Liberty Counsel President Mat Staver To Kentucky Gov. Steve Beshear: Allow Anti-Gay Discrimination Or Resign

“Gov. Steve Beshear went far beyond the Supreme Court when he made it Kentucky policy to foreclose any possibility of a religious accommodation for county clerks. Beshear made new law, and disregarded the laws he swore to uphold; he is the official who should do his job or resign. [Kim] Davis is merely asking that her religious convictions be accommodated. This case has never been about whether a person can get a marriage license. It is solely about whether a particular person can be forced against her sincere religious beliefs to issue the license. Surely, the Herald-Leader would not force a Jewish chef to prepare a pork dish when someone else can prepare the meal. Even prisoners are entitled to have their religious beliefs accommodated. Shouldn’t Davis have the same right? Finally, when the Herald-Leader ran out of misinformed arguments, it began to criticize Liberty Counsel, which represents Davis. The editorial board should ask the ACLU — whose affiliate represents the plaintiffs — how it spent $133 million last year. Contrary to what the editorial reported in its initial version, Liberty Counsel has far more staff than five. Before you place something in print, get your facts correct. Liberty Counsel is not ashamed of defending Davis. Would the Herald-Leader criticize attorneys for representing someone on death row?” – Hate group leader Mat Staver, in an editorial published today by the newspaper he is attacking.

  • Michael Rush

    Supreme Court decisions don’t apply to Mat Staver’s little universe .

  • BlueberriesForMe

    To: Mat S. (with only one “T”):

    “You can go to Halifax!”

    • Henri205

      “Or H E Double Hockey Sticks”

  • pickypecker
    • 2karmanot

      “Oh for Christ’s sake girl, go polish your tiara and leave me the F’k alone.”

    • another_steve

      I am so verklempt that “Downton Abbey” is coming to an end.

      How ever shall I and the man spend our Sunday nights?

      • pickypecker

        If you haven’t….look into watching Poldark. Beautifully done as is lead Aidan Turner.

        http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2015/03/23/18/26D7DEDA00000578-3008106-image-a-6_1427136158129.jpg

        • another_steve

          We’re obviously on the same wavelength, pp. A search of my comment history will reveal a rather unhealthy obsession on my part with Aidan Turner.

          He just might be (might be) the most beautiful man who ever walked the surface of the planet.

          • StraightGrandmother

            On Joe’s main page, right under this article is a commercial for Folsum Street Fair, I looked at that pic & I def won’t even be opening the article at all, LOLZ!

          • RoFaWh

            SGm, fear not. The A#1 thing wrong with the Folsom Street Fair is that there are too many youngish men in attendance who have overdeveloped pectoral muscles and are fond of showing them off. Everything else about the event pales in comparison.

            Now, Dore Alley, that’s another story.

        • another_steve

          Okay. Pickypecker got me started…

          Please answer “yes” or “no,” by reply to this comment, to the following question:

          Is this possibly the most beautiful man currently on the face of the planet?

          http://www.viralread.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/the-hobbit-kili-poster.jpg

          • pickypecker

            and talented too. Back away slowly…he’s mine.

          • vorpal

            LOL I have nothing but massive heaps of respect for you, another_steve, but since you asked for both yes and no answers, I will proclaim that while I can appreciate that he is traditionally handsome, he is in no way my type.

            (Then again, traditionally handsome guys are generally not my type at all! I like more cute, adorable, dorky guys!)

          • madknits

            What I like to call “adorkable”, and also I’m not such a fan of the six pack. I like a guy with a bit of a belly.

          • vorpal

            Absolutely! Works perfectly for me :-).
            No big old muscles for me, thanks!
            If I wanted to sleep with something all lumpy and uncomfortable, I’d go find the mattress I had during my early college years.

            Give me just a guy-next-door or a nerdy guy any day and I am happy as can be!

          • Galvestonian

            I’m a chub.

          • madknits

            Woof!

          • Galvestonian

            Thanks, I needed that !

          • another_steve

            I appreciate your candor, vorpal.

            [what I am really thinking… “Good. One less bitch with whom I have to compete for Turner’s attention….”]

          • vorpal

            Haha! I wish you nothing but success and leaked online videos.

          • melindadford

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          • Galvestonian

            Don’t wrap it, I’ll eat it here.

