and I.

      • Gerry Fisher

        YES! It’s like, I get that this doesn’t affect you that much, but how DARE you mess with my life to this extent based on a naive and fleeting whim.

    • moebym

      I met a woman who was of that mindset. Utterly perplexing and maddening. She would not listen to reason at all.

      • Gerry Fisher

        Because it’s not about reason. It’s about emotion. The best I’ve seen a liberal break through to that emotion was in Michael Moore’s TrumpLand video. (And even though he had the conservatives nodding their heads and crying a bit, who knows if he changed their vote.)

        • Gerry Fisher

          The other thing that makes this difficult is that there isn’t “a” Trump voter, despite the media’s jonsing for defining one. He had a coalition of a handful of different types. Just to name a few off the top of my head: I always vote Republican, We need to mix it up with some change, I just lost my job or home and I want to blame it on a convenient scapgoat, I’m terrified of a changing America and want it to stop instantly, the professional and dedicated racists and haters, the cagey Republicans trying to position themselves for power should Trump win or lose, the sexist who’s unreasonably turned off by Clinton, and maybe a few more that I’m not thinking of.

          Cobble them all together, mix in two third-party candidates, add a bit of a lack of enthusiasm from the Democratic base that cut across demographic, and we have the anatomy of a presidential loss.

    • CottonBlimp

      I think the “system is rigged!” rhetoric got so out of hand that people just accepted the idea that they don’t have an actual voice in Democracy. They do. They always did. There is no system, because the system is the voters, and they dropped the fucking ball!

    • HanyBaal

      Us Mooslims have a proverb that applies to those ppl: He whose hand is in water shouldn’t pontificate to those whose hand is in the fire.

      • Todd20036

        Don’t you mean “poverb”?

        • Librarykid

          Good One! I thought that was forgotten. It certainly must have been overlooked at the time of installation. So much for the keen surgeon’s eye.

    • I’m sure they claim they were just appalled by the racism and sexism and rapiness of Trump. Yeah. It bothered them so much they waited in line to vote for him. People like that aren’t fooling anyone but themselves.

    • IamM

      Yeah the tea party controlled Republicans in congress are going to rein in Trump’s assaults on civil rights.
      😡😡
      And rather than change the legislators who have been blocking every attempt Obama and the Democrats have made to try and make things better for all Americans, let’s turn to a deranged, incompetent bully who has never helped anyone but himself and wouldn’t know how to if he cared.

      • canoebum

        When our rights are taken away, he’ll make a few comments about it at an impromptu news interview at one of his golf courses, but he won’t be concerned enough to miss his tee off time.

      • Gerry Fisher

        THAT’S the thing that drives me nuts. The Republicans escape accountability for all the crap they’ve pulled.

        • IamM

          So far they’ve been rewarded. 😡

    • Do Something Nice

      Actually, this is supposedly quite common among Millennials, who grew up under the era of rights and can’t conceive that these rights can be taken away. Thankfully, among those who voted, they overwhelmingly voted for Clinton.

      • Gigi

        Don’t blame Millenials. People of all ages think they can “slow them” by voting for the opposing candidate. I’ve never understood that rationale. How will giving all the power to the people who hate you make your life better?

        • Do Something Nice

          I wasn’t blaming Millennials. I was saying what pollsters found. And, as demographic group, Millennials overwhelmingly voted for Clinton.

          • Gigi

            Sorry, I obviously misunderstood your comment.

          • Do Something Nice

            No problem. We are all rattled by the election.

      • Jerry

        I blame the 47%, of whatever age, that was registered but didn’t vote…that, and it appears the GOP’s voter suppression tactics are working.

    • Puckfair52

      happy thinkers Happy Thoughts will keep the mean old GOP from hurting our gay friends.Like my GOP relatives say they work from the inside for change….BULLSHIT

    • JT

      Idiots.

    • Gustav2

      In the late 90’s I supervised catering for a Republican fundraising luncheon where my congressman spoke the usual anti-gay/marriage/family values rhetoric. He later recognized me, we went to high school together and our childhood homes were around the corner. I will never forget what he said to me as he shook my hand.

      “Of course, I don’t mean you.”

      • Librarykid

        From the same book of quotations as “Some of my best friends are (fill in the blank).

    • Gigi

      Have they been asleep?

      • Librarykid

        just willfully stupid

    • dcurlee

      Sad. I had pretty much the same conversation with some people

    • A brit

      Huge numbers of people are pissed at both parties and elected Trump as a big fat fuck you to everyone in Washington. Democrats and republicans in succession have shipped their jobs and livelyhoods abroad, so people voted to detonate an orange hand granade in the face of the rich, politicians, bankers and the media, damn the consequences.
      The exact same happened here in June, people just want to see the establishment in pain.

      • Baker Matthew

        No they did not. So many incumbents won and veteran politicians will be in Trump’s cabinet. This was white people (Republicans and Democrats) voting for the guy who promised to kick certain groups out, keep certain groups out, lock certain groups up, and give them “their” country back. The establishment isn’t in pain…but many Americans will be. THAT was the plan.

        • Gerry Fisher

          Getting back to “magical thinking” (aided and abetted by Trump rhetoric), many people way over-estimate the power of the presidency. They aren’t focused on Congress. The whole idea that the slow rate of change during the Obama years was due to 6 years of a Republican Congress hellbent on obstructing everything he did was LOST on them. They didn’t really hear about that.

      • Dave Babler

        Jobs were lost because of automation dumbass.

    • Gerry Fisher

      I’m seeing a lot of the same thing. It’s a kind of mindless, “Well, it’s been 8 years, my mood isn’t great, let’s change it up.” In a normal election year, it would mean that minorities have to work harder and fight back harder. In *this* election year, we risk the health of our civic institutions. They have no *idea* what they’ve unleashed onto the country, just because they felt a whim to “mix it up a little” like changing Pandora stations. It’s…disheartening.

    • Trog

      I’ve been having very similar conversations with Midwestern folk I grew up with and who are Trump supports. I don’t think they’re racist or anti-gay. Their situations suck and they want CHANGE. They honestly (and stupidly) think Trump won’t be taking away LGBT rights, etc.

      What complicates the situation is that these folks really resent being called bigots and homophobes and idiots. When we on the left resort to that name-calling (even if it’s true) we ruin chances to win allies.

      So frustrating.

    • Orly

      Yeah, I’ve heard the same thing. “I’m not racist, I just hate Hillary/political correctness/trade agreements/whatever”, or some such nonsense.

      So, I’m going to just wait and see what happens when the racists and domionist theocrats who supported Trump start asking him for repayment. Let’s see just how much BS Trump was throwing.

  • David From Canada

    NOM’s plan ain’t gonna happen. Even Donald Trump wouldn’t be that foolhardy to undue a legal process that is become popular around the world. He has to keep peace in his own country. He’ll throw the homophobes a few crumbs and fake promises but that’s it.

    • David L. Caster

      Perhaps he will finally disabuse the christofascists of their belief in their own special privilege. In his mind, he didn’t need them to win and he can do as he pleases. He’s a conman and he fooled everyone of those that he took in. He said nothing really, made a lot of promises he can’t keep, and generally made a mockery of the system which he wants to completely throw over anyway.

    • canoebum

      First he’s going to live through the tumultuous wake-up call that will follow repealing the Affordable Care Act, throwing 20 million Americans off of their health insurance. I can say without fear of contradiction that act will result in something akin to the LA riots, only this time, nationwide. He may lose some of his enthusiasm for burning things down after a major few cities are brought to their knees by people who once had a doctor, but no longer do.

  • Talisman

    Right now, it’snot “inevitable”

    Trump might replace Scalia with a conservative justice, but it will still be 4 to 4 with Kennedy as swing vote.

    To make it inevitable, RGB, Breyer, Kagan, or Sotomeyer would have to resign or die.

    I hope 83 year old RGB and 79 year old Breyer can hold on for 4 more years.

