Researchers Claim 70% Success Rate In Predicting Sexual Orientation Using Epigenetic Algorithm

Researchers at the UCLA School of Medicine today issued a press release in which they claim to be able to predict sexual orientation about 70% of the time using an “algorithm using epigenetic information from just nine regions of the human genome.” From the press release:

“To our knowledge, this is the first example of a predictive model for sexual orientation based on molecular markers,” said Tuck C. Ngun, PhD, first author on the study and a postdoctoral researcher at the David Geffen School of Medicine of the University of California, Los Angeles.

Beyond the genetic information contained in DNA, the researchers examined patterns of DNA methylation – a molecular modification to DNA that affects when and how strongly a gene is expressed – across the genome in pairs of identical male twins. While identical twins have exactly the same genetic sequence, environmental factors lead to differences in how their DNA is methylated. Thus, by studying twins, the researchers could control for genetic differences and tease out the effect of methylation. In all, the study involved 37 pairs of twins in which one twin was homosexual and the other was heterosexual, and 10 pairs in which both twins were homosexual.

“A challenge was that because we studied twins, their DNA methylation patterns were highly correlated,” Dr. Ngun explained. Even after some initial analysis, the researchers were left with over 400,000 data points to sort through. “The high correlation and large data set made it difficult to identify differences between twins, determine which ones were relevant to sexual orientation, and determine which of those could be used predictively,” he added.

Other genetic researchers are reacting:

“Without validation of the result in an independent data set it is not really possible to know whether there is any substance in this claim,” said Gil McVean, a statistical geneticist at Britain’s University of Oxford. “My gut feeling it that, as the complete story unfolds, the association may not be quite as simple as the summary (abstract) and press release suggest. The important thing to note however is the mounting evidence that homosexuality is a perfectly normal trait segregating in human populations,” added genetics professor Darren Griffin of the University of Kent. But Dr. Margaret McCarthy, who studies the developing brain at the University of Maryland School of Medicine, said epigenetic changes could happen while a fetus is developing. “Developing male fetuses produce very high quantities of testosterone during the second trimester and this directs psychosexual development along masculine lines, a component of which is preference for females as sexual partners,” McCarthy said in a statement.

  • tristram

    Shouldn’t you be able to predict sexual orientation 90% of the time by checking the ‘straight’ box?

    • Sportin’ Life

      Sorry guy, didn’t read before duplicating. But yeah, that’s where my mind immediately went also.

    • radiofreerome

      That’s why the result is suspect. In order for it to be remarkable it has to be applied to a population with up-sampled gays.

  • Robincho

    In the wrong hands, this knowledge would fill me with unease…

    • Lakeviewbob

      Unease? Me too. I do not like this at all.

      • David L. Caster

        There is good and bad in this. The good part is that science may be about to confirm that there is a genetic basis for sexual preference beyond merely sex of the individual. The bad part is that it might be used to select for one or the other to serve some not-so-noble end.

        • Todd20036

          True, but the fact that orientation is genetic was never really an issue with anyone, merely an excuse.

          My question is, will haters start to be pro-abortion?

          • David L. Caster

            I suspect that those of them that are prone to consider homosexuality a disorder will now start pushing for a medical solution to the “problem”.

          • radiofreerome

            Albert Mohler of the Shitty Baptist Convention has already rationalized it.

          • David L. Caster

            Anybody that believes in the personality that is the God of Abraham can rationalize anything.

          • Joseph Miceli

            Of course he has. The only thing that these “Christians” have in common with Christ is the first six letters of their name.

          • Joseph Miceli

            I just perused some of his writings. What a confused mess of superstitious twaddle. The man is not some great thinker, he’s a superstitious flat-Earther.
            He goes so far as to say that, even if homosexuality is found to have a biological basis it is STILL sin and sin leads to Hell.
            Sorry, as an atheist I do not concede the existence of sin. I live a very moral life without it, thank you very much! Perhaps Albert Mohler should read MY writings. He might learn something but I doubt he has the capacity to do so.

          • radiofreerome

            Albert Mohler has the moral and intellectual depth of Eric Cartman.

          • Joseph Miceli

            And he lacks Eric Cartman’s civility.

          • Robincho

            Picture Gregory Peck in “Boys From Brazil” — only this time, he’s hellbent on eradication instead of development…

          • justmeeeee

            Not just haters, really–anybody who wants to choose the characteristics of their kids based on genetic factors. But it’s ironic that it’s the Geffen School of Medecine where this is getting its start.

          • David L. Caster

            Indeed, a peculiar kind of irony.

          • JIM W

            They always have been for themselves. Just keep it secret.

          • Queequeg

            I predict that they will.

    • ben-andy

      All knowledge, “in the wrong hands” is dangerous. That is the true meaning of the Blabbical story of the Tree of Knowledge. Tuck is a very nice, unassuming gay man [ok, not according to the Tallulah rule] who volunteers with a small non-profit I’ve been with for, um decades. The people most likely to be opposed to having a gay son are the least likely to abort a fetus that has been so determined to be. Will they make that child’s life living hell, perhaps. Or they might decide that DOG is testing them.

      • ElenorRigby

        again… which hands would be “right” for this information? Including raising a child assuming they’re gay.

    • ElenorRigby

      “in the wrong hands?” exactly which hands could be RIGHT? I mean… the only reason for this is to identify and abort babies that won’t be straight, right?

      • JIM W

        I don’t know why any loving parent would care about the sexual orientation of their child. If you provide a loving and honest relationship for your child they will tell you when they know their orientation. I hope for the day when we can move away from the importance of a child’s orientation and just accept them for who they are. UTOPIA?

        • ElenorRigby

          I’d guess that about 35% of people would think it’s a birth defect and would abort because “life like that would be hard.” About another 15% wouldn’t want the public shame of having a gay kid because “life like that would be hard for us.” And I’d bet another 15% would abort because “I want the family name continued.” Maybe 10% would abort because “I want a son I can throw around a ball with, not play with barbies.” Leaving only a handful of people who would knowingly choose having a gay son. Probably fewer would choose a gay daughter.

          • Nick in Pasadena

            Because of the ingrained sexism in our culture, I believe there would be far more distaste for a gay son than a gay daughter.

          • Ontogenesis

            Trust me, religious fundies hate gay women too.

            :Source: Lesbian outta Louisiana, ex-Evangelical.

          • Chris Baker

            Assuming this was a commonplace test. Probably would be very expensive. And only 70% accurate.

          • Gene

            at this point. it would be cheap in time…and, accuracy could be increased by repeated observation of the data points…
            this….will happen.

          • LovesIrony

            I think we are selling this generation of people having babies short. I’m impressed with the number of gay friendly people that are becoming parents these days

          • gaymex

            Among my married hetero friends, there is not one that would think having a gay child would be a bad thing. Just the opposite.

          • John T

            You’re gay. You choose your friends. You’ve chosen friends who aren’t assholes, which is important. Now think about everybody else’s friends, who are they?

            Time to trot out the old George Carlin quote: “Think about how stupid the average person is. Pretty stupid, right? Now think about the fact that half the people in this world are stupider than the average person!”

          • Gene

            I agree with John T below…you have chosen to be around good people.
            I work for many, most not aware I am gay, who would….will…I, we, have to use the present and future tense now, see this as a “birth defect”..and abort. To them, to have a downs syndrome child is not a shameful thing, and, over 90% of parents who know that their child has downs, abort.
            The fear of having a gay child, especially in some groups, is so great that a test for this will be found…marketed…used.
            /
            I always wanted to have proof of my not choosing to be gay to shut some fools up…now that it seems to have arrived….I find myself absolutely….mortified.
            .
            Before finance, I was medical, and did electro gel phoresis to map genes in a lab, working on the possible cause of a rare form of muscular dystrophy. Bio degree..worked for 3 years on a doctorate…have the masters. Knowing what I know from the science side…and how fundys from Alamaba to India..and even some people we think are our allies, maybe even are, till its THEIR kid, will react….
            I keep thinking of the play “the twilight of the golds”…and I am terrified.