          • Ragnar Lothbrok

            What are you saying ? Have we like, even met ??

          • vorpal

            Not yet, but I am determined to one day lure you down here with the promise of a plethora of treats, perpetually sunny skies, and permanently comfortable weather.

          • Ragnar Lothbrok

            All ya have to do is tie a twinkie on a string and I will follow it anywhere.

          • Ragnar Lothbrok

            I’d have to cut his hair first then get back to you.

            What ?? It will grow back !

          • JT

            I’d like to see his scythe and how he uses it.

        • brb melting into desk chair

        • Jan Wesselius

          He has a six pack, I want a keg.

        • Gene

          a wonderfully acted, entertaining show….worth watching.
          but even if you hate it, hell, its worth it just for THIS shot.
          amazing, how many times they find a way for him to be shirtless in late 1700s Cornwall, where such was not normally the case….Amazing, and WONDERFUL

          • another_steve

            If you search for him on YouTube, you’ll find a ton of media interviews with him. Not only is he incredibly gorgeous, but he’s witty and articulate and totally charming.

            So I ask you and all my other queer brothers reading here:

            How fuckin’ good is the universe, to create something like that?

        • RaygunsGoZap

          I got a dark place for your pole, Aidan!

    • MattM

      Right? Get a real job, Matty.

    • MDB

      If that ole boy yaks on much, more he’ll get his tongue sunburned.
      – thanks to Foghorn Leghorn

  • Michael Smith

    “Surely, the Herald-Leader would not force a Jewish chef to prepare a pork dish when someone else can prepare the meal.”

    Apparently they don’t teach you what a false equivalency is at the University of Kentucky.

    • Treg Brown

      Or maybe that’s all they teach?:)

    • thevofl

      The Fallacy Ref has thrown a flag.

    • bkmn

      Most Jewish chefs I have known have little problem preparing or eating pork, since it is delish.

      • Gigi

        They’ve expanded on the “You wouldn’t force a kosher deli to make a ham sandwich” because the natural response was “Kosher delis don’t carry pork products. They can’t make you what they don’t stock.” Now it’s a Jewish chef. As you stated most chefs, Jewish or non-Jewish, prepare all forms of pork.

        • Reality.Bites

          On various editions of MasterChef they have had Muslim participants who won’t consume pork or alcohol and vegetarian ones who won’t consume meat. They all understood that they would, nevertheless, have to COOK with these products when they were part of a competition.

          I’ve seen a lot of Muslim women working at McDonald’s or Burger King as cashiers. When you order a bacon Whopper they don’t scream in terror, run away and send someone else to take the order. They enter it, you pay for it and then they give it to you.

          • Gigi

            So what you’re saying is that they do their jobs. Imagine that.

          • Reality.Bites

            Yes – it’s especially amazing considering they work at McDonald’s and Burger King. 😉

            I use Muslim women as an example because they often dress in a manner that identifies them. I’m sure Muslim men have handed me their hot meat too. (In fact I KNOW some have, but not at a restaurant)

          • This exactly this….having a personal objection to something doesn’t mean that you can’t give that thing to others. We can list out so many examples where this is true and yet supposedly when it comes to a marriage license for a
            Gay couple it becomes a huge issue? It’s only an issue because the anti-gays are determined to hold onto anything to say that same sex marriages are not valid or are still controversial. It is such a fake and lame controversy, its
            pathetic really.

        • CB

          Many Jews I know cook and eat pork and pork products. They call themselves Jewish by tradition. They don’t buy into the myths of the OT and realize that modern food processing eliminates the need to avoid pork. “thus saith the lord” was a good way to get superstitious people to do things that were good for them. At least that’s what we always learned in Episcopalian Sunday school…

      • Rex

        Now I want a pork chop, damn.

        • RaygunsGoZap

          Really? Pork chop was your only take away?

          Pork chop in one hand. Big fat Muslim cock in the other. Slurp slurp! Nom nom nom!

          • Rex

            Damn, now I want cock.

    • Jeff

      He didn’t mention if the “Jewish chef” in his example is being paid to prepare the meal.

    • MDB

      Did someone mention Bacon ???

      • wmforr

        Steam at six degrees. Serve hot.