    • Platos_Redhaired_Stepchild

      More like 8 years. George W Bush served 2 terms and even Republicans thought he was terrible.

  • DaddyRay

    Donald doesn’t like people who reveal their plans in advance

  • Sam_Handwich
    • Ninja0980

      Shooting, several injured.

      • Lazycrockett

        Guess its time to start buying bottled water and canned goods.

        • TrollopeReader

          Paging Jim Bakker !!

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            I’ll take a four year’s supply of apocalypse slop buckets!!
            Plz rush!

          • AJ Drew

            who knew? he really is a prophet. I’ll still pass on that “food”.

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      I’m listtening to the feed live. It’s not a drill.

      http://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/20365

    • Lazycrockett

      Is Seattle the city where that weird guy pulled a gun cause he was afraid non pro Drumpf protesters were going to attack him?

  • KnownDonorDad

    Oh, it’ll be as “inevitable” as their predicted wins in Windsor and Obergefell.

    Stare decisis, mofos.

  • Secure

    Leave it to the states like Ted Cruz said he wanted to NOM? Break up marriages all across the nation by a president who’s been married three times NOM?

    • AJ Drew

      Yes, actually. Yes, you got it right.

  • SoCalGal20

    I am seeing all the protests on my twitter feed. Does the heart good.

    https://instagram.com/p/BMnOjlSBx7b/

    • Lazycrockett

      20 blocks long.

      • Treant

        By NOM numbers, that’s half a million!

      • houstonray

        There have been protests here across Texas today and tonight. I just hope these continue and grow and become a regular thing. If we can put the fear into the R’s that they might just lose their jobs in 2018, maybe the won’t give a rubber stamp to Trump.

        It begins today,,,

        • Blake Jordan

          Donnie was saying anything to get the job, he probably does not give a shit about most of what he said…

          The actual fear is what the rethuglican majority congress will pass, and Donnie will sign with out paying attention.

          As long as Donnie gets all the publicity / photo ops, and a clear way of how he will be even richer when leaving the presidency (inheritance tax gone, etcetera)… his will just be the final signatures on whatever his administration and the rethuglican majority congress come up with!!!

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give
  • Sam_Handwich

    i love the colors and composition of this shot from NYC tonight

    https://twitter.com/JimCaruso1/status/796549030264311808

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      With all these people, it should be pretty easy to take him out. Isn’t there a name for that? A coup or something?

      • Treant

        A deuce coupe de Utah or something.

        • EweTaw

          A blue deuce coupe or “stroke of the state” – as in the swiping or stroke of a sword. Yeah. One of those.

    • TrollopeReader

      are those taco trucks?

    • LAguy323

      Resistance is futile.

  • Taylor

    This sounds a lot like a setup for a new round of fund raising. NOM should be releasing its 2015 financial statements next week. I’m guessing things are pretty grim for them right now.

    I have a feeling we will be getting a lot of “help fund our attempt to overturn Obergefell” emails and twitter posts.

    If Brown sees a way to squeeze a penny out of someone, he’ll definitely make the effort.

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give
  • Max_1
  • coram nobis

    He owes them nothing. I’ve seen deer ticks that were less inhibited about getting free rides and parasitic nourishment than this bunch.

  • Blake J Butler

    I’m not watching the news for a long while possibly for the next 4 years. I am probably going to be looking at a therapist to talk to as I cannot handle the damage that he and his ilk are going to inflict onto people and I need to be prepared.

    My off topics are over with politics except for eyecandy, puppies and gay relevant news.

    When will this internal hurting stop? I am still petrified.

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I’m not sure I can listen to even NPR. i might have to switch to the jazz station for peace of mind.

      • canoebum

        My new car (a 2012 model) has a nice USB port and a fairly decent sound system. I am enjoying my playlist everyday.

      • safari

        I turned off NPR last week. I might not turn it back on for quite a while. I’ve also stopped following my political podcasts.

    • I am so sick of politics after this election. I think I am gonna go back to either taking conversational Spanish or that oil painting class I keep on saying I am going to take but never get around to at Spanish River High School Adult Ed in Boca. Seriously.

    • wayne
  • Michael Moore is right.

    Morning After To-Do List:
    1. Take over the Democratic Party and return it to the people. They have failed us miserably.
    2. Fire all pundits, predictors, pollsters and anyone else in the media who had a narrative they wouldn’t let go of and refused to listen to or acknowledge what was really going on. Those same bloviators will now tell us we must “heal the divide” and “come together.” They will pull more hooey like that out of their ass in the days to come. Turn them off.
    3. Any Democratic member of Congress who didn’t wake up this morning ready to fight, resist and obstruct in the way Republicans did against President Obama every day for eight full years must step out of the way and let those of us who know the score lead the way in stopping the meanness and the madness that’s about to begin.
    4. Everyone must stop saying they are “stunned” and “shocked”. What you mean to say is that you were in a bubble and weren’t paying attention to your fellow Americans and their despair. YEARS of being neglected by both parties, the anger and the need for revenge against the system only grew. Along came a TV star they liked whose plan was to destroy both parties and tell them all “You’re fired!” Trump’s victory is no surprise. He was never a joke. Treating him as one only strengthened him. He is both a creature and a creation of the media and the media will never own that.
    5. You must say this sentence to everyone you meet today: “HILLARY CLINTON WON THE POPULAR VOTE!” The MAJORITY of our fellow Americans preferred Hillary Clinton over Donald Trump. Period. Fact. If you woke up this morning thinking you live in an effed-up country, you don’t. The majority of your fellow Americans wanted Hillary, not Trump. The only reason he’s president is because of an arcane, insane 18th-century idea called the Electoral College. Until we change that, we’ll continue to have presidents we didn’t elect and didn’t want. You live in a country where a majority of its citizens have said they believe there’s climate change, they believe women should be paid the same as men, they want a debt-free college education, they don’t want us invading countries, they want a raise in the minimum wage and they want a single-payer true universal health care system. None of that has changed. We live in a country where the majority agree with the “liberal” position. We just lack the liberal leadership to make that happen (see: #1 above).
    Let’s try to get this all done by noon today.
    — Michael Moore

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      he may be right, but “the people” are a group of who are easily distracted by pumpkin spice lattes at Starbucks, so I’m not quite there yet.

      • Consumer reports rated the ones at Dunkin Donuts higher on the taste taste and much cheaper btw. I won’t drink them cause of the sugar content, just sayin.

    • Mark

      How about we ditch the DNC altogether? They have no spine. We need a party that will actually stand up and stand out.

      • Well, the DNC needs new leadership — but the old leadership is out anyway. Agreed. I am with Michael Moore’s point 1 but I think you are too. The answer for me is not Jill Stein’s Green Party, or any third party. The Democratic Party is our best hope for opposition to Trump.

        • Reality.Bites

          Only, not best.

  • GanymedeRenard

    Isn’t it ironic that an entity called “National Organization for Marriage” supports a thrice married, twice divorced “pussy-grabber”?

    Gawd(ess) help us! (And I say this as a non-U.S. citizen).

    • coram nobis

      Ave, ave Emperor Nero!

      • GanymedeRenard

        Ave, Caesar, morituri te salutant!

    • AJ Drew

      well, yes. but, it’s old news for us here (usa) Newt Gingrich jumps to mind, so many others claiming moral superiority yet…

      beh. we’re tired here. it’s been an awful day. our humor and snark has resurfaced as the hours passed, but we’re tired and feeling the weight of this ugliness that our own fellow citizens have heaped upon us.

    • Platos_Redhaired_Stepchild

      Well, Trump must love marriage. He’s a repeat customer.

      • GanymedeRenard

        Just like Kim Davis I suppose.

    • Kevin Perez
  • Lazycrockett

    Is any MSM reporting on this shooting?

  • Lazycrockett
  • coram nobis

    Coram Nobis Late Nite Theater presents a meditation.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYLvY1XpjfM

  • Max_1

    FYI for those not in Seattle…
    The location is a well known drug trafficking bus stop.