          • mari

            I would never so much as wish not to have a gay kid, but I did worry when my offspring were younger about how it would make their lives more dangerous. But by the time one of them came out (finally!), she’d been doing so much scary stuff, most of it really wonderful volunteer work, that I didn’t have room for more worry.

          • Think about the white lesbian couple that is suing their doctor for wrongful birth because one of them had a black man’s sperm accidentally used to inseminate them. The daughter was born healthy, but the couple said the shame of raising her in an all white community was too much for them to handle.

            Gay folk can’t handle even a little bit of racial prejudice….I guess straight folk can’t handle homophobia either. People who can’t handle a child who isn’t “perfect”….straight, white, etc. shouldn’t be having children at all. I can’t condemn straights for aborting an “imperfect” gay kid when some gays are equally bigoted about different things.

          • VanillaNotChocolate

            Eww.

          • i’m gonna defend those ladies, just b/c.

            ok, reworking. if i pay to have a “white” sperm put in my hoo haw, and you are a licensed professional who charges me 30K$ to do so, you better, um, deliver. i don’t know if these women are racists or what. but i do know what it costs to have a professionally implanted baster baby. it’s more than many cars, or even houses, for some women.

            you’d sue a guy who sold you a lemon car, or a house with black mold he didn’t tell you about. that’s not meant to be ironic. where capitalism is good is that it allows people to reclaim the value of a promised investment.

            the saddest part of what i’m saying is that yes, these women probably could’ve adopted a newborn “child of color” for next to nothing. but “pure white” babies cost money, and thus i agree with their court actions.

          • Six Pins Delores

            ” i don’t know if these women are racists or what. but i do know what it costs to have a professionally implanted baster baby. it’s more than many cars, or even houses, for some women”
            The “professional” cost, 12 years post was 300k plus so many years ago. And I will never forget the face of the twelve year old girl I should have adopted.

          • If those ladies sued only for malpractice, I’d agree… but they specifically sued mainlybecause of the “shame” they felt. That is what their daughter will think growing up with from now on, that she is an abomination and her mothers think she is less than human.

            “We’re not racist, and we still love you, but…. honey, we wish you had never been born because you are black” doesn’t cut it in the annals of good parenting, and makes them shitty parents by any reasonable standard.

            It’s not illegal to be a racist. Many gays are. But it’s hypocritical for the gay community to say a woman should carry a gay baby to term, but “it’s different” for a black baby. A woman should be able to abort a baby for any reason, even a gay one. I just think it’s hypocritical for gays to say it’s okay to abort or stigmatize a half black kid because you aren’t prepared to raise it, but that it’s unethical to abort a gay one for the same reasons.

        • mari

          Really. Of all things I’d like to change about my offspring, queerness doesn’t even make the list. Way, way below “gene that makes them hog the bathroom,” on the not-list. I actually wouldn’t change them at all, not even the hetero one who drives me up a wall on a nearly daily basis. Because if they changed, they wouldn’t be THEM.

        • Duane Dimitrov

          Jim!

          Don’t be so naive!

          Why…hello? We have a book called “the Bible,” Jim. Or should I say Mr W?

          This book–a book of fairy tales written 2,000 years ago by pre-scientific savages inhabiting the shittiest part of the then-Roman Empire–is THE animating principle of 21st century America, Jim.

          And how could it not be? When faced with a moral dilemma, one ALWAYS says, “I must turn to this book of fairy tales and dubious moral lessons, this book of uncertain provenance, this book which posits an Angry Sky God of which there is zero proof, for ALL the answers I need.”

          How could it be anything but, Jim? ANY thinking person would immediately turn to this “good” book for validation of their petty prejudices and desire to oppress others….

          The moral Jim? The moral is I have clearly, and conclusively proved God and his only son Jeebus to definitively exist.

          That, and God/Jeebus just hate, hate, HATE gays….

      • Robincho

        Give an aria to Maria Callas and listen up. Give the same aria to Florence Foster Jenkins and throw up…

      • What?

        There are some jerks who would only be able to support gay rights if we were born this way.

        Because, you know, actually appreciating difference, even if not inborn, is terrible and we all have to be exactly alike unless we can’t help it.

        But for me, knowledge for its own sake is a good thing, and that’s enough of a reason.

  • I predict that suddenly pro-choice will look much more attractive to conservative Christians and RWNJs.

    • David L. Caster

      That particular demographic is prone to picking and choosing.

      • Cuberly

        Everything in life is a buffet and these guys are NOT starving to death.

        http://homedepotgiftcardbalance.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/old-country-buffet-coupons-free1.jpg

        • Webslinger

          I love how you mixed in Auntie Mame…

          • Cuberly

            This crowd is the Anti-Mame if ever there was. 😉

          • Webslinger

            low drawer for sure…

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            They’re just… ghastly.

          • Cuberly

            Indeed they are…..

      • TampaDink

        True, the “pro-lifers” more often than not are staunch supporters of the death penalty.

        • bkmn

          Life is sacred, until you are born and they don’t approve of you.

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          • GC

            “I am no friend to the fathers and mothers,
            and I am no friend to the sisters and brothers,
            I am no friend to the poor and oppressed,
            and I am no friend to the weak and distressed.

            But I am a friend of the fetus,
            A friend of incomparable worth.
            I am a friend of the fetus,
            Right up to the moment of birth.”

            (Carol Rose Livingstone; there’s a recording online by Shewho)

    • canoebum

      In the future, the list of acceptable exceptions that started with “cases of rape or incest”, will not end with “or to save the life of the mother” anymore, but will include “or to prevent a divergent sexuality”.

      • Gene

        I can already hear…give it a day or three, the first calls for “just find a cure, then we wont need ‘so called gay “”marriage”” “….it will happen.

      • Gest2016

        And the world will never see another Michaelangelo, Da Vinci, or Turing. It will become a cesspool filled with subhuman Cretans like Kim Davis.

        • Robincho

          Quim has never seen Crete. That’d be totally way too gay…

          • radiofreerome

            I learned the word “quim” from
            British translations of Martial’s Epigrams. Where did you learn it?

            P.s I’ve been trying not to call her that, but I slip up occasionally.

          • Robincho

            Nothing so astute as Martial, I’m afraid. I believe it was in a pub in Surrey, but still, I got the context of it right away. I employ it here as it seems not to cause the JMG firestorm you get with sea-unt…

          • jutta

            It’s not even in Merriam-Webster online dictionary, I found it in Oxford English Dictionary. So, chances are low that the word is included in any censor-word list. (I learn a lot here at JMG.)

          • Aurvara

            Berk is a synonym for that fine Saxon word. It’s also started to become less common over here. It was often used in comedies on TV a few decades ago, so it hadn’t the same bite as the word it stood in for.
            Quim is a great word. I don’t ever remember it being used as a swear word. Altogether too dainty, I suppose.

          • The word “quim” is used more than once in the 1995 film, “Rob Roy”, but I was aware of the word long before I saw the film. I don’t remember when or where.

      • Snarkaholic

        Or “to prevent future Democrats from voting”.

    • gaymex

      When you think of the hostility toward homosexuality that would be present in a family that wanted to abort the fetus because of the possibility of gayness, perhaps it would be for the best. Who would want a gay person to be brought up with such hate? Instead of aborting, how about letting us adopt them?

      • Why would you deny them the joy of aborting the child of your dreams?