  • barracks9

    Bless his heart, Mat thinks he’s somebody. You sad little man, your presumptuous announcements mean nothing. Hell, you aren’t even full of sound and fury, just a sad little man of no importance.

  • Treg Brown

    “[Kim] Davis is merely asking that her religious convictions be accommodated.”

    My religious beliefs are that Davis and all her husbands should be stoned as adulterers.

    Probably a good thing (for her) that we don’t base the laws of the US on the bibble.

    Also too, bring back the dog you fucking thief.

    • rusty57

      There was a dog in the mix? I’m guessing between husbands and after a few Boone’s Farm wine coolers Lil’ Kimmy got her down home, southern-fried, can’t find any kinfolk, bestiality groove on?

      PAHRAZE JAYZUS!

  • Sam_Handwich

    oh fuck off, you dumb weenie

    • bkmn

      I’ve always thought Mat to be more of a twat-weasel.

  • ScottJL

    Correct me if I’m wrong, but didn’t someone else in the office say they would sign the forms and she forbid them to? There goes his pork-dish comparison.

    • Brian G

      Yes! Exactly!

    • Bj Lincoln

      There are 5 other people involved in this because of her. One of them was willing to do her job but she said no. This is not all about her. It is about her and 5 other people who for some reason are required to listen to her. She is welding her power over others to break the law. She gives out licenses to everyone regardless of their ‘sin’ but targets only us. It is so much BS.

      • NowAnAgnostic

        You might also add that 1 of those 5 is her son. No nepotism involved, of course. Just like when she worked for her mother.

        • People4Humanity

          Riiiiight.

    • olandp

      If a Jewish chef took a job in a restaurant that served pork, then yes, he should be forced to cook it. If you won’t do the job, for any reason, you should not have accepted it, and quit.

      • ScottJL

        I agree, but that wasn’t my point.

  • Jeffrey

    Why does Mat always look like he just shat himself?

    • barracks9

      Your question is redundant, yes?

      • Jeffrey

        Well its rhetorical, if nothing else.

    • RaygunsGoZap

      You’ve answered your own question, dear.

    • bambinoitaliano

      More like constipation. Something been stuck there forever or he just wouldn’t let it go.

    • Rex

      It’s that stick shoved so far up his ass that the back of his eyeballs have splinters.

  • MDB

    Because Mat is such a successful leegle skollar ?

    • TampaDink

      Law skools is home skools.

  • Piercedchrlz

    “This case has never been about whether a person can get a marriage license. It is solely about whether a particular person can be forced against her sincere religious beliefs to issue the license.”
    Or get three divorces or bear false witness to protect a daughters crimes, but…er,…uh wait…I’m confused……

  • PLAINTOM

    Exactly what religious convictions does this adulterous whore claim to have ?

    • canoebum

      She hates fags. God told her it was ok.

  • Can you imagine the head of a gay rights group making such a threat? Of course everyone would just laugh if they did. They ought to be laughing at this as well but except for a few Democrats in super-liberal and very safe districts, our entire political system is scared shitless of the religious right. Meanwhile HRC continued to endorse candidates who voted from DOMA.

  • DonnaLee

    Other way around Mat Staver. The clerks are free to resign. Several did and took early retirement so they wouldn’t have to comply. The governor is following the law.

    • RoFaWh

      The Kim blob has her eye on her pension. With an annual salary of $80K, if she hangs in there long enough, she’ll get a very nice monthly payment.

      • NowAnAgnostic

        She already has 26 years in with the county–working for her mother. Depending on county retirement benefit formulas, her pension, indeed, should be nice.

      • DonnaLee

        Not if she’s fired for not doing her job. I think she’s looking for hate money.

  • Rex

    His comparisons are rubbish. A chef that has sincerely held religous beliefs can allow someone else to prepare a dish that he wishes not to, sure. A clerk in a county office is paid to issue marriage licenses that is lawfully allowed and if it’s against her beliefs then she should resign. Let her try to refuse to issue a license to a black couple, or a jewish couple and see where that gets her. She has no problem issuing licenses to liars, or theives, or adulters, or divorced individuals, so her religious beliefs are limited to only gay sinners. She should at least be consistant with what her religious beliefs are in regard to sin. Keep kicking and screaming and digging your heels in, you’re still wrong.