    There happened to be a protest in the city at the time.
    They’re related in only as is the price of tea is, in China.

  • Okay in the interest of not panicking people more than they already are, is there any indication that anyone from Trump’s inner circle gives a fuck about NOM? Yeah I know this is what he said he’d do, but I’d like to priorize my outrage. I can only get so worked up without melting down.

    • Ninja0980

      I don’t think he gives a shit what any religious person tells him to do.
      Pence however….

      • AJ Drew

        yup.

    • Matthew Delemos

      Is it really plausible that the half of the country voting Hillary would just let it happen? Let NOM just goose step all over our fresh rights?

      • What would we do to stop them. We don’t have any of the three branches of government.

        And are you insinuating Democrats have a spine? Seriously?

        • Matthew Delemos

          Uh, I see. You are so panicked, you believe all these people would just agree with a man who barely won a popularity contest?That he wouldn’t have opposition, because every Christian will be agreeing with Pence?

          • No, what I’m saying is that in January Republicans will control all three branches of government and the party platform is against gay marriage. Yes, there are religious people who are pro-gay rights. But what are they going to do if Trump appoints anti-gay justices to the courts and the Senate approves them. Hold up signs? Well that would be nice for the feels, but it won’t change anything.

        • Ninja0980

          Comey and the insurance companies saw to that.

      • Viod Null

        Final vote count around 120 million votes, 400 million people in us, 200 million too young to vote, other 80 million non-voting people decided the election by not voting. Only 60 million people voted for Clinton. 60 million out of 400 million is …

        • Matthew Delemos

          Apathy is hardly a sign of doom and gloom. In fact, it might be encouraging so many abstained from the whole mess. They may regret that, but that’s the point.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          how many voted for him?

    • Reality.Bites

      NOM doesn’t really exist anymore. Hasn’t for years. It’s a shell organization that sends out press releases.

  • Massassin

    Are your religious beliefs worth more than a life? Then you are fucking dead. Compromise over.

  • KnownDonorDad
  • SoCalGal20

    Yeah, NYC may have had their 20-block-long protest but L.A. Is burning a piñata effigy of Trump’s head in front of City Hall.

    https://twitter.com/abc7jory/status/796561459442397185

  • Max_1

    Feeling nostalgic like me… ?

    – History of The Statue of Liberty –
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzU49BkJ9RY

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    O/T Update. So, we’re back home in Canada, got in earlier today and the husbotter’s mom arrived about 4 hours ago. Got her settled in and she’s resting. My Booh is feeling better but still very anxious. He’s taken the rest of the week off to decompress and help his mom become familiar with things in the Great Not-Yet White North. She’s going to stay with us until April/May and then, depending on how things are stateside, return to Brooklyn. In the meantime, her other son is living at the apartment. All in all a very stress filled 24 hours, of which I have seen great sadness, anger, fear and anxiety. We were watching the protests for awhile, but once again, he became worked up so we ended up watching deutschland 83, a great spy thriller series from Germany. Anyway, I know it’s not on topic, to be honest I’m rather drained from the whole fiasco. So I will simply say toodles and goodnight. Tomorrow is another day. Bears Hugs from a Trump Free Canada.

    • SoCalGal20

      Glad to hear you all arrived safe and sound. 🙂

    • Ninja0980

      Have a good night!

    • houstonray

      Texas hugs back at all of you. Trump Free AND Trudeau PM Canada! 😉

  • Lazycrockett

    My twitter feed is showing a lot of violence towards minorities happening today. It’s going to be a very dark and depressing time in this country. good luck.

    • Jean-Marc in Canada

      And it’s only day one.

    • Ninja0980

      Going to get a lot worse from here…

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      just had the convo with a friend about the seattle shooting… “we’re actually at the point now where we say, well thank god the MCI was just a normal MCI and not related to trump.”

      • AJ Drew

        yeah, Clockwork Orange shenanigans vs DT inspired… droogs… oh fook.

    • SoCalGal20

      I saw several stories on twitter from around the country of Muslim women being hit and having their hijabs ripped off. Horrible.

      • moebym

        fuck fuck fuck

  • Presidential Material

    This is a wake up call for all parties. No IFS, ANDS, or BUTTS. After this mess dies down, people will have absolutely no excuse not to get involved. 10 years from now, folk will look back at all this and ask: “What the quacking duck was that crap?”

  • Viod Null

    Now we test the new laws we have to protect us. If they are well made laws then they will hold up to testing. The laws are no good to us unless they can withstand being tested. There was going to be a republican president eventually. The laws were going to be tested sooner or later. Better sooner. The pendulum swings both ways. We got our liberal advances, now the nation will be more conservative for a while. The fight was never over once we got the laws to protect us, no, that was only the beginning of the civil war. Now we have to fight to keep our new liberal laws.

  • Lazycrockett
    • houstonray

      I posted this further down but wanted to repost up here. There have been protests here across Texas today and tonight (Houston, Austin, San Antonio). I just hope these continue and grow and become a regular thing. If we can put the fear into the R’s that they might just lose their jobs in 2018, maybe they won’t give a rubber stamp to Trump.

      It begins today!!!!!!

    • stevenj

      Protests today in SF, Oakland, Berkeley and San Jose.

    • safari

      The inauguration should be a hoot.

      • Snarkaholic

        Don’t be surprised if The Orange Antichrist changes the wording of his oath…probably, “To uphold MY Constitution,” instead of THE Constitution.

    • moebym

      My friend in Seattle has reported protests in that city.

  • Lazycrockett

    The Last Word had a very important message tonight. DO NO LET the media normalize this POS. This is not normal, or right.

    • EweTaw

      Yes.

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      And yet Obama has to give him the keys. I’m completely OK with a non peaceful transfer of power. I would pitch in. Of course, we can’t do that. We have to take the esoteric route and activate the Delta Nu phone tree and everyone lived happily ever after.

    • Ribb Rotgut

      What do you mean by “normalize”? How should the media treat Trump?

  • EweTaw
  • bob

    OT, Philly news just said the orangutan was going to shoot for congressional term limits, like that will happen! lol

    • SoCalGal20

      He obviously doesn’t know Congress if he thinks that’s going to happen.

      • He obviously doesn’t know how hard it is to pass a Constitutional Amendment if he thinks its going to happen.

    • Treant

      Let him waste his time–and extremely limited political credit–on that. Please!

    • Cuberly
    • kevin vincent

      Hate to say that nithot would probably be a good thing

  • SoCalGal20
  • Lazycrockett

    Brian Williams is asking Christie “which” Drumpf will show up at the WH meeting with Obama tomorrow. You know like having a split personality is a normal everyday thing. SMGDH

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      yeah, here are the keys to the free world. try not to scratch it, we just had it painted. you crazy kids have fun and be back before 3 am.

      • AJ Drew

        Starting in late January… Jimmy Kimmel presents “late night tweets from the POTUS bathroom.” see, it’ll all be fine.

        • Lumpy Gaga

          I’ve taken an instant and vehement dislike to TV networks hanging live entertainment events off this election like sportsball coverage. So, things will be piling up on the DVR for awhile.

          And tonight’s streaming chez moi was all about “Robot Chicken”.

  • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

    #LAVC … this hashtag on twitter has reports of a shooter there. Anyone know what LAVC is?

    • houstonray

      Los Angeles Valley College….

      • SoCalGal20

        My local news twitter feed say police still have no evidence of a shooter.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          some of the tweets show police in the buildings but nothing confirmed

  • Lazycrockett

    https://twitter.com/TehBhav/status/796434898764476416

    well this is going viral. will add do not know if its real or not.

    • moebym

      if this is true, god help us.

  • Max_1

    Just “Putin” this out there…

    DJ Trump was the spinmeister of many things, specializing in “projection”.
    The system is “rigged”, he’d say. The election is “rigged”, he said.