    • catherinecc

      Just like how XXY / 45x babies are aborted regularly.

      http://www.nature.com/gim/journal/v14/n1/full/gim0b013e31822e57a7a.html

      They’ve already made attempts to affect sexual orientation inside the womb (anti androgens in xx fetuses), it’s only natural that the Christians will eagerly latch on to this in an effort to erase us.

    • Gest2016

      And strangely, if they ever do start aborting suspected gay fetuses i predict a growing recognition of human sexual fluidity. We all know that many bigots don’t object to gay sex (god knows half of them are blowing rentboys), its the public scknowledgement of it that they simply cannot tolerate.

    • Duane Dimitrov

      Wait.

      Do you mean to imply that conservatives will abandom previous policy positions if it suits their ever-present vile prejudices?

      Are you calling conservatism internally inconsistent? I certainly hope not….

    • Ontogenesis

      Or people in countries where having more than one child is too expensive, or prohibited, and the one child is expected to carry on the family line.

      I’m thinking of India and China.

    • Harlan92

      Although it is easy to focus on conservative Christians, an equal – if not bigger – threat would be from the pseudo-progressives: “Of course we’re not anti-gay. We just don’t want our child to face these kinds of challenges. We’ll try again later…”

  • Jeffrey

    Epigentics is fascinating. While I’d claim to fully understand it, it’s been known as the cause of homosexuality for a decade. It’s not genetic, it’s epigenetic. A series of hormone related switches that turn on or off.

    • Six Pins Delores

      ” the cause ” !

      • PLAINTOM

        Watching Faux News during pregnancy. 🙂 Spread the word.

  • [email protected]

    Another nail in the coffin of the ex-gay activists who still
    cling to and promote the discredited notion that homosexuality is some kind of
    developmental disorder.

    • David L. Caster

      Or a “choice”.

      • [email protected]

        Yes although this has fallen out of favor with all but the most dense of the anti-gays. For the most part they now admit that no it isn’t
        a choice but rather that something went wrong and that’s why the person become gay. I would note that this includes the claim that people are “recruited into homosexuality” but yes to some level the “it’s a choice people” are still out there.

        • Steven Leahy

          but…but….it was god’s plan! how can they find fault with god’s plan??

          • Chucktech

            Or god’s punishment…

          • David Walker

            Yeah. Way too many people see it that way.

          • [email protected]

            Well they would likely say that it is a result of a fallen
            world and thus disorders that come with that and not part of Gods plan but yes that does create a conflict with those who very much think that God is controlling everything.

        • StraightGrandmother

          Oh they sure are out there.

          • [email protected]

            Which amuses me cause then I’m like well if it is a choice
            then there should be no need for ex-gay therapy right??? They must be lying right, because they say it wasn’t a choice??? They always dodge those questions.

    • noni

      They will always be anti-gay. They will ramp up their already favorite line of “you might be a homosexual, but you shouldn’t partake in homosexual behavior’

      • [email protected]

        Yeah although that’s a less defensible position for them and
        they know it. once they admit that homosexuality is a naturally occurring sexual orientation just like heterosexuality their sexual ethic which condemns homosexuality looks all the more absurd.

    • StraightGrandmother

      Some one should alert those 2,000 Baptist Pastors who are meeting in Kentucky.
      See you can’t pray this away guys.

      • Six Pins Delores

        SG if you agree to participate in the Kim Davis Lesbian porn production and humiliate her, I will agree to give you half of my life savings

        • StraightGrandmother

          Laughing so hard it turned into a coughing fit!

          • Six Pins Delores

            I am sorry sweetheart!

      • Chucktech

        See you can’t pray this away, study be damned!

  • oikos
  • [email protected]

    Joseph Sciambra made an appearance in the comments over at Crisis again pushing the absurd notions of reparative therapy along with his own flair of claiming that porn use causes homosexuality. They love to insist that homosexuality is a developmental disorder caused by arrested emotional development. That’s their story and they are sticking to it although tellingly they don’t invest in it much given that all the ex-gay groups operate on tiny budgets.

    • PLAINTOM

      Hell NO ! Duggar isn’t a member of my tribe.

    • radiofreerome

      Isn’t Sciambra the whorebag who claims he had anal sex with Satan?

      • [email protected]

        Yup he is the one with the hour long video clip of him driving around SF and talking about all the different extreme sexual things he did before converting. He claims that porn is to blame for all that and makes people gay.

  • ultragreen

    The sample size of identical twins is too small and the number of possible epigenetic combinations within the genome is too large to draw reliable inferences from a single study. These results may be nothing more than a coincidence.

    • TexasBoy

      Perhaps, but it is certainly a study worth repeating by others for verification.

    • David L. Caster

      Science is hard.

      Human fallibilities send the scientific process hurtling in fits, starts and misdirections instead of in a straight line from question to truth.

      Source

    • Six Pins Delores

      Mad scientists looking for funding. GeeZuss!

    • lymis

      This may be just a coincidence, or it may be something that’s specific to twins, or to this particular population.

      It’s very interesting, and the 70% correlation is enough to prove Something Is Going On, but the 30% non-correlation is a clear indication that Something Else May Be Going On, too.

      If I read the quote correctly, they seem to be saying that they’ve identified something that may indicate a genetic predisposition in some people to react to environmental factors during development that enhance the likelihood of being gay.

      But that could also simply mean that someone without those predictors could still be gay for some other reason or because of even stronger environmental factors, and someone with them may not be gay because they were never activated.

      It’s interesting, but until they find something that can be used to take 1000 samples from a random population and accurately indicate who is and who isn’t gay, it may not be what they appear to be saying it is.

    • radiofreerome

      Support vector machines could produce generalizable results from such a small sample size. They are routinely used in bioinformatics precisely for their ability to generalize from a small sample size with a high-dimensional feature space.

      • Octavio

        Stop is, Sheldon!

  • The Professor

    Gay people know it is not a choice. And since straight people do not choose to be gay, they know it too. All that we are waiting for is the actual scientific proof.

    • StraightGrandmother

      Right, I do not choose to be straight.

      • Homo Erectus

        Me neither!

  • See! I knew it! It’s caused by parents using the epigenetic algorithm method!

  • Gustav2

    See, we can still blame our mothers.

    • David L. Caster

      Might as well flip a coin: half of our genes come from our fathers.

      • Steven Leahy

        It’s ALWAYS the mother’s fault. Always. Has been since the beginning of time.

        • David Walker

          I used to love melodramas. One of my favorite recurring lines was delivered by the heroine: “Why is it always the woman who pays…and pays…and pays?”

  • Six Pins Delores

    Blame the mother. WTF!

  • Sam_Handwich

    it’s like handedness, another behavioral orientation

    genetics are involved, but there are other prenatal factors that can contribute to sexuality

    • Six Pins Delores

      Well slap my no no parts with a ruler sister.

      • Sam_Handwich

        ok

    • DR: “Congratulations! It’s ham!”

      Ethel and Norman Handwich: “Sigh. We were expecting corned beef.”

      http://s5.postimg.org/y215lf2lj/wheat.jpg

      • SockMikey

        General, the UFO is entering earth’s atmosphere!

        We are getting a communication about “Servicing Mankind”…. 👽

        • LonelyLiberal

          Don’t get on that ship! It’s a SEX MANUAL! Er, give me your ticket, please, I’ll get on that ship…

  • Sportin’ Life

    You can get a 90+% rate of success by guessing heterosexual every time, right?

    • ultragreen

      Yes, pretty much. That would be the base rate accuracy.

  • Bj Lincoln

    I have mixed emotions about this. Our relief due to the conformation of what we have been saying all along is bittersweet given this could be used against us. It is still a small sample and loads of factors. I hope they keep looking but keep it out of the hands of the enemy. Albert Einstein fled Germany when his experiments for good was turned into a horrible weapon right before WWII. He warned us.