    • RaygunsGoZap

      And she admitted as much under oath! Judge: Would you have an objection to issuing a license to a couple where one is divorced? Davis: That’s between them and God.

  • Secure

    Joe’s post a few months from now:

    “Mat Staver has the Kim Davis Sadz.”

    Looking forward to it!

    • TampaDink

      I hope that your prediction is off by many weeks.

    • Marides48

      He’s had many “Sadz” moments recently, so he’ll manage OK.

  • Apparently, Mr. Staver doesn’t understand that Davis’ salary is funded by taxpayers who have convictions of their own. Today he gets one more notch on his Make Myself Look Stupid bedpost.

    • pickypecker
      • RaygunsGoZap

        That’s actually Kim’s childhood bed. Daddy made every damn one of them marks hisself, ya’ll!

        • prjoe

          That was a low blow and unbelievably nasty and perverted. I like it. I like it.

        • John Calendo

          He was a fine man…drunk or sober.

          • RaygunsGoZap

            Shucks! You sound like all his daughters. And their daughters. And their daughters’ daughters. Also that one goat wit da busted up leg.

      • Rex

        OMG, Josh Duggar has the same bed!

        • brian

          The notches that Josh made with his FINGERnails.

    • bambinoitaliano

      He just conveniently ignore it.

  • Paula

    Mat, why don’t you come down to my house and discriminate against me. I double dog fucking dare you!

  • Lumpy Gaga

    Even prisoners are entitled to have their religious beliefs accommodated.

    Emphasis mine.

  • Michael Rush

    Hey loyal bible follower / four times married / hypocrite asshole Kim Davis …

    1 Corinthians 7:39 A wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives

    Matthew 5:32 … anyone who marries a divorced woman commits adultery.

    Malachi 2:13-16 … God hates a deceitful, treacherous divorce. He will personally hold accountable those who frivolously leave their mate, especially when they do so with the motive of taking another partner

    Corinthians 7:10 to the married I give instructions, not I, but the Lord, that the wife should not leave her husband

    Corinthians 7:11 but if she does leave, she must remain unmarried

    Leviticus 18:19 … Do not approach a woman to have sexual relations during the uncleanness of her monthly period.

    ( we might have to take her word on that one )

  • bkmn

    How does issuing a license for a civil marriage impact this woman one bit? It doesn’t unless you are Liberty Counsel.

    • John30013

      Her (totally bogus) contention that since her name is printed on the marriage license form (as the county clerk), it implies her personal approval of the marriage itself. This is why she also forbids any of her staff from issuing the licenses.

  • Cuberly

    “Surely, the Herald-Leaderwould not force a Jewish chef to prepare a pork dish when someone else can prepare the meal.”

    So TOTALLY the same thing.

    http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view4/4490587/picard-double-facepalm-o.gif

  • bambinoitaliano

    That’s freedom of religion for you. The freedom to expect an elected official to yield to the self appointed non elected bull shitter on a wimp.

  • Henri205

    Um, Mat??

  • Gigi

    Oh for fuck sakes, Jewish chefs don’t take an oath to uphold the law so your comparison is bollocks! And most chefs cook whatever they’re asked to cook. Kosher deli owners wouldn’t make you a ham sandwich but that’s because they don’t carry pork products so they can’t serve you what they don’t have.

    • Clive Johnson

      Way too much logic for a mind like Staver’s to handle.

    • RaygunsGoZap

      I demand my Unicorn burger now, you filthy bigots! WHAT? They aren’t real? I’ll have the kugula.

  • prjoe

    His analogy to the Jewish chef and pork is totally out of whack. Religious Jews don’t prepare pork for ANYONE. It’s like suing Home Depot for refusing to sell you a cake. They don’t sell cakes to anyone. What’s so hard to understand about that?

  • joe ho

    A comment from the Herald-Leader site:

    “The applicability of the Free Speech Clause of the 1st amendment to a government agent doing their job was pretty clearly decided in Garcetti v. Ceballos (SCOTUS decision: “When public employees make statements pursuant to their official duties, they are not speaking as citizens for First Amendment purposes, and the Constitution does not insulate their communications from employer discipline”). The status of government employee “free exercise of religion” in their official duties hasn’t been so clearly decided in legal decisions, although for most rational people the same principle applies. Hopefully Mr. Staver will push this case as far as he can, and we’ll have some definitive black-and-white precedent saying that the free exercise clause of the First Amendment does not apply to government employees doing their job. So push on Mr. Staver!”