    OK. We know the “system” is rigged… In Trump’s favor.
    And what about that election… ?

  • DaddyRay

    Perfect example of how our enemies never give up
    and neither should we – we must continue to fight for our rights!

    • Blake Jordan

      Unfortunately they have all the power now…

  • SoCalGal20
    • Max_1

      Burning Man was so like, August…

  • SoCalGal20
  • safari

    So, any bets on when the powder keg goes boom?

    • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

      him or us?

      • safari

        I’m thinking everything. The global trend from politics to economics is undoing a lot of post-war efforts. The US election is just another example.

        • Jalapeño Out Of Fucks To Give

          oh all that Dr Venkman human sacrifice dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria biblical stuff?

          https://youtu.be/WfVcvyxLj-s

          • AJ Drew

            man, you’re on fire… I gotta rethink my prejudice against margarine. Good stuff, apparently.

  • glass

    Oh joy, HATE will be the only thing these people spread for the next 4 years. We will really see how hateful religion is.

    • Blake Jordan

      And it will last for decades, at least for LGBTQ+s, if the SCOTUS is turned majority conservative…

  • Blake Jordan

    This is it…

    I believe the GOP in the legislature will significantly tame Donnie’s “plans” on his Mexican, Muslim,… related stuff…

    But the LGBTQ+s of America are going to be worse off than they have ever been before, and the majority of other Americans will easily let it happen!!!

    • Lazycrockett

      they will happily participate.

    • Boy, we are moving right back into postion as fourth class citizens. In fact, as far as the Trump evangelicals are concerned, we should go right back in the closet and just keep our big mouths shut and pretend its the 1950’s all over again shouldn’t we? Let’s see– Jews and Catholics can be second class along with rich asians, Latinos and blacks can be third class, and us LGBT people can be back there with the muslims as fourth class ones — is this the new Trump hierarchy?

      • David Walker

        Not here. Actually, I’m hoping it goes a different direction. Now the Drumpf xns will start calling in their favors and Drumpf asks, “What favors are those?” Then Tony and Brian and all the other Truly Religious will remind him of all the terrible things they’ve done and said while raking in bucks. Drumpf will take one look at them and say, “And how much of that is MY take? Fuck off. You guys didn’t do shit for me. Why should I do anything for you?” It could happen. But me back into the closet? Let’s be kind and say I wouldn’t fit, physically or mentally.

        • robirob

          Trump will ignore them, but Pence will most certainly hear them out and he’s the one who’ll do all the work.

  • DaddyRay

    Still feeling stressed so I’m playing Eva to chill out

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rd8VktT8xY

  • Phil

    Maybe, just maybe, some good can come out of this very bad thing. Trump was never on board with repealing our marriage rights. To me that’s huge. I didn’t vote for him, but he will be the next president. It is what it is.

    Maybe, just maybe, he’ll knock the wind out of the sails of the anti-LGBT right wing. He never really cozied up to them. It’s not going to be the same as it’s been under Obama’s tenure, but I doubt it’s going to as bad as it was under GWB’s.

    I just hope and pray the Union holds together for the next four years.

    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I actually just want the red states and the blue states to separate already. I’m not going to live the decades it’ll take for the red states to flip enough we don’t have to constantly worry about the Cheneys and Trumps. I’m tired of waiting for single payer and an end to the bodily autonomy wars aka abortion rights.

      • Phil

        You make good points with your opinion. However we are are all Americans and live in the same republic. None of us can go it alone, as far as I know. I’d love to see single payer and that’s possible under this new regime. Don’t like him, but he’s not a true conservative either. I doubt he likes the status quo.

        Only time will tell.

        • Skeptical_Inquirer

          The only damn thing he cares about is his wallet. He’s sooooooo not going to do anything other than repeal Obamacare. We can tell from the way he’s lived his life and campaigned.

        • Reality.Bites

          You’re an idiot, Phil, if you think there is the slightest chance of single payer. Not even under a Democratic President and Congress, let alone under the mouth breathers you’ve just elected.

          I mean really, you are being so obnoxiously pollyannish that I can only tell you to just fuck right off.

    • William

      Trump will not be running the day to day affairs of the Oval Office. Mike Pence will do whatever he wants, as long as there isn’t too much negative publicity causing Donald annoyance.

      • robirob

        Does Donald care about bad or negative publicity? He just adds the people who offend or annoy him to his shit list which he hands to the Feds or the CIA to cause all kinds of trouble for those who are on the list.

      • Blake Jordan

        Donnie is the figure head, i.e. the USA’s queen…

  • JWC

    is this the start of the New World order Where all is to be challanged The Old Guard fauled and chaned for the New

  • Bert_Bauer

    Time to put the anger and fear to work to crush NOM and BB. I don’t know about anyone else but I’ve had a lot of adrenaline flowing since last night.

  • if you’re feeling blue and need some good news, go over to Friendly Atheist. Hemant has a nice roster of candidates who won that you will never hear about from the mainstream press.

  • SoCalGal20

    Super long cute animal post from Tumblr. If you need a cute animal break this will do nicely.

    http://hazelandglasz.tumblr.com/post/152975365182/tiny-pebble-motherstrawberry

  • Considering NOM’s recent record of success, this is the kiss of death.

  • bob

    I need a silly thought to get some sleep tonight.. I’d like to see president Obama make a real fool out of trump on his visit tomorrow ! Maybe he’ll go around asking what this button does and Obama can call him a jackass !

  • DaddyRay

    I almost decided to work from home today – so glad I decided to go in because I don’t think I could have watched news coverage. I think I need to take a break from politics to retain what little is left of my sanity.

    • Paul

      I felt the same way, but I turned on Rachel Maddow and stayed for Lawrence O’Donnell, which helped calm me down.

      But I’m torn as how to proceed. Do I keep the TV off and just get my news from the Times? Facebook is definitely out. JMG reminds me that there are people out there as traumatized as I am, which is helpful, but I truly wish I could be one of those people who is completely unaware of what’s going on around them. I’ve been a political junkie since my first junior high civics class in 1969 and it’s hard to change after 47 years. Damn you, Mrs. Nightingale!

  • ByronK

    I just realized, I don’t ever remember an election where the following day, one of the topics under discussion is how to explain what happened to your children and try to prevent traumatizing them. From the stories I’ve heard today, Trump’s election has made young children burst in to tears. But then it can be a bonding moment because most likely, their parents are crying too. WTF.

    • AJ Drew

      ‏@pattonoswalt
      Guys, the #TrumpProtests aren’t “riots.” They’re to assure a nervous planet Earth that we’ll go against him if he tries something crazy.

      • TampaDink

        What can we do to go against him when we won’t even know when some slight or negative comment from a foreign head of state will provoke him into stepping up his game from twitter rants to launching the nukes?

        • zhera

          USA v. North Korea. Who will shoot first?

          • Blake Jordan

            Donnie’s USA is an ally of North Korea, Russia and Syria…

          • TampaDink

            My initial gut reaction was….US, of course! Then as I reconsidered, I reminded myself that president-elect dear leader is full of shit…..so I think that N. Korea will shoot 1st but that he will respond as quickly as his tiny fingers allow & launch shitloads of response missiles………..at Europe.

    • Lazycrockett

      Or a time when the children can’t watch The President speak for fear of F bombs, hate speech, woman shaming, racism, etc. What a fun country this has turned out to be.

    • TampaDink

      These are the times when I am most grateful for not having reproduced….or adopted.

  • Richard B

    Hate grifter Brian Brown is bottom feeding to take advantage of the political circumstances. He has no political capital or rates very high on Trump’s agenda or anyone else’s. That said, we do have potent enemies from the Family Research Counsel, the American Family Association, Dr Dobson, Alliance Defending Freedom, Heritage, Mike Pence etc – these old adversaries will feel empowered and have influence on a Trump administration – its not good and its hard to predict what perils lie ahead for us.