    • David Walker

      Can one, then, predict that a fetus will become a xn loon? That information could come in handy, too.

      • Homo Erectus

        You’ve got to be carefully taught.

      • Six Pins Delores

        “Abort Abort Abort” Patsy Stone

  • It’s caused by heterosexuality. Every single gay person was caused by heterosexuality.

    • Six Pins Delores

      Not nessesscerily.

      • EdmondWherever

        Very true. Gay people are not sterile, and can become parents. Those children are most likely going to be heterosexual, but not always. Gays can beget gays.

        • Homo Erectus

          I have a gay son.

          • Octavio

            I hope so.

          • Homo Erectus

            I really tried to not be gay back in the ’80s. I got married and had kids. It was a disaster. I ended up with sole custody of my kids and raised them as a single parent. One is gay, one is straight. I love them both to pieces. Would I do things differently if I could? Hell no! I can’t imagine life without either of them. Of course when I go to a gay bar with my son (he’s 28 now), I get a lot of “Oh, sure”………….

          • Octavio

            That’s what you get for having a cute butt. 🙂

          • Homo Erectus

            It’s all in the jeans, honey 😉

        • Six Pins Delores

          I am familiar with the fathers of at least 15.

  • TampaDink

    “Pro-life” crazies will soon include the right to terminate pregnancies.

    • PLAINTOM

      The right to MANDATE abortions. These are true believers.

      • TampaDink

        Yes. Mandated abortion to make sure that no man dated your son.

    • Homo Erectus

      Wouldn’t be funny if it turned out that they couldn’t perform the test until mid-way through the 3rd trimester?

      • John T

        If God could convince Abraham to sacrifice his full-grown son Isaac, I’m sure God can convince modern-day Christians to abort their viable gay fetuses or even commit infanticide against their gay newborns. Unfortunately, God does not exist so he can’t appear and say “Gotcha! I was just testing your faith, please don’t actually kill your child like I told you to.”

        • jizabel

          God has already convinced modern-day christians to kill their gay or presumably gay children, sadly.

      • TampaDink

        Yes….except that they’d have repealed all of the existing laws about late term abortions. Where they’ve managed to eliminate clinics, suddenly they’d sponsor drive thru abortion clinics in every county in every state.

  • noni

    I’m a meth baby.

    A product of my meth.

    Methylation that is.

  • Steven Leahy

    70% doesn’t seem to mean a lot. In the early days of HIV, they correlated a high % of HIV with high %’s of Hep-B infections, even though one is completely unrelated to the other. Also, what about lesbian identical twins? What about fraternal twins? What about fraternal twins (as in my case), where one ends up being a gay man and one ends up being a lesbian? Too many questions needing a helluva lot more study and vetting.

    • Six Pins Delores

      ThIs is the offgassing of a scientist looking for $.

      • Steven Leahy

        LOL I like that…”offgassing” 🙂

        • Six Pins Delores

          I do not know anything about dr. Ngun, but he should learn some disiplin and stfu until he is able to prove ANYTHING.

    • Ginger Snap

      Was’t there a study done on men that had died from AIDS and they tried to correlate something in the brain as why they were gay? I vaguely remember this and it got discredited.

      • Steven Leahy

        I believe so. Lots of theories however no definitive proof from any angle.

      • Octavio

        There was a research physician, gay with AIDS, who had found a slight difference in size of a part of the pineal gland, which itself is about the size of a pea. So a really, really, really small part of something really small. Never hear of any final conclusions except that the physician died. 🙁

        • Ginger Snap

          I remember there being some debate as they did not know for sure if all the men were gay and if it might have been something the virus had caused.

          • Octavio

            Yup. There was a lot of “this” and “that” and “the other” regarding that guy’s research. But he was following strict scientific method. I doubt anyone continued the research after his passing.

    • Homo Erectus

      We’re talking about teabaggers here. They don’t need no stinkin’ study and vetting.

  • Jan Wesselius

    This cannot be good for the evangelical haters. If they find their kid is going to be gay, they cannot abort him. Since they can now point out the DNA this blows to hell their belief that gays choose if they are gay or not. Oh my, what’s a evangelical suppose to do?

    • TampaDink

      I think that they would become advocates for abortion if the fetus is gay. Those assholes are noted for their “pro-life” platform including support of the death penalty & opposition to universal health care.

      • Jan Wesselius

        Yes. Since they cherry pick the bible they can cherry pick death as well.

        • TampaDink

          Hypocrisy is one of the things that they excel at.

      • Snarkaholic

        They’ll just do what they do best: lie. They’ll say that the wife had a ‘malignant uterine growth’…which required a ‘D&C’.

        • TampaDink

          Like the one that Karen Santorum had in her 3rd trimester.

      • Homo Erectus

        The up-side is that the “pray the gay away” types just had all the air
        let out of their argument.

    • Steven Leahy

      I predict group homes. Rehabilitation centers like for other genetic defects /snark

    • RoFaWh

      what’s a evangelical suppose to do?

      My gut reaction is “fucking grow up and stop being stupid.”

      • Chucktech

        I was gonna say lose their bullshit religion, but I like yours better.

    • Homo Erectus

      Jan, they can and will abort them. Their rulebook only applies to other people.

  • Wynter Marie Starr

    Let me guess; abortion will now not be a problem provided a woman is carrying a fetus that might potentially grow into a gay child. This is horrendous. People need to think about the contributions that gay people have made throughout history. I can see a certain segment of our population using this to commit genocide.

    • David Walker

      Abortion becomes a sacrament.

      • Wynter Marie Starr

        Absolutely. We learn nothing from history, David. There are millions of women missing from Asia and South East Asia due to abortion of female fetuses. Social scientists are having a field day and watching as the predictions of violence become fact because of a severe gender imbalance.

        Being LGBT is obviously biological and serves a purpose. Beyond that, the contributions to the arts and sciences (and every other area of life) made by gay people are staggering. Humanity would be much poorer without those contributions.

        • Steven Leahy

          Right. I wonder why, unlike every other animal on the planet, we cannot just let members of our species BE, as they are.

          • Homo Erectus

            There’s no money in that, silly boy;-)

          • Wynter Marie Starr

            I often wonder that myself, Steven. It’s the consequence of intelligence.

          • Christopher Smith

            Wherever would insecure hatemongering bigots be without their SCAPEGOATS?

    • Fritz Keppler

      The Religious Right would turn abortion from an abomination into a sacrament.

  • Tim in Big D

    This reminds me of the time my mother was at our house and we watched Twilight of the Golds. I asked her if she would have aborted my gay brother and me if she had known we’d be gay. She took WAY too long to answer, pondering for what seemed like FOREVER before saying she WASN’T SURE. Can you imagine how that made me feel? Bitch.

    • TampaDink

      I love that movie….and have had similar awkward experiences when watching it with family members.

      • Tim in Big D

        One would think she’d at least have TRIED some version of “OF COURSE NOT!” haha

        • Chucktech

          Really! Jesus, I hope Mothers Day was never the same after that…

          • Tim in Big D

            Oh we’re completely estranged now, haven’t spoken for years. Her deep, deep shame of us is just too toxic.

          • David Walker

            Same with my father. We weren’t speaking when he died, and it didn’t/doesn’t bother me in the least. People have said, “Oh, that’s so sad.” “You don’t know the situation” tends to be my reply.

          • Tim in Big D

            Same here. It doesn’t bother me whatsoever. In fact, it’s one the healthiest things I’ve ever done for myself.

          • Chucktech

            Hear, fucking hear!