    • skrekk

      I think there’s actually a lot of precedent which directly and indirectly addresses the issue, from Torcaso v Watkins to Reynolds v US (concerning a citizen who claimed his religious views provided an exemption from the law). From the latter:

      “To permit this would be to make the professed doctrines of religious belief superior to the law of the land, and, in effect, to permit every citizen to become a law unto himself. Government could exist only in name under such circumstances.”

      It would be a strange and unlikely outcome for the court to allow constitutional rights to vary from county to county based on the whims of a lowly clerk.

    • canoebum

      Yeah, it’s a free country. She can look for another job anytime she wants. No one is holding her back.

  • John Calendo

    ISN’T SHE LOVELY…Evan Gorman of LEX 18 News posted this photo and comment on the station’s facebook page:

    “Evan Gorman here. I snapped this picture earlier as Rowan County Clerk, Kim Davis, smiled with her plaque which says, “In recognition for your valiant and courageous stand for religious freedom.” It was presented to her at today’s First Amendment Religious Freedom Rally outside of the Capitol. Plaques were also given to clerks Kay Schwartz of Whitley and Casey Davis of Casey County.

    • John Calendo

      Note the psycho-fundie skirt length.

      • 2guysnamedjoe

        So she does own another outfit.

        • Leo Tallant

          I am not sure that what she is wearing in that picture can be considered to be an “outfit” 😉

          • 2guysnamedjoe

            Miss Mrs. Ms. Davis, in a fetching distressed denim ensemble, addressed the creme of Kentucky’s bigotterati . . .

          • People4Humanity

            I prefer my Bugatti.

      • OMG!!! You can see the adulterous vixen’s ankles and wrists. Stone her!!!

        • trouble94114

          and please notice how closely that abomination clings to her lower body

      • trouble94114

        Unfortunately those shoes are remarkably unattractive. And frankly, that unfortunate skirt would not have gotten a passing grade in 7th grade home economics.

    • pickypecker
    • TJay229

      Laura Ingles wants her skirt back.

    • delk

      Cover those cankles, whore!

    • delk

      Why is Karl Rove doing denim drag?

    • ultragreen

      Isn’t she supposed to wear a scarf over her head while roaming about outdoors in public, like other modest religious women?

    • BudClark

      Doesn’t she own an iron and an ironing board?

      • david fairfield

        For her hair, right?

  • D. J.

    I think the Supreme Court and the Governor outranks an outside lawyer, two renegade clerks and a few of their underlings…..

  • Bill T.

    Gosh! They hate us. They really really hate us.

    • Mark

      Yes they do.

  • MikeBx2

    A Jewish chef who is determined to strictly follow the Jewish religion would have to get it confirmed upfront before being hired that they would be allowed to pass on pork dishes and put that off on someone else to prepare, right? I mean, why would a religious Jewish chef be hired or even want to work at a pork serving restaurant?

    • Reality.Bites

      It’s the best way to ensure your chef won’t steal the food!

    • D. J.

      The chef isn’t being ordered to EAT the pork, either. Davis ordered that nobody in her office could issue the licenses, even though there was one person willing to do it.

  • EdmondWherever

    Who knew that preparing pork dishes for citizens was an official state function?

  • Phil

    Pick up your brains and put them back in your head. Have you lost your mind!!???

  • Tor

    Kim Davis is merely asking that her religious convictions as an elected official, a member of government, be forced upon her constituents, in violation of the First Amendment anti-establishment clause.

    • TerryInIowa

      BINGO! We have a BINGO!

  • oikos

    Poor Mat, can’t win a case and now thinks a Governor who is running out his term will resign because the lieburty cownsel says so.

  • Go. The. Fuck. Away.

  • ultragreen

    Jewish chefs who refuse to cook pork dishes don’t work at restaurants where pork dishes are served. They find jobs at restaurants where pork isn’t served. Duh.

    Similarly, Kim Davis doesn’t have to work at a job that involves issuing marriage licenses to gay or lesbian couples. She can always find another job.