    • Gianni

      When it’s really quiet, I can hear them all salivating and breathing heavily at the prospect of bending Trump’s ear and goading him to urge the Congress to do something to reverse abortion rights and marriage equality. Other than proposing amendments to the Constitution, I don’t see how Congress can affect either being that they are legal by virtue of Supreme Court decisions that verified their constitutionality.

  • Lazycrockett
    • Lumpy Gaga

      Profiles in Butter.

  • Lazycrockett
  • Lazycrockett
    • Skeptical_Inquirer

      I’m also weary of being told “meet in the middle” and “hold out your hand in healing.” I’m all “the other side spits on my hand then stabbed it, screw that.”

      • Lazycrockett

        I’m obviously in my anger phase.

        • robirob

          Aren’t we all?

          • Lumpy Gaga

            Can’t be denied.

          • Paul

            I’m still in the ‘sick to my stomach’ phase

        • Dramphooey

          I hit that on the early morning of the 9th here and had to apologize for a comment. Yesterday was depression and I think I’m closing on acceptance–and by that I mean emotional well being, not acceptance of Trump.

        • Treant

          Please continue. We like you when you’re angry.

      • BudClark

        Yeah. Like the Republicans reached across the aisle the past eight years.

    • Dramphooey

      And after Munich there is no intelligent reason to do so.

  • kevin vincent

    I really wish Joan Rivers was still around lord knows she would be having a field day over Trump and the First Whore

  • Franciscan

    Hoping that NOM just runs out of steam. I know hoping is not enough, but I really don’t see how they go forward from here. The Supreme Court is not going to reverse itself any time soon, even if Harrumph proposes a right-wing nominee to overbalance the liberals. What Republicans in Congress will go after is repealing national health care (because why would any country want that?!), then spending more money on “defense” and rearmament. Gay marriage is already established in many states. They can try to make gay spouses ineligible for Social Security benefits–that would be a problem.

    • TampaDink

      My greatest fear is that Pence will be the new Cheney. The man behind the man who is really the one in charge. Pence hates us as much as he hates reproductive rights.

    • BudClark

      NOT a problem.

      There won’t BE any Social Security for ANYBODY.

    • Reality.Bites

      SCOTUS needs a case before it in order to issue a ruling.

      In order for a case to get there, a state has to act in defiance of Obergefel and be sued.

      There are many, many reasons to fear the Trump presidency and Trump Supreme Court. Marriage rights are not high on the list of things to fear. Fear for the economy. Fear for visible minorities. Fear for people who need health care. Fear for Trans kids. Fear for all the horrible things that will happen in the first 90 days of his Presidency, not a court challenge that isn’t yet in its theoretical stage.

      • Add in a couple more wrinkles: first off, anyone who’s trying to overturn Obergefell has to demonstrate that marriage equality has harmed them, otherwise they have no basis for a suit — it’s called “standing,” and it’s absolutely necessary for a suit to proceed. Then, they have to go through the layers of the court system, with appeals after they inevitably lose at the district and appellate levels, because those courts are bound by the decision of the Supreme Court.

        At the least, it would take years, because the courts don’t want to spend time on it. It’s a done deal, as far as they’re concerned.

      • Paul

        All true, but what we have seen here is the first gauntlet being thrown down. It’s a warning shot both to us and to Trump that these people now feel empowered.

        On a side note, after watching Cecile Richards on Lawrence O’Donnell last night, I sent my first-ever donation to Planned Parenthood. I can say with 100% assurance that I have never been, nor will ever be, involved in creating a pregnancy, but I feel strongly about a woman’s right to choice. And I earmarked it for the PP facility in Dickinson, TX, a fuck-you to Republican ‘friends’ who live in the same town.

        In the words of Winston Churchill, ‘…we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender.’

  • Mihangel apYrs

    as a Brit, I can’t say that I fathom many of the intricacies of US politics. So, can anyone explain just why Obama left the “Scalia” seat unfilled for 8 months? I know there was opposition, but it just seemed to be left . . . .

    • NowVoyager

      Hello Mihangel apYrs (that name sounds Welch, like some of my ancestors)…anyway, the simplest answer to your question as to why that US Supreme Court seat remained unfilled is that a spitefully partisan Republican-controlled US Senate refused (which is unprecedented) to give Pres. Obama’s nominee even a preliminary Senate Judiciary Hearing so that the nomination could proceed. See link below for more info as to the procedures involved. http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/supremecourtjustuces/a/scotusconfirm.htm

      • Mihangel apYrs

        thank you for that. Very dirty work!!

        The nom de guerre is Welch in form
        Mihangel = “Michael”
        ap = “son of”
        and Yrs, well an invention, to hide tracks.

    • Colonel Panic.

      Fellow Brit here, but I gather that whilst the President makes a nomination the candidate has to be approved by the Senate. Who were being obstructive..

      • Mihangel apYrs

        that much I gathered, it is the 8 month delay that perplexes me. Did Obama leave it in the expectation of a Democrat victory? Maybe someone closer to the US political system could comment, because, if that was the case, it was a hostage to Fortune

        • Gretchen Sharp Kidd

          Unfortunately the President can only nominate the justice, which he did. The Senate has to approve the nomination. Basically, President Obama did his part, but the Senate refused to do theirs in hopes that a Republican would win the Presidential election.

          • Mihangel apYrs

            thank you – the system needs a kick up the botty

        • Burly Stone

          Sadly, he didn’t “leave” it. The president’s duty only extends to proposing a nominee. He has no power (other than the bully pulpit) beyond that. The senate’s duty is to meet with and hopefully approve/confirm the nominee. They refused to meet with Merrick Garland, and made it clear that they would refuse to meet with ANY nominee the President put forward. His hands were tied.

          • Mihangel apYrs

            thank you, as I have said, your system needs a kick

      • Mihangel apYrs

        PS
        thank you

    • Gerard

      He couldn’t do it. The Senate (Republican majority) blocked his nomination Merrick Garland, and announced that they would refuse to hold a vote for anyone he nominated until the new President was elected

      • Mihangel apYrs

        thank you for that explanation – from Britain this looks more than bizarre, it looks like a failure to fulfill the requirements of the posts held by the obstructionists.

        I feel so sorry for you, but as the last line of the second verse of the UK anthem says “God save us all”

        • BobSF_94117

          It looks bizarre to you. It looks grossly unconstitutional to me, but no one else seems to think so, least of all Obama. (I suspect he’s going to pull a recess appointment. Hell, he damn well better, as far as I’m concerned.)

  • BudClark

    Bastard is wetting himself.

    Every Reich Wing hater in the entire world is now feeling vindicated.

    Kristallnacht has already started in Philadelphia. Nov. 9th, BTW, is the anniversary of Germany’s Kristallnacht.

    I wonder how many of the military would obey Trump if a civil war started? They donated 300% more to Hillary than they did to Hair Fuehrer. Most senior military officers have said they will retire or resign, rather than obey him.

  • TallBearNC

    Look on the bright side. We WON marriage equity WITH SCALLIA on the bench. Kennedy supports it. Even if trump puts a Scalia clone, the vote would be 5-4

    Unless a liberal judge retires or died, it will NOT BE OVERTURNED.

    We will just go back to the same scotus we’ve had for the past 8 years. Not jumping for joy about it but I’m not FREAKING. I’ll freak if a dem dies or retires from the bench

    Until then scotus will probably protect our rights

    It’s sad we won’t have a liberal scotus like we wanted. But if rbg can hang on 4-8 yrs and the other old dem, we will b ok

    • Keep in mind that the right plays a long game. They’re not talking about overturning Obergefell next year — if it takes decades, they’ll keep plugging, until the last one of them is dead and buried. Forty years later, they’re still working on overturning Roe v. Wade.

      • TallBearNC

        True but hopefully trump can’t win again in 4 years and he will screw up and we get a dem in

    • Blake Jordan

      Once they pass FADA, having a legal marriage certificate will mean fuck all!!!