          • People can be so kind. I used to get pressed about those details CONSTANTLY around the holidays. People could care less if I spent the 4th of July alone, but a solitary Thanksgiving and Christmas was a tragedy. I never wanted to share the horrific details of the estrangements, but one year I was so tired of the focus I finally told them I was Jewish. Worked for a while until someone gossiped about it in the company cafeteria and then one coworker approached me to ask for help with her daughters Hanukkah school project and another one asked me to go to temple with her family.

          • Chucktech

            Oh, what a tangled web we weave…

          • perversatile

            I swear to G*d I do the same thing and have yet to be found out.

          • Christopher Smith

            That’ll learn you to lie, sonny.

          • Steven Leahy

            I totally get it, and why you feel as you do. I was never close to mine, and really don’t miss him. Sounds horrible, I know. I will say it was less-bad towards the end now, he chilled a bit as he got older. I am sure the gay thing was THE unspoken issue. My brother coming out had to be devastating to him (my father) as he puffed him up to be the straight stud for a son he always wanted.

          • Homo Erectus

            I’ll just leave this here:

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcZLMtWEcF0

          • PLAINTOM

            Her loss.

    • I was told “at least I’ll have one normal son.”

      Imagine my schadenfreude when the little fucker turned out to be gayer than a pair of rainbow roller skates.

      • Tim in Big D

        lol that’s awesome. I have two “normal” brothers as well as the gay one. One of them is a born again FANATICAL holy roller. He just got his 3rd (or 4th) divorce. My gay brother just celebrated his 43rd anniversary with his husband and we’ll soon celebrate our 27th.
        So there! 🙂

        • Steven Leahy

          Question….what is your birth order?

          • Tim in Big D

            Gay, straight, gay, straight (oldest to youngest)

          • Steven Leahy

            Interesting….yeah guess that shatters some of the birth-order tale! They say usually they’re progressively more likely to be gay as the mother has more and more children.

          • Tim in Big D

            Yes, I’ve read about that theory. My mom miscarried a 5th son after the 4 of us. I guess he would’ve been the tie-breaker!

          • GW in NZ

            The so-called ‘fraternal birth order effect’ (see Proceedings on the National Academy of Sciences (DOI: 10.1073/pnas.0511152103)) is very real and prenatal in origin, even if the reasons for it are unclear.
            Certainly behavioural genetics is a very tricky field.

          • I heard that as well, but when the mother has progressively more sons. My first partner who came from an Italian Catholic family was an example of that. Straight, straight, straight, fabulous, gay.

            Funny story. Straight number 2 was devastatingly handsome out of all five. I’m sure with three beers and tickle he would at least stick the tip in. I accidentally blurted that out at Thanksgiving (just the handsome part, not the 3 beers part). Well everyone laughed it off and straight number 2 was suddenly much more interested in me. My partner was eternally pissed after that and we split up shortly thereafter.

          • Steven Leahy

            Maybe birth order is only a predictor of how much you try to hide it and how many hangups you have!

          • Six Pins Delores

            I must attend more Italian Thanksgiving gatherings,
            Sorry about your breakup!

          • Thanks, but it’s fine. I met current Mr. Man shortly thereafter and we just passed 21 years. Previous Mr. Man and I are friends and his family still loves me. His Mom never lets him forget that he let “the good one get away” YAY for Italian Catholic guilt!

          • Six Pins Delores

            “I met current Mr. Man shortly thereafter and we just passed 21 years”
            “Another one bites the dust”
            YAY for remaining friends and a moms good eye.

          • Luckily for me I had two great men with moms who are gems and accepting families.

          • Homo Erectus

            😉

          • Joseph Miceli

            It is EXACTLY like Jewish guilt. We Catholics just have better food.

          • Christopher Smith

            Loving your ex mother in law.

          • Ginger Snap

            1. straight brother
            2. straight brother
            3. straight brother
            4. straight brother
            5. straight sister
            6. Flaming Me

            I would like to add that there are gays and lesbians in every generation(some we aren’t 100% sure but we have decided they were) on both sides of my family.

          • LAguy323

            Makes me think of this photo.

          • Ginger Snap

            That was me.

          • John T

            No, that doesn’t shatter anything. I bought a scratch-off lottery ticket once and won $5, but that didn’t shatter the idea that most scratch-off tickets are losers.

          • Steven Leahy

            Well it’s far from proven, either.

          • JuanGalicia

            Same here, i was the first, then my sister , then my brother but They’re straight.

          • unsavedheathen

            More and more sons. Still statistically true.

          • Aurvara

            I’m the gay eldest brother. In our village there was a family of eight. Six boys and two girls. All the men are big and burly. The third and the sixth turned out to be gay. I think there is something to it. It could well be the repeated birth of boys that causes some of the epigenetic changes if this stuff pans out.

          • DaddyRay

            1) Lesbian Sister
            2) Straight Brother
            3) Me
            4) Straight brother

          • Joseph Miceli

            Well, that doesn’t fit the model.

      • Steven Leahy

        LOL I was first out…then my younger brother and twin sister simultaneously outed each other when they got into a fight. Only one older sister who is straight. My father was so counting on him, too!

        • LOL I forgot to add that the little fucker and I share the same father, but have different mothers.

          • Steven Leahy

            DUDE same HERE! Are we soul twins?

        • JT

          Was your farther “counting on him” to be straight or to have offspring? Obviously he could have one without the other.

          • Steven Leahy

            Likely BOTH. This was >25 years ago and in small town Midwest. I was in the military when I came out about 6 years earlier, so he had some time to adjust. My brother and I have different mothers so good ole dad was the common denominator. I am sure that and my brother turning into a drag queen for a few years didn’t help.

          • Reality.Bites

            To quote Josh Thomas, who also has a gay brother, “that’s some pretty bitchy sperm.”

      • Homo Erectus

        Don’t you just love Karma?

      • LAguy323

        If they don’t get the children they want, they’ll get the children they need.

      • Christopher Smith

        Karma
        is a BITCH. 😀

    • Jamie Brewer

      The original stage play had a totally different ending from the movie version. In the original play, the gay fetus was aborted causing damage to Suzanne’s uterus rendering her sterile. I can’t bring myself to watch the movie. I’m reminded how MGM made two endings for the Gretta Garbo film “Love” based on “Anna Karenina”. The “happy ending” made for the American midwest audiences is painful to watch when you know the real story.

      • Tim in Big D

        Oh that’s interesting! I knew that it was originally a play, but had no idea about the rest of that story. Thanks for that tidbit!

      • David Walker

        Have you ever seen the movie version of “Our Town”? I watched it once to hear Aaron Copland’s music and about puked at the re-written ending.

        • Jamie Brewer

          I watched it years ago on the Youtubes as i prepped for a colonoscopy drinking gallons of that vile “golitly” stuff. The movie ending was pretty much the same as the procedure. Pained…..

        • Christopher Smith

          Dreadful. Even Streetcar was censored (they were allowed to show NONE of the rape, which is of course pivotal)….

    • Larry Ft Pierce

      ask a silly question……………

    • Xuuths

      I am so sorry you had that horrible experience.

  • PLAINTOM

    The fundies just magically discovered that their God is in favor of abortion.

    • Steven Leahy

      It’s in the New New testament

    • Chucktech

      Only if the fetus is already going to hell…

  • radiofreerome

    This reminds me of the Masters and Johnson announcement that sexual orientation could be changed in most cases. The Virginia Johnson later admitted that the results were completely fake. (See http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/homosexuality-cure-masters-johnson. )
    It is too early to panic. The results of this study are not presented in a statistically legitimate way because the accuracy of the method can’t even be meaningfully represented by a single number.

    I’ll bet the authors get their asses handed to them in the peer-review process.

    Of course, if I’m wrong, abortion will become a sacrament.