    • Reality.Bites

      And actually if they work at ANY restaurant that isn’t Kosher, regardless of whether or not they serve pork, then their objection to pork is not religious in nature but cultural. Remember folks – no shellfish, no bottom feeders, no meat that isn’t kosher and no meat with dairy. Pork is just the beginning. The delicious juicy beginning.

  • Just posted my own comment on their comments section. Pleasantly surprised to not find a single comment in favor of Staver’s article except for one comment that rather tepidly said that Davis shouldn’t be forced to resign before having her day in court.

  • TJay229

    Ok… I’m not going to attack the Jew chef argument, it’s stupid on its face… Just tell me when does her stay end?

  • Rebecca Gardner

    The Jewish Chef example. This is all I got…

  • rednekokie

    No one has ever questioned the religious convictions of this person be not accommodated. What the issue is happens to be whether her religious convictions apply to the office she holds. If there are others in that office who can issue the licenses, then they should do it and she should not prevent them from doing so.
    She acts as though that office is her personal fiefdom. It is not. If she is the only one in the office, and there are no others, then she needs to hire people who can do the work, or get out of the way so that some someone else, not quite so loony, can do it.

  • Jan Wesselius

    I ask that my religious accommodation of human sacrifice on the altar of Komar be accommodated. NO? then how about child slavery? No? How about wife beatings? no? you see I can have all sorts of “religious accommodations” but that doesn’t mean they have to be up held.

  • vorpal

    Haha receiving a threat from Mat Staver / Libery Counsel is like receiving a threat from a five year old that Santa won’t bwing you any pwesents this Chwistmas.

    • MDB

      No PWESENTS ???? Aaarghhhh ?!?!?!?!?!? WaAAAHHHHHHH !!!

      • vorpal

        Don’t worry. I’ll slip you a (not-so-)little something.
        Edited so as to not insult myself further than I already have :D.

        • Reality.Bites

          The Duggar thread is over there ——->

          • vorpal

            Oh, come now: every thread is Duggar thread.

        • MDB

          Oh goodie, I can’t wait !!!
          (I’ll even let you play with the wrapping paper afterwards !)

  • no one is holding this woman captive in her office, forcing her to continue to draw a paycheck from this taxpayer funded job.

  • canoebum

    “This case has never been about whether a person can get a marriage license.”

    That, is a bald-faced lie, since the people who applying are being denied the licenses they seek, and are entitled by law to receive.

  • Still no word from Liberty counsel about any potential legal, challenge to the new ban on ex-gay therapy, I guess this Kentucky case has become their new baby that gets all of their attention.

    As to their argument here you can’t “accommodate” someone religious belief if that belief prevents them from doing their job. Again this would be like someone taking a Job as a bar tender and then demanding that the bar accommodate their religious objection to serving alcohol.

  • justmeeeee

    I know I am and so are you!

  • StraightGrandmother

    Oh I am so glad it will not be that much longer until this is all over and Kim Davis resigns.
    She’ll have to resign, right?
    When the Appeals Court rules against her and the Supreme Court refuses cert she’s gonna have to resign since she said she simply can’t do this.

    • RoFaWh

      I wouldn’t be so sure, SGm. She impresses me as someone utterly convinced of the righteousness of her position, to the point that she may have to be carted off by a state trooper under each arm.

      • Ninja0980

        I agree with you.
        Other clerks gave up the game when they told they would go to jail, she hasn’t done so yet.

        • SFBruce

          I think she’s a true believer as well. With Liberty’s other clients, I’ve often wondered who much they might have been pushed to pursue claims sure to loose, but I don’t think they had to work hard to get Davis on their side.

      • wmforr

        Unless Faux News gives her a show of her own with double the salary. “Refusing to Do Your Job for Jesus”

    • david fairfield

      Meanwhile, can the couples who filed suit take their case to the next level? Or are they obligated to wait until the piece of trash has her appeal heard? Were it me, I would start adding people to the list and file more suits. Her whole purpose is to give the gays a big FU, and that’s exactly what she’s doing. But the ones who want nothing more than to get married are forced to wait, and the law is on their side!

  • delk

    Number 1 FUCK
    Number 2 YOU

  • Tammy Rainey

    when the Baker is a representative of the government, we’ll get back to that analogy.