      • TallBearNC

        If it passes and fada can’t take away marriage rights, and anything attached to it, as they are constitutionally granted by scotus. Only they can reverse it. They can do is make it legal for businesses to completely discriminate against us

        We would be like black people before the Civil Rights Act… We could get married, but we could be segregated – worst case scenario

    • Gene

      you are right…and, if she can just hold on…4 years is a long time for a woman in her health and age. she SHOULD have stepped down two years ago, but, I hate to say it, she loves the position more than her concern over who might replace her.

      • TallBearNC

        Had did she stepped down two years ago Obama would have replaced her and we wouldn’t have to be worrying right now

    • BudClark

      Notorious Madam Justice Ruth Bader Ginsberg will hang on till she’s a hundred and beyond, if she thinks it best for the Court and the Country.

  • JellyDonut

    I am gonna believe that they will fail.

  • “President-elect Trump will now turn his attention to governing,”

    That just proves once again how far removed from reality Brown is.

  • Gay Fordham Prep Grad

    I believe our president elect will be very “transactional,” so before NOM goes out with its list of demands it should produce evidence it has paid to play.

    • BudClark

      Oh, the KKKnights of KKKolumbus have taken care of NOM’s finances for YEARS. There have never been more that a handful, with the KKKnights being the biggest.

  • Raising_Rlyeh

    Can we just nuke the planet already? Humanity has proven that it doesn’t deserve to exist.

    • Blake Jordan

      There has to be a way to only kill the humans, everything else on the planet deserves to live.

      • Mark

        Easy. Just poison the money.

      • Jeffg166

        Earth seems to be trying to come up with a disease to take out as many as quickly as possible. It will get it right one of these days.

    • Jean-Marc in Canada

      Hand on a minute. You Americans may have proven that you don’t deserve to exist, but leave the rest of us out of it. Canada is proving the opposite, thank you very much.

      • Raising_Rlyeh

        You have Trudeau, but you also had Harper. Frankly, the rise of fascism around the world demonstrates to me that we haven’t progressed and maybe it’s time to give another species a chance to become the dominant life form.

      • BudClark

        Truth.

        BIG hugs, Jean-Marc, from the California desert.

        Bud Clark

  • Frostbite

    A friend sent me this (don’t know where he got it):

    Updated poll numbers

    231,556,622 eligible voters

    46.9% didn’t vote

    25.6% voted for Clinton

    25.5% voted for Trump

    1.7% voted for Johnson

  • Texndoc

    Watching “Morning Joe” and Schmoe and Mika in their hushed funeral speaking tones with their heads bowed praising Hillary Clinton today profusely and remember how they savaged every other Republican primary candidate, had Trump on their show, and asked him on hot mike during the commercial break “Is there anything we should or shouldn’t ask you about?” while all the time they crucified Hillary Clinton mercilessly (ESPECIALLY MIKA). Now Schmoe is lecturing in his hushed and getting louder voice as the camera zooms in on his face, worried about people of different color and religions, and I’m remembering he reportedly told Trump he would be his running mate.
    Changed the channel to Married With Children.

    • Paul

      I dumped MJ when they kept oohing and cooing over Trump.

      Last Monday, the day before the election, my partner got up early and had MJ on in the living room, so I watched for a bit. They kept going on and on about the emails and Comey’s statement over the weekend. No discussion about real issues that we’d be voting on in less than 24 hours (or, in some cases, already voted on).

      I walked away from the TV, but when mentioned this to a colleague at work, he said the emails WERE a real issue, and parroted the line ‘If it was anyone else, they’d be in jail’. I knew then we were in real trouble.

      I blame MJ and all the shows that treated him like a rock star early on in the process, and never called him a liar and a racist. Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, and Lawrence O’Donnell called him out and never kissed his ass.

      • Texndoc

        Yep, ratings. They would promote days ahead when the idiot would be scheduled to appear and then softball him.

        But I think Mika also genuinely dislikes Hillary Clinton and I’m not a woman and I don’t know why some women who lean left do.

      • Chris Hayes, Rachel Maddow, and Lawrence O’Donnell called him out and never kissed his ass.
        ……………….
        No they did not IMO.

    • canoebum

      Scarborough is a snake. He’d like us all to forget he was part of the Gingrich Cabal that made it ok to demonize to other side and shutdown the government. He repulses me.

    • Treant

      “Al!”

      Really, I think you got more out of Married With Children than you did out of Morning Joke. It’s far more socially meaningful.

  • BeaverTales

    All politics is local, and in the swing states, Hillary never generated the excitement Bernie did among young white males. Bernie Sanders polled extremely well among white males who were socially moderate AND who wanted change. That demographic mattered. Bernie beat Hillary by wide margins in MI & WI…two big swing states she lost yesterday. Bernie didn’t win a single southern state in the Primary, but Hillary lost them all yesterday as well.

    The South shouldnt matter in the Dem presidential races. Giving Dixie such an early role in the Democratic primaries was a huge mistake. Dixie (except NC, FL and VA) is dead to Democrats and should have never had such an outsized voice in the primary.

    Polls in the spring indicated Bernie would run stronger against Trump than Hillary. Those polls were ignored.

    http://usuncut.com/politics/bernie-sanders-would-have-crushed-trump/

    Everyone is hurting, but the self deluding bullshit we’ve been telling ourselves about which politicians are electable and who isn’t in 2016 finally needs to end. We need to have an ***********honest************ post-mortem on this race, and not lose this big ever again.. 2016 will be an important turning point in history. We have to start looking at why the Democrats are losing so many races. Unlike the GOP, the Democrats ignored their populist rebels and lost the extra edge that gave Obama his victory in 2008.

    • Dramphooey

      Bernie Sanders lost the primary fair and square, though. While there is evidence of bias among the DNC there is no evidence they did anything to hurt Sanders’ campaign. Are you saying we should have rigged it for Sanders just because a few people were convinced he was more electable?

      The fact is many liberals loved Hillary Clinton. I came to like her more over time but I remember people on here that would lament over something Barack Obama supposedly wasn’t doing right that “oh, if only Hilary was in office now!”

      And those same people could now be lecturing you about how we goofed in rejecting Clinton if this wave had swamped Sanders and I’m sorry but I think it would have. I don’t think these old, rust-belt working class folk would have embraced socialism.

      • BeaverTales

        Supporting marijuana legalization and rejecting TPP and embracing 90% of Hillary Clinton’s other final positions wasn’t “socialism”.

        The enthusiasm for Bernie among working class white men was always stronger than it was for Hillary in the swing states.

        The question will never be settled completely…but many Bernie supporters *truly* believe that Wasserman-Schultz ignored serious irregularities in the primaries. AZ, WA, NV and a few other states made similar claims. Bernie was foolish to refuse corporate money….it cost him (and us) everything.

        If pointing out that those who disagreed with the diehard Hillary supporters about Hillary’s electability was a serious issue is “lecturing” them, then I have no hope for 2020.

        Trump always split the angry, blue collar white votes with Bernie, not Hillary. Every post mortem to date says she lost whites to Trump in the swing states she needed (MI, PA, WI). Those are states that went to Obama twice and Bernie won (or performed well in) in the primaries.

        I don’t believe that racism was the main issue fueling white male anger in the Rust Belt swing states. Democrat elitism and economic inequality was….

        It’s a tough sell to say that the states that supported Obama and have been blue for >20 years picked Trump because he’s a bigot.

        • Dramphooey

          I still don’t think Sanders would have beaten this wave but I will agree with you if these same voters see how empty Trump’s promises are this may be a winning strategy.

          The thing is the Sanders’ candidacy should have been an injection of his beliefs and followers into the Democratic Party in its evolution and that was lost with too many focussing on “jailing Clinton” and other wastes of times that hurt rather than helped.

          • BeaverTales

            Sanders’ candidacy should have been an injection of his beliefs and followers into the Democratic Party

            Perhaps, but there is a lot of anger out there at the economic status quo on both the left and the right among the working class. The anger is related to the Bailout and the TBTFs that profited by sending jobs overseas, made usurious loans, and the perception of secret dealmaking benefited Trump with his base but not her with hers.