    • Snarkaholic

      Did Mark Regnoramus contribute to this study?

      • Desmond Rutherford

        That was my first thought, too.

    • Snarkaholic

      Peers: What is your proof that this woman’s fetus is gay?
      Them: Because it kicks (up its heels and dances) every time we play Cher songs.

  • Raising_Rlyeh

    This is a rare case where I have to agree with the idea that just because you can do something doesn’t mean you should. I question why researchers felt the need to develop such a test. This has oblivious and serious implications that could mean genocide.

    • David Walker

      There are some parents about whom I’ve thought, “Just because you can have kids doesn’t mean you should.” I understand what you’re saying.

  • thevofl

    While I applaud the result that there is scientific justification for homosexual genetics (no doubt in my mind), I am wondering what the hell society is going to do with this information.

  • Silver Badger

    Hopefully this will be one of those incredibly expensive procedures.

  • Ore Carmi

    I can’t wait to see the actual study.

    I’m confused by the comments of that last researcher from U. Maryland. I thought exposure to high levels of testosterone in the womb increase the likelihood that the child will be gay.

    • Homo Erectus

      The study involved male twins – both peeing in the same pool. Who knows what effect that’ll have on the kids?

  • Homo Erectus

    Does this mean we may have been born this way?

    • Ore Carmi

      Oh, I’ve taken that as a given for at least a decade now. Researchers may not have teased out the mechanism(s), but they’ve known for a long, long time now that post-natal environment has nothing to do with it.

    • Steven Leahy

      Someone’s to blame. Somewhere. Now to find the cure.

      • Macbill

        Benghazi

      • StraightGrandmother

        Wouldn’t that be wild though if you could go to a medical center and have them do something to block that epigentic thing, and you come out straight. Boy talk about ex-gay therapy, this would bring that to a whole new level.

        • Steven Leahy

          It’d make the world an infinitely duller, less interesting place. The thought of being able to do that or willing to makes me sick to my stomach. Can’t imagine much that would be less ethical.

          • StraightGrandmother

            OMG, I just thought of this, then the haters would say, “HA! We were right all along, you are simply choosing to be gay!”

          • Homo Erectus

            This is what you would end up with:

  • Andrea_Rae

    just guess straight, you’ll be correct more than 70% of the time!

    • radiofreerome

      They’re probably staring results on a non-representative population, one created by up sampling gays.

      • David Walker

        You’ve used “up sampling” a couple of times. What does that mean? Sorry. I’m unfamiliar with the phrase.

        • radiofreerome

          Up-sampling means randomly creating a population in which a rarer trait is more common. For example, if we randomly choose n gays and n straights so that the proportions of gays and straights are equal, this would be up-sampling gays. Being able to predict gays and straights with a 70% accuracy on such a population would be somewhat of an achievement.

          • David Walker

            Thanks. I think I get it now.

  • Cleo

    i’d be interesting in taking the test to see how many of the 9 areas I “hit.” So if you just hit a couple of markers are you just kinda gay or bi, if you hit 4-5 would you be averagely gay or if you hit all 9 would that make you a super fabulously gay? How about if you don’t hit any of the markers and realize you’ve been sleeping with the same sex just to be fashionable and trendy? when you’ve actually been straight the whole time. I do worry about the whole cherry-picking your children aspect. Not just with orientation but there could eventually be a whole shopping list. Couples could eventually harvest a bunch of eggs, fertilize them and then test to see which couplings would provide the brightest, healthiest, tallest, most blue-eyed, blond “normal” child.

    • StraightGrandmother

      Isn’t there something called a Gold Star Gay?

      I think I know what it is but I’m not sure, I think a person who is a Gold Star Gay never had a relationship with a straight person.

      Maybe if you hit all 9, (I just picture the lottery balls dropping out of the spinning bin) it’s like BINGO, Gold Star Gay?

      • fuow

        Must be, cause I’m definitely 100% très gay.

  • Steven Leahy

    And here this WHOLE TIME I thought it was my domineering mother and absent father!

    • David Walker

      Really. Why are these people trying to challenge the obvious reasons?

    • I thought it was because my older neighbor friend who loved to play Sonny and Cher. She was always Sonny and that made me Cher by default. Same thing with Captain and Tennille.

      • Steven Leahy

        I always thought Cher was the more masculine one!

        • Maybe now, but this was the early 70’s

          • 2guysnamedjoe

            Does she comment on JMG?

      • Homo Erectus

        I thought it was caused by watching Flipper:

        • Steven Leahy

          I used to have the hots for Johnny Quest!

          • Steven Leahy

            Now I know why! The dads…ALWAYS together.

          • Christopher Smith

            Ohhhh MY………….

          • Jerrelt

            Ok…..so I see a pattern. I loved Johnny quest and his all male family as a kid.

      • BlueberriesForMe

        “I never wanted….I never wanted to touch a man….the way I want to touch you”. :=).

    • Kara Connor

      Time to recycle old jokes for the environment…
      Bob: “My mother made me a homosexual!”
      Larry: “If I give her the wool, will she make me one?”

      I wonder if/when similar markers will be found for lesbians. It’s quite hard to track down any good research on the genetics of that, whereas there are a number of papers suggesting that maternal fecundity is related to male homosexual offspring.

  • StraightGrandmother

    For the Firsrt Time I used Joe’s Tweet feature that is at the end of his articles.
    I haven’t been taking advantage of that, it’s a new feature and I was so used to creating my own tweets that my eyes just kind of glazed over that nifty new feature.

    I think this story is a pretty big deal.

  • Cuberly

    OT: (Sorry) But this was too good to pass. Rep. Mark Takano (D-CA) and his staff decided to take out a CraigsList ad for a house speaker.

    https://twitter.com/RepMarkTakano/status/652225913317421056?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

    • David L. Caster

      The ad might be more effective it was placed in the M4M section of the personals.

      • Cuberly

        Under, Casual Encounters…seems to be the track record they’re running with.

      • 2guysnamedjoe

        Or the childcare section.

        • David L. Caster

          As in babysitters.

    • Six Pins Delores

      Seems the functionally elected retarded need to feel they make a contribution to society too…

    • Stev84

      The line “maintaining women’s access to health care” is confusing.

  • StraightGrandmother

    Can we test Putin’s DNA?

    • BlueberriesForMe

      Mostly jackal – with a dose of hyena.

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    Why do I feel we’re about to hear the Christian Right announcing an “exemption” in regards to their hardline stand on abortions. Hey, I can’t be the only one thinking they wouldn’t do it.

  • ten bucks says this is why Santorum had his last kid aborted….

  • Three Cheers for “Developing male fetuses produce very high quantities of testosterone during the second trimester”

    https://squareup.com/market/NashvilleGrizzliesRFC/grizzlies-calendar

    • LonelyLiberal

      Looking at the leftward grizzly takes me right back to the second trimester. I’m pouring the stuff into my bloodstream while viewing that…

  • Bill T.

    I’d be much more interested in a genetic test to determine if someone will be an asshole.

    • safari2bongaloo

      fMRI scans can detect if someone is a conservative based on their brain’s blood flow during a Q&A.

      • GreatLakeSailor

        zero flow to the frontal lobes and a ballooned amygdala, right?

  • Chuck in PA

    So, can they study DNA of all ethnic backgrounds, non-twins, too, and determine who is gay with 70% certainty? Or, when they are shown two samples of DNA, where one of them is taken from a gay, they can determine which one with 70% certainty. Does it work with males and females equally? What about bisexuals?

    • Steven B

      As I read it, they used twins to identify the 400,000 markers. And used those markers, applying them to the general population, to predict sexuality.