  • skrekk

    I wonder if Mat Staver let his client know that he’s lost every case related to marriage equality to date, or that he faces significant liability for his involvement in a criminal conspiracy involving an international child abduction? Does Kentucky have a disclosure law which applies to attorneys?

    • RoFaWh

      Has Staver been admitted to the bar in Kentucky?

      • skrekk

        I think Staver isn’t actually the attorney of record – Horatio G. Mihet of Liberty Counsel is, along with Roger K. Gannam and Jonathan D. Christman. It’s in federal court so Mihet would need to be a member of the bar in the 6th circuit. I don’t know if that means he has to be admitted to the Kentucky bar too in order to represent this case, but they have a local attorney assisting, A.C. Donahue of the Donahue Law Group.

      • Paula

        No, but, I’m sure that he has been to lots of bars in Kentucky.

  • Exatron

    The difference, bigot council leader, is that a Jewish restaurant won’t serve pork to anyone, not just the people it doesn’t approve of. This county clerk is likewise expected to issue marriage licenses to everyone who is legally eligible because that service is offered by the government.

  • Eebadee-eebadee-thatsallfolks

    Mat,

  • ultragreen

    An employer has the right to fire someone for not doing their job, whether or not it is related to their religious beliefs. Accommodation to one’s religious beliefs has to be reasonable in the sense that they do not unduly impair one’s ability to do one’s job. For example, in a recent U.S. Supreme Court ruling, allowing an Islamic woman to wear a head scarf as an employee of a clothing store was considered a reasonable accommodation to her religious beliefs because it did not substantially impair her ability to perform her job — namely, to sell clothing to customers.

    However, if an employee refuses to do an important aspect of his or her job because of his or her religious beliefs, the employer can fire this employee. In this case, the religious beliefs of this employee substantially impaired his or her ability to perform the job. Kim Davis falls into this latter category because 1) she refuses to perform an important aspect of her job (issuing marriage licenses), and 2) she also refuses to allow any workers below her to perform their jobs by issuing marriage licenses. Because she is expecting an unreasonable accommodation to her religious beliefs, she should resign, be fired, or be found in contempt of court.

    In the real world, people with restrictive religious beliefs often don’t apply for certain kinds of jobs. A pacifist Quaker isn’t going to sign up with the armed forces, a Catholic nun isn’t going to become a stripper at a nightclub, and an Amish man isn’t going to apply for a job as a taxi driver, truck driver, or airplane pilot. The reason these people don’t apply for these kinds of jobs is because they involve actions that are contrary to their religious beliefs. Kim Davis is no different than these people, and there is no good reason why she should be treated any differently from them.

    • skrekk

      The problem is that Davis holds an elected position and can’t directly be fired. She can be impeached by the legislature (unlikely in a bigoted red state), recalled by the voters (unlikely in a bigoted red state), or jailed by US Marshalls for violating a federal court order (increasingly likely).

  • anne marie in philly

    hey matty, the gov serves ALL the state, not just the h8ers! the gov stays, your client MUST do her job or resign!

  • Mark

    Fuck. You.

  • Reality.Bites

    BTW, where are all these Kosher delis they’re so fond of talking about?

    There aren’t that many real Jewish delis left, and most of them were never kosher to start with.

  • david fairfield

    Judge Bunning was pretty thorough when he smacked her down, and was careful not to leave any loopholes, as has happened throughout this process (eg this ruling only applies to the plaintiffs not everybody blah blah). The most brilliant part of his order was giving her argument that “they” can just go elsewhere, to another county to obtain their license and it creates no hardship on “them”….he simply stated that while they could go to another county, why should they be required to? But then he issued the stay, which was disappointing, but I understand why he did it, and gave her until the 31st for appeal, which I think is way too generous. Because in the meantime, these guys right to marry in the town that they live, work and pay taxes (including “her” salary) continues to be denied. This is where I take issue, and I really don’t understand how it is that the state of Kentucky, after having been ordered to follow the law, is allowing this two bit piece of bigoted trash to SHUT DOWN an entire county for the purposes of any couple wanting to get married. I have a whole lot more to say on the matter, but for now, for this particular thread, I will step down from my soapbox….