            Fairly or unfairly, she had a lot of baggage that clearly harmed her, and all that baggage was ignored by people who let their loyalty to her outweigh polls about her electability and evolving voter preferences in bluish swing states were ignored in favor of the Southern states that were never, ever going to be Blue to begin with. Mistake…

          • fuow

            I’m one who discounted the baggage. I genuinely thought people would see through Trump.
            And that was my mistake – they do see through Trump, and it doesn’t matter to them. This was their ‘cut of their own nose to spite our face’ moment.

          • BudClark

            Because they do (or want to do) the same things he does, albeit on a miniscule scale.

          • BeaverTales

            I think this is an epic fuckup that will actually have ripples throughout Spacetime and the Multiverse…or whatever. It will be remembered long after we are all dead and gone. I don’t think I regret being old anymore.

            We have no one to blame but ourselves…and Debbie Wasserman Shultz breaking the rules to help her friends, not save her country.

        • Gene

          I have spoken to way to many people here in GA, and a few I do business with in OH, who have told me bluntly that they voted libertarian, or not at all, because Clinton had become “too socialist” and “way to left” in her positions.

          for every youngster Sanders turned on, he turned off a middle aged business owner. or two. Indeed, he scared the shit out of them. They could not vote for Hillary, but, you think they would vote Sanders?
          not a chance

          • BeaverTales

            Personal anecdotes aside, I would be very surprised if anyone who voted for Obama in OH in 2008 and 2012 now thinks Clinton is “too socialist”. She is more centrist than Obama, which hurt her in 2008. Obama won Ohio *twice* despite getting tagged with the “socialism” label by Teabaggers for 8 years.

            http://www.npr.org/2016/03/13/470278253/bernie-sanders-has-strength-among-white-men-pinched-by-the-economy

            Clearly the same people who turned out for Obama in 2012 didn’t turn out for Clinton in 2016. Look how almost all the Lake Erie counties and Dayton turned from Blue to Red: 2012: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/ddef118c72d4d6c0c9da9a28bc6d5f923e81692b62fb00b7783e011a87458459.jpg
            2016: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/91c4043c6929634fd08f5fe8e7f80d684a83cf5e704db1320aec9bb7ee82298b.png

            Bernie’s polling numbers among Ohio’s white men were always better than Hillary’s. White men are the main demographic she lost in OH. Unlike MI, WI, or PA, Ohio wasn’t even close (52% Trump : 44% Clinton).

            Older voters went overwhelmingly for Trump….winning many of them over was never going to happen. https://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/these-3-charts-perfectly-explain-how-older-voters-got-trump-elected/

            Many people who supported Bernie’s candidacy were participating in the political process for the first time in their lives. Many were too young to remember the Soviet Union. The “Socialism” bogeyman didn’t scare them. Clinton never won them over, and many petulantly turned against Bernie when he endorsed her…either that, or they stayed home. I hope they are regretting it. The GOP swept almost every race in OH due to the Dem apathy.

            Finally:

            —The dishonesty issue has plagued her since the 90s. Russia, Assange and the sloppy Internet security at Chez Clinton did not help her own cause. It made her look either too corrupt or too careless to people who were already ambivalent about voting.

            —The hacking issues at the DNC itself hurt Hillary far more than Bernie. Bernies relative lack of scandal was (fairly or unfairly) seen as a huge advantage over both Trump and Clinton by previously apathetic and apolitical supporters.

            — Many of the people who were disappointed by Obama’s unwillingness to take on Wall St flocked to Bernie over Clinton. Clinton was never willing to criticize Wall St, and that hurt her badly among young voters.

      • fuow

        As one who lamented President Obama’s desire to work with the rethugs here frequently, I’ll take that as an invitation to hear my two cents.
        For what it’s worth:
        The problem was not Hillary. The problem was the casual dismissal of those who lost out big in globalization and the crash.
        Yes, their rejection of anything more modern than the mid-19th century is troubling. Doesn’t change the fact that wanted to be heard, we refused to listen so they went to somebody who did listen.
        Trump is as much our fault as that of the rethugs.
        Time to reel in our PC-Nazis, SJWs and ‘safe-space’ advocates and start figuring out how to win 2018 and 2020.

  • The Professor

    Even with Trump, it is hard to imagine there is appetite for this. Sure, they’ll try. But it won’t succeed.

    • fuow

      Hate to disagree, but there’s a strong level of nasty out there and a thirst for revenge.

  • Not to sound like a Trump apologist, because I am most certainly NOT … but I don’t believe Donald Trump is going to do specifically about marriage equality for Gay couples. He has Gay friends, he’s probably been to Gay weddings. He said this should be a “States Rights” issue simply to appease his audiences.

    As far as the Supreme Court is concerned, that horse left the starting gate long ago, as they say. Unless someone can make the case that Obergefell v. Hodges somehow infringes on their rights, the Court is not going to re-address the issue. And EVEN if the issue was left up to the states, a marriage is fundamentally a contractual agreement between two parties, and such agreements are honored across states lines, so any state bans would be moot.

    On the other hand, with the current Congress, we can kiss goodbye any possibility of anything like ENDA for at least the next two years.

    • canoebum

      “Unless someone can make the case that Obergefell v. Hodges somehow infringes on their rights, the Court is not going to re-address the issue.”

      They will try, over and over and over again. I can guarantee that the lawsuits will begin the minute a new justice is seated on the court. Like the decades long attacks on Roe v Wade, the opponents of equality will never stop trying to take away our rights. And like Roe, if they can’t get it over turned, they will try to limit our freedoms. The horse may have left the starting gate, but they will be busy trying to knock it down as long as they have breath. We are hated. Try to get used to it. It’s going to be “same shit, different day” for the next 100 years.

      • John Ruff

        Yes, but unlike Roe, if the rethugs take away a right from citizens that actually is good for children (which I believe Roe is also good for children), they’re gonna have a tough time getting the court to blatantly discriminate.

    • BobSF_94117

      The Court, with its previous makeup including Scalia, used a profoundly dishonest reading of RFRA to extend “religious beliefs” to corporations. There is already a lawsuit headed to SCOTUS arguing that states have the right to treat same-sex marriages differently based on public policy preferences. And there are existing suits arguing that churches, religious organizations, businesses and individuals cannot be compelled to obey secular law if it contradicts their religious beliefs.

      Say you’re right, and Trump isn’t going to seek out anti-gay justices. Do you think the pro-torture, pro-death-penalty, pro-treating-breaking, pro-Muslim-expelling judges he’s going to pick would draw the line at gay people cuz Trump has gay cocktail-party buddies?

    • John Ruff

      Suh-nap

    • ZRAinSWVA

      “such agreements are honored across states lines, so any state bans would be moot.”

      I beg to differ. As one who lives in Virginia, where recognition of any contractual relationship that bestowed any rights even approximating those of marriage was barred by state law until Obergefell, we could see those state laws being resurrected across the country. Leaving it up to the states would be a disaster for us, and I never, ever, want to go back to a time where a trip across country meant married–not married–married–not married.

  • JellyDonut

    There is a difference between courting the fringe groups for votes and actually doing their bidding. Trump will serve 4 years and go away. I cannot see him running for re-election and there is no way he can make all the far right fringe elements happy. The fun now will be to see all the infighting in GOP as they don’t have a Dem president to blame everything on.

    This dumpster fire is just getting started!!! Trump could completely dismantle the GOP and turn off even the inbreds who voted for him!

  • worstcultever

    For anybody who wants to wallow in some therapeutic rage, I recommend this post and comments:

    http://wonkette.com/608425/go-fuck-yourself-america

    • barrixines

      I read Wonkette regularly. The snark is pretty similar to here both in the posts and the comments. I had never commented there before the thread you linked to but I left a message of commiseration and support. The reaction was sweet if a bit surprised that anyone outside the US would give a fuck but when Brexit happened one of the things I really appreciated was the comments of support from over the world on sites like this.