  • houstonray

    And Republican’s will be holding a special session to defund the research….lest they be outed…

    • Steven Leahy

      For next will come a test for the “defect”…

  • fuow

    Sounds like McCarthy is whistling past the graveyard for junk science.

  • Queequeg

    The right wingers will suddenly favor abortion on demand.

  • JT

    But can they account for gaydar?

    • BlueberriesForMe

      That’s genetically determined as well.

  • Stev84

    This should suddenly make right-wingers like abortion

  • VodkaAndPolitics

    Oooh, I’ve got like a 95% accuracy rate just by looking at people.

  • GanymedeRenard

    Stupendous! Like the immense majority of other LGBT folks, I never chose to be gay – this seems to prove it. However, had I chosen it, what difference would that make? The law should still protect that freedom the same way it protects religious freedom!

  • fuzzybits

    I don’t care about any studies. I am who I am. I’ve accepted it,world it’s your turn.

  • LonelyLiberal

    My method’s so much more fun. If I sleep with them, they’re gay. Or at least bi.

  • Steven H

    70% is more than good enough to convince the vast majority of the population that homosexuality is determined by birth, but not nearly exact enough for people to feel comfortable aborting their (quite possibly straight) babies.

    Besides, the people who would abort a gayby are the same people who don’t believe in science. If science predicts that their future child is gay, they simply won’t believe it, just as they refuse to believe that vaccinating said gayby isn’t austism-promoting witchcraft foisted on them by a cabal of scientists who have already cured cancer but want to keep us sick because there’s more profit in cancer treatment than actually curing cancer. These aren’t rational people.

    At any rate, I suspect that–at least in the vast majority of countries–testing a fetus for sexuality would be made illegal, just as prenatal gender tests are currently illegal in countries that commonly practice sex-selective abortion (i.e. China and India)

    • catherinecc

      We’re already comfortable with engaging in this behaviour. Granted, there can be additional problems with these disorders, but intersex fetuses are aborted on a stunning regular basis.

      http://www.nature.com/gim/journal/v14/n1/full/gim0b013e31822e57a7a.html

      Two specific types of SCAs, 45,X (Turner syndrome) and 47,XXY (Klinefelter syndrome), in particular, were associated with termination. Nine studies (47.4%)8,9,10,18,20,23,27,28,29 indicated that parents with a Turner syndrome-affected fetus would be more likely to terminate the pregnancy, with an average termination rate of 76% (range: 33–100%). Seven studies (36.8%)3,8,9,10,18,20,22 reported a diagnosis of Klinefelter syndrome led parents to decide to terminate the pregnancy, yielding an average termination rate of 61% (range: 44–85%). As an example, a study conducted by Sagi et al.20 examined 60 cases from patient records in the 10 years between 1989 and 1998 and identified that all five pregnancies (100%) exhibiting 45,X (Turner syndrome) and 85% (n = 7) with 47,XXY (Klinefelter syndrome) were terminated. Moreover, Hamamy et al.8 assessed 61 records of SCAs at the University Hospital of Geneva and found that, among SCAs, Turner syndrome led to the highest rate of pregnancy termination (100%) and Klinefelter syndrome, to the second highest rate of termination (73.9%).

      • Steven H

        good point. I didn’t realize that

      • William

        I didn’t realize Kleinfelter’s was considered a serious enough condition to warrant abortion. The doctors doing the genetic testing have to counsel the parents. ASA far as genetic conditions go, there are others with far gloomier outlooks.

        • catherinecc

          There isn’t really any reason for it to be. Relatively minor issues, if any. Just icky.

  • Chris Baker

    Another issue is that being gay is self-identiifed. So the ‘straight’ twin could actually be gay too, just in denial. Or they both could be Bi and just one prefers men and the other women, at this point in life.

    • Reality.Bites

      I’m guessing that the gay-in-denial guys with gay twins aren’t likely to volunteer for the study.

  • EscherEnigma

    Interesting, but not terribly surprising. And if I understand how epigenetics works correctly, this wouldn’t be a terribly useful method during the pregnancy, only after.

    As a side note, how many people do you think would know what the word “epigenetics” means if it weren’t for this search on what makes people gay?

    • KnownDonorDad

      People don’t understand what chemical modifications of DNA or a region of the genome are, or even what “genome” means. A combination of anti-intellectualism driven by fundamentalism and lazy science communication. Fortunately, resources are out there for those that want to learn.

    • perversatile

      Isn’t epigenetics a hair removal system? Just having a go atcha,
      my Step-Father teaches Statistical Genomics and Bioinformatics at uni.
      You can only imagine how loaded the dinner time question of-
      “what did you learn in school today Son?” was.

  • HeyBudBoston

    Oh, good, now we can start eliminating the straight assholes.

    • radiofreerome

      Not a terribly helpful thing to write. Even if most straight people would erase is given the chance, we don’t need to be that way.

      • Homo Erectus

        I think Bud just forgot to add the .

      • rabbit_ears

        Unless they can identify a genetic predisposition towards being asshats. There’s something both straight and gay folk can use. Pretty much the whole GOP would have been branded at birth and exiled 😉

  • KnownDonorDad

    I have to urge some caution here because this was data presented at a conference, not in a peer-reviewed paper. It’s an important step to presenting data to the scientific community, but an initial step.

    • JustSayin’

      Sadly a predictable endpoint is that a test will be developed for first trimester evaluation leading to abortion . also fake cures will abound from the same people who put up the faux pregnancy clinics that are just mills to keep women from aborting unwanted pregnancies.

      An industry of genocide will crop up around this, legal or not, and millions will dies at the hands of radical religious types yet again.

  • Ninja0980

    As others have stated, I’m betting Republicans will have no problem with abortions now if it means getting rid of an LGBT person.

  • Kenster999

    I don’t think this will make fundamentalists suddenly support abortion. Instead, they’ll look at it like a deformity, like being disabled in some way. (They don’t encourage abortion for fetuses known to be severely disabled, for example.) Instead, they’ll just look on it as a pity and “one of those things” that some folks have to deal with. “It’s your cross to carry.” Although I’d throw back in their face that Jesus said that God will never give you more to carry than you are able, and telling someone to live a life without love is too much for anyone (and also violates “It is not good for man to be alone”).

    • 2guysnamedjoe

      Birth defects, in their view, will still be god’s will, and the baby will be the object of their pity and prayers. Teh ghey, on the other hand, will continue to be a big sin wilfully committed by a big sinner, cuz it says so right there in that big ol’ book of theirs. Science won’t change their minds about that — never did and never will.

      • Steven Leahy

        Exactly, they like having us around as objects to pity, ridicule and condemn. Their lives would be SO much less interesting without that.

  • there’s a really, really good short about this in one of the best of sci fi volumes i read regularly. tl;dr: it’s a gay male couple. he’s a detective, his lover/husband is an activist of sorts. it’s written in the future, and equality is much greater than today. anyway, there’s a murder in a science lab, and he’s got to investigate.

    turns out the science lab was working on a tangential thing. a gene and medicine thing. to help babies. but it has a side effect. now, you can “screen out” the gaii! with just a shot and a treatment when pregnant. do you want to do that? some do.

    what does society, and our community do, when this can really happen? how many xtians will line up to see that it becomes mandatory? religion is my personal number one foe, but i also fear science gone wrong. that can happen too.

    • Six Pins Delores

      Chix and balances.

    • perversatile

      Hey CD – have you read Nancy Kress’ “Beggars in Spain” ? it’s the first of the Sleepless trilogy. I re-read it about a month ago (signed first edition!) Still thoroughly enjoyable.
      http://nancykress.com/books/?lcp_page1=3#lcp_instance_1

  • Jan Wesselius

    The fundies will allow abortion. They will call it as preserving the race for God.