    • skrekk

      I can see a good strategic argument for the temporary stay apart from a due process argument. If Bunning calls the US Marshals to have Davis jailed for violating the order, that means she’s technically absent from her office and the county’s Judge Executive assumes her duties….and he’s said he’ll issue licenses to any qualified couple without regard to their gender or sexual orientation. If that happens then the case is moot so it’s far better to stay the order temporarily and let the courts fully play it out.

      • Bj Lincoln

        I hope someone records her getting arrested! I can’t wait!

        • david fairfield

          I don’t like to feed on anyone’s misfortune. Unless it’s a hateful bigoted hypocrite waste of human flesh like Kim Davis. So, if they do arrest her (which would seem logical since she has dug her K-Mart heels in this far), then I will relish it, and I will toast to you Bj…..

        • Johnny Wyeknot

          That, unfortunately, is exactly what she is angling for. The iconic photo of a christian christian being handcuffed and hauled off to jail. Would be fund- raising gold.

  • RaygunsGoZap

    Ok, Mat. You guys have more than 5 employees. You’re still evil. Evil and incompetent whether it’s 5 or 6 or 7.

  • John Kusters

    “It is solely about whether a particular person can be forced against her sincere religious beliefs to issue the license.” If that were actually the case, she would have been fine letting someone else in the office (I hear there was a willing clerk) accept the paperwork for the license. Since she ordered her entire office to halt accepting any marriage license applications, Staver is clearly lying. Again.

  • Marides48

    I’m a retired USPS Letter Carrier & if I had refused to deliver mail because of my religious convictions, I would be fired & not retired. Civil servants serve ALL customers or they serve none.

    • wmforr

      But, but… weren’t you worried that God would send you to The Bad Place for delivering a copy of Penthouse?

      • Marides48

        Perhaps for delivering Playgirl but not Penthouse. He had plenty of opportunities to strike me down with a bolt of lightning.

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    Oh please, Mat Staver is a flea, swat him and be done with it.

  • Mark_in_MN

    Staver’s “logic” is so leaky, it would hardly even make a good sieve.

  • Galvestonian

    Now, just wait a minute. The only place religion has a proper place when connected to work is in a church. Since when has a county clerks office been classified or designated a church ???? The Bible clearly states “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s and to God the things that are God’s”…” which is is most commonly explained as an exhortation to keep the affairs of religion and politics separate. Is this woman religious or just a bunko-flim-flam artiste ???

  • Ninja0980

    We know how some of that money is spent Mat.
    When it isn’t being used to help your you and your wife fly around the country, it’s being used abroard to help push laws that call for LGBT people to be jailed or killed.
    You are evil, vile scum, simple as that.

  • MrRobotoLA

    I’m guessing that the ACLU spent their $133 million fighting for the civil liberties of Americans.

  • SFBruce

    Staver is simply wrong when he claims Beshear created new law. According to the Kentucky state Duties of Elected County Officials, “The county clerk issues marriage licenses (KRS 402.080) and files and records all marriage
    certificates (KRS 402.220 and 402.230).” And ” Each county clerk must furnish each applicant for a marriage license with a copy of a marriage manual to be prepared and printed by the Human Resources. Coordinating Commission of Kentucky (KRS 402.270).”
    http://www.lrc.ky.gov/lrcpubs/ib114.pdf

    There’s no “may,” in the text, instead a straightforward “The county clerk issues marriage licenses.”

    The editorial that has Staver so upset, is a great read, better even than Bunning’s decision. I highly recommend it.
    http://www.kentucky.com/2015/08/13/3987637_time-for-davis-to-do-her-job-or.html?rh=1

  • Johnny Wyeknot

    Matt, gig’s up. Anyone is on to you.

  • Dear Mat, learn to spell your own name or step in front of a bus.

  • Gianni

    This jerk is all wet and he knows they’re going to lose the case. It’s all about the publicity and getting all the bucks they can. His organization’s legal track record fighting for gay inequality to be kept legal is dismal at best. I do like GuestStop’s bus suggestion.

  • juanjo54

    Mat Staver is a complete scum bag who scams fundamentalist Christians out of money which he uses to pay himself and his wife close to a half million dollars in salary not mention more in expenses for their “work” as lawyers. He virtually never wins a case but that just goes into his fundraising efforts explaining how they are struggling against anti-Christian prejudice.