  • John Ruff

    Catholics will NEVER give up their fight to destroy us because they and their followers are the original terrorists.

    • Correct. It was a Catholic who said KILL THEM ALL. GOD WILL SORT THEM OUT.

  • worstcultever
    • Jean-Marc in Canada

      How utterly depressing and so painfully true.

  • Silver Badger

    I wonder how long before Joe becomes an enemy of the state? I hope his out of country fans have a place prepared for him.

  • Dee

    Worse news to come.
    https://thinkprogress.org/trump-pence-transgender-students-aa32ee93cdb7#.ok62fnvca
    Mike Pence confirmed Trump to be anti-LGBT president and wants to sign 1st amendment defense act to legalize anti-LGBT discrimination.

  • Halou

    NOM wants Trump to reverse the Obama administrations international efforts. But what aren’t they telling us? When Uganda made a law imposing the death penalty for homosexuality and repeated related offenses and Obama posted a protest… NOM and all the others went ballistic with fury.
    ‘Death to the gays’ is the not-so-hidden heart of NOM’s agenda. More so now that Brian Brown is the appointed chief of the World Congress of Families that seeks to export Islamist and African norms all around the world.

    Trump will fall for NOM’s sob story hook, line and sinker because if he is not too dumb to notice, he is too busy building a database of Muslims and Mexicans.

  • Bob Black

    My boyfriend and I have known for a while that marriage was in our not-too-distant future. I was secretly thinking that Christmastime 2017 would be good. With a Trump victory i was (and am) terrified that I will lose my healthcare coverage since I have pre-existing conditions and the ACA is going away. We are both also concerned about losing the right to marry at all. SO…yesterday he proposed. Looks like either Feb. 19th or 26th (checking with the Pastor today) will be the day. I have time to plan what would have been a casual ceremony and party anyway, I get to sign on to his gold-medal Teamster (Unions ROCK!) insurance coverage and we get in under the wire if the right goes away. It’s a win for us and a middle finger to Mike Pence. At first it all felt a bit “shotgun” but now I am just giddy and keep getting verklempt. I am getting married!

    • John Ruff

      If I were you, I’d go down to the courthouse do it right this second.

      • Bob Black

        I am going to get jumped all over for saying this here but….we are both very religious and active at our gay-affirming, liberal, UCC church. I will move the date up, but it is important to both of us that this be a religious ceremony and take place at our church. Holding the date to do it in a way that feels right for us.

        • John Ruff

          No, that’s acceptable. But, at least get the license out of the way ASAP. You don’t have to have a ceremony at the courthouse.

          • Bob Black

            In IL you can’t get the license more than 30 days before the wedding.

        • Jeffg166

          Get married twice. Go to city hall and do it ASAP. A legal civil marriage is binding. Then have your religious ceremony in February.

          • Bob Black

            February is fine for both. Trump can’t even send a pick for the court to the Senate until Jan. 21, then he has to be confirmed and the NOM has to get their “test case” through the entire federal court system before it hits the Supremes. I’m worried, but it ain’t gonna happen overnight.

    • Congratulations.

  • 25.6% voted Clinton
    25.5% voted Trump
    46.9% didn’t vote

    and that’s how democracy dies
    (https://twitter.com/marcmaron/status/796444411492061185?s=09)

    • fuow

      Yup, every gay man who voted for Trump or third party or stays home deserves the reign of terror about to descend upon him.
      The rest of us do not.

  • adamj2013

    I’d like to think that even the most conservative judge on the SCOTUS would realize legal chaos would ensue if the decision were reversed. Couples who are married suddenly having their marriages annulled. Or couples currently married staying married but new couples unable to get married. You get the idea. They may have disagreed with the decision but realize it’s the law of the land now. But who knows? Right now, up is down, down is up, etc.

    FADA is much more insidious. It can undo state level protections for LGBT people even in solid blue states. Sure, NY state bans discrimination based on sexual orientation. But the federal government says it’s okay for a baker on the LES to refuse service.

  • The_Wretched

    Time to start arguing that all evangelical marriages are now null and void? I don’t understand how these people think it’s ok to fuck over other people. They are gleeful in their abuse. What utter failures of morality.

  • Robert Anthony

    And now we watch how irresponsible voting gives power to the most disgusting people in our midst to oppress minorities. Congratulations deplorables. As a horrified Canadian, my only solace is knowing that the imps who caused this mess will not be immune to their great nation sliding into decay. It’s no comfort though.

  • Jared

    <– lawyer

    posted this on FB on this topic:
    ***************************

    Here's one thing you should NOT be worried about: gay marriage.

    First, that fight's over. We won. Yayyy. The anti-marriage folks are out of money. They once had volunteers, but they've moved on. They found new ways to discriminate. And they don't want to come back now that they know they were on the wrong side of history all along. It's done. Mission accomplished.

    Second, once ppl win a right, it is nearly impossible just to take it away. Like the right to marry outside your race, or the right to privacy in the bedroom, and even the right to choose to abort. Gay marriage is here to stay.

    Third, from a legal perspective, SCOTUS follows its own precedent. I got Latin words to prove it: stare decisis. Means you're stuck with it, ish. When the Supreme Court was as Republican as can be in '92, they upheld abortion rights. Yes, really. Why? Stare decisis. So, gay marriage won't be reversed because Latin words. It's settled law.

    Fourth, we've got structural protections. Senate Democrats have the power to prevent him from appointing an anti-gay justice. Even if they don't step up, the Supreme Court can't just re-decide gay marriage. No. They'd have to get another case about it. So, there'd have to be a clerk who refuses to grant a marriage license to a gay couple. Unlikely at this point. Then there'd have to be a trial court judge that permits that to happen and refuses to follow settled law. Very unlikey. Then there'd have to be a multi-judge panel of appellate court judges who also refuse to follow settled law. Extremely unlikely.* The point is that SCOTUS won't even get an opportunity to re-decide gay marriage without a series of separate, highly unlikely events.

    *Proof: After the gay marriage ruling came down, one state's chief judge said he won't follow it. He got overruled immediately. Then he got removed from the bench over it. He's now facing legal ethics charges over it.

    Fifth, marriage is a state thing. And most states' constitutions protect gay marriage. So, even if SCOTUS somehow flipped itself, almost everyone reading this would be, well, unaffected. Or at least their gay marriages would be.

    Sixth, President Trump is a big fat liar. Duh. He's not really anti-gay, even if his VP is.

    * * *

    Why does this even matter?

    I've seen your statuses. I've seen you're worried about this. But, a lot of other things have way less checks and balances. Like the anti-Mexican deportation force. Or allowing Iran and the Saudis to get nukes. Or banning immigrants from countries that seem too Muslimy. So, there are some real things we should be very worried about.

    I promise that gay marriage is not one of them.

  • David Newcomer

    NOM can try to do this, but we, the people, have a recognized right to legally marry the person of whatever sex we choose. Hundreds of thousands of Americans have chosen to exercise this right. We have legal precedent on our side. Good luck with this farce.

  • mattkorey

    I’m really not usually one to use such language, but … they can fuck right off.

    We are not going back. Not gay people. Not women. None of us.

  • Rick James Brown

    NOM is like a zombie that just will not die. Every time we think it’s finally, totally dead…back it comes. =(

  • mpunfun

    My favorite part of this post is when NOM referred to it’s organization as a hate group. No truer words were ever spoken.

  • BudClark

    I just had a day-mare: our beatiful capital covered with huge, black, oily flying roaches.

    And no, I’m not stoned or drunk. Just woke up from a nap.

    Seems apt, somehow …

    I’ll just leave this here …

  • Thomas Miller

    homophobic scumbags try overturning gay rights & you will have a war on your hands ,,the supreme court has spoken get the fuck over it !!!