  • perversatile

    Growing up, my little brother had
    severe learning/behavioral disabilities,
    his Doctor suggested Family Counseling
    to help us, help him -blah blah blah,
    (which was really surprising
    considering Mom and Dad’s
    Couples Therapy was rubbish).
    I was kind of excited,
    I thought it would be like ‘The Bob Newhart Show’
    One week later and 20 minutes into our first session,
    The individual whos office we were in,
    ( I’m loath to use the word Doctor)
    after the briefest of exchanges,
    suggested, rather emphatically
    that all of our family problems
    stemmed from my Homosexuality.
    Mom stood up, grabbed me and my little brother
    (at the time I was glad she was holding our hands,
    because I was pretty sure someone was about to get punched)
    and proceeded to tell the lady that she was talking out her ass,
    then intimated, she had obtained her degree by sucking cock.
    In the elevator, the car, during dinner,
    the parents were having one of those
    “quiet not in front of the kids”
    seething furious arguments,
    when Dad blamed Mom for like the 10th time
    saying it was all her fault, Mom had had enough.
    “Listen JimmyEarl-
    it’s lookin like being Gay is genetic,
    and it’s nobody’s fault
    because it AIN’T A FUCKIN’ PROBLEM.
    If you want to fight me on this,
    I will make it a problem.
    While we’re on this topic,
    you have a Gay uncle
    4 Gay cousins,
    and I’m pretty sure
    your sister is a Lesbian.
    I’m not suggesting
    that Homosexuality runs in your family,
    I’m saying Homosexuality
    skips -prances- loves musical theatre
    -has great taste
    -and does your Mothers hair like it was getting paid.”

    • Ogre Magi

      Wow what an awesome mom

      • perversatile

        thanks- my Mom would agree with you!

    • Christopher Smith

      That is a GREAT, GREAT story!

  • txscotty39

    My twin sister passed at 9 months. I have always wondered if she would have been gay too. Older sister is lesbian and has been with partner for 62 years, although we no longer speak. Two straight brothers and one straight sister. Totally dysfunctional family.

    • Steven Leahy

      Sorry to hear the sad parts of your story but I can totally relate.

      • txscotty39

        Thank you.

  • disqus_oCvsL5SBJH

    It’s not like any Christians/Republicans have any actual interest in science. Like literacy and independent thought, science is just the devil trying to lead you astray!

  • I don’t buy this research. Although it might be possible that homosexual (or any alternative sexuality) tendencies are due to physical factors such as DNA sequencing — or perhaps other factors that we are not aware of yet, I do not believe that 70% of all homosexuality (or whatever) can be predicted with today’s knowledge and technology. I am not sure (although it might be true) that environmental and behavioral factors should be discounted in any discussion in any discussion of what “causes” anyone to be LGBT. . What concerns me about any line of thinking that being gay is determined by genetic factors in the womb is a. this logic treats being gay as something that can “cured”– perhaps with DNA sequencing “therapy” – and the horrific results that will result to LGBT people and their acceptance in society if our elimination can be seen as positive modern-day eugenics. Dear God, please let us hope that LGBT people will be seen as normal human beings and not genetic accidents.

  • JCF

    “in pairs of identical male twins”

    Ah, so this has nothing to do w/ those of us who are XX. Per always. >:-/

    Good googly-moogly, just ONCE I’d love to see some “scientific discovery re human beings”, and all the test subjects were FEMALE. Just once!

  • ayzach

    I have always wondered what would happen in this scenario. would gay groups remain supportive of pro-choice groups even when its a gay fetus being aborted or will they part ways.

    • James

      Selective abortion isn’t the same thing as abortion. I don’t know a single person who supports the right to abortion who also supports sex-selection abortions.

  • Danny McVey

    I don’t need a damned gene to justify my love life.

  • LAguy323

    The premise for the play, Twilight of the Golds.

  • Blake Jordan

    Pro-life is going to become even more conditional…

  • The only purpose of this story or these ‘findings’ is to annoy the extreme right with the idea that there is a gay gene and there’s no cure.

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  • bambinoitaliano

    Fake doctors like Ben Carson will sprung up providing women with gay embryo certificates to get an abortion.

  • Leo

    Ngun, who is gay, agrees that this research is in its infancy, and says he has no intention of making a commercial test to predict sexuality. Still, he’s worried about the potentially ominous implications of his work — so much so, in fact, that he has decided to leave the field. He left academia last week, and plans to do research in industry that has nothing to do with the biology of sexual orientation.

    “It kind of, honestly, became a little bit troubling to me, what I was actually doing,” Ngun told BuzzFeed News. “Having done this now, I could sort of foresee a not-so-happy outcome.”

    http://www.buzzfeed.com/virginiahughes/genetic-on-off-switches-can-predict-homosexuality-controvers

  • Aurvara

    I can’t remember who wrote it, but there was a science fiction story about this scenario. Nearly all the gays left in the world were Catholics because of the anti-abortion stance of the Church.

  • ryan charisma

    so is this proof that, as Lady GaGa says, “I was born this way”?

  • Xuuths

    The problem with this, and any, study: people lying about their sexual orientation. Pretty much only the people claiming to be gay can be trusted to not be lying. “Straight” claimers frequently are gay. “Bisexual” claimers frequently are gay. “Asexual/celibate” claimers frequently are gay. Don’t know of anyone who has claimed to be gay but actually been straight (I believe we’re all mostly on the bisexual scale between totally gay/straight).

    Until we get that whole thing straightened out, research will be skewed.

  • davewolfusa

    The first thought that came to mind was that now we have a 70% way of flushing out conservative closet queens.

  • ElJiffy

    Then there’s the 30% or so that always fuck up their algorithms.

  • JCF

    Off-topic (but vaguely related, because it’s about human genes n’ stuff):

    As the child of a parent who died of ALS/Lou Gehrig’s Disease (RIP Mom: 8 years ago last week), I am, of course, VERY interested in a genetic (heritable) component of this fatal disease. Just this week, I read about new discoveries…and how it’s related to HIV:

    “An endogenous human retrovirus called HERV-K is expressed at higher
    levels in the brains of amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS) patients
    than in those of controls, and the virus is toxic to human neurons in
    culture”

    http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/44130/title/Endogenous-Retrovirus-Active-in-ALS/

    “Our chromosomes hold a partial record of prehistoric viral
    infections: About 8% of our genomes come from DNA that viruses
    incorporated into the cells of our ancestors. Over many millennia, these
    viral genes have accumulated mutations rendering them mostly dormant.

    But one of these viruses can reawaken in some patients with
    amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS), a progressive muscle wasting
    disease commonly known as Lou Gehrig’s disease. A new study demonstrates
    that this so-called endogenous retrovirus can damage neurons, possibly
    contributing to the neurodegeneration seen in the disease.

    The findings raise the possibility that antiretroviral drugs, similar
    to those used to treat HIV, could slow the progression of ALS in some
    patients.”

    http://cen.acs.org/articles/93/i39/Dormant-Virus-Wake-Patients-Lou.html

    I find it would be a blessed coincidence, if the medicines discovered (and will be discovered!) to fight/cure HIV, would also save the life (even, God forbid I need them, mine?) of those w/ ALS. LET’S CURE BOTH!!!

  • hilstad

    70% success rate is deployable in a diagnostic test. You’re not even above the rate of randomly guessing.

  • DonnaLee

    Using genetic research in this way has some validity, but do these gene sequences show up the same way for anyone homosexual?. Also so many of us know ‘straight’ men and women who are not, doesn’t that invalidate the testing in the first place? Where does bisexuality come into the equation? There is no way this measures ‘degrees of gayness.’

    Who are these people getting funding for such testing, when there are major diseases to be cured?!

  • ExGayTherapyKills

    70% is not 100% don’t get too excited.