MAINE: State Supreme Court Rules That NOM Must Reveal Their Donors

Via the Portland Press Herald:

The National Organization for Marriage has lost another round in its attempt to hide the identities of donors to a successful 2009 referendum campaign to reverse Maine’s marriage equality law. The Maine Supreme Judicial Court on Tuesday denied NOM’s motion to block a ruling by the state’s ethics and elections commission that the organization must register as a ballot question committee and begin disclosing its donors. Last year the Maine Commission on Governmental Ethics and Election Practices imposed a $50,250 fine on NOM, the nation’s leading organization opposing gay marriage, a ruling that could affect the way nonprofit organizations attempt to influence Maine elections. The ruling followed an investigation in which the staff of the ethics commission found that NOM failed to comply with state law by concealing its operations and donors during the drive to overturn Maine’s same-sex marriage law in 2009. The ethics vote meant that the state will require the organization to register as a ballot question committee and disclose its donors from the campaign.

The director of the ethics commission says that NOM has both paid its fine and registered as a ballot question committee “under protest.”

More from the Bangor Daily News:

The National Organization for Marriage has argued that the Maine Ethics Commission misapplied the law that its donors from across the United States were supporting the organization’s general principles and not specifically the referendum in Maine. The organization also has argued that disclosing its donors would seriously hinder its ability to raise funds in the future. In May 2014, Maine Ethics Commission Chairman Walter McKee said that the National Organization for Marriage has made a “mockery” of Maine’s campaign finance disclosure laws. It was unclear whether the National Organization for Marriage has any additional legal options to avoid disclosure of the list.

  • oikos

    Ooh that fine is going to cut into Briana’s vacation and ice cream budget.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Ice Cream expenditures stay untouched, per NOM charter.

    • Schlukitz

      That’s a headline I cannot wait to see.

    • Bill T.

      Sweet.

  • AtticusP

    NOM NOM NOM NOM NOM!!!!!

  • Gustav2

    Well, we already know the Columbus OH diocese gave $1500.00 and got hell for it from area parishioners.

    • PLAINTOM

      I wonder how many parishes in NY donated money. You know, the parishes the church just closed due to lack of funds .

      • Chucktech

        Think of all the fabulous loft condos that can be transformed from the gutting of all those dead churches!

      • oikos

        Sweet delicious karma

      • David

        The parishes were all disclosed. They donated not through NOM, but through the Diocese of Portland’s PAC. There were modest donations from around the country. I don’t recall any from NY. I remember Santa Fe, New Mexico was a donor. I’m sure that Minneapolis/St Paul must have sent in something. But overall, there wasn’t that much support from the other diocese. The Diocese of Portland shouldered the burden itself for the most part.

    • matt n

      most gave very little. the bishops who gave from their diocesan coffers did so to stay in the good graces of benedict’s vatican–they wanted to make sure their names appeared in the hate column. the amount didn’t matter. they could get off cheap as long as their names appeared with a check next to them. that way, burke would have one less thing to hold them if they were in the running for a promotion to a more important dioceses. it’s very political, most are ladder-climing creeps who do what’s necessary to rise. under benedict and with burke making the suggestions for US appointments, things like this were a litmus test

  • Pollos Hermanos
    • Happy Dance

      Awesome!

    • bkmn

      I would not advise holding your breath in anticipation.

    • Emma Duncan

      very Python!

  • Princess Lardass

    “The organization also has argued that disclosing its donors would seriously hinder its ability to raise funds in the future.”

    DAMN, now I REALLY want their donors revealed!

    • Chucktech

      Ain’t that just tough shit. Must suck for them…

    • Chucktech

      And, BTW, maybe their god deluded donors should have thought of that BEFORE they shelled out their shekels to NOM…

      • oikos

        and to think they could have traded them for brides.

    • PLAINTOM

      Freedom of hidden speech ?

    • ScottJL

      We can give them some white hoods, then they’ll be in disguise.

      • Happy Dance

        They need yellow hoods.

    • D. J.

      Seems they’re having trouble with fund raising already.

    • JoeNCA

      They’re just worried that if they reveal their donors, those same donors will be shy to donate in the future, and then they’ll never carry out their plan to stop gay marriage from becoming legal in all 50 states.

      Oh wait….

  • Chucktech

    Paid its fine and registered as a ballot question committee under whine, not protest.

    BTW, I thought this horse was beaten to death a couple of years ago?? Damn, those justice wheels grind slowly…

    • NOM appealed at every level and because they challenged the law itself they had to fight through those appeals before they ever got to the actual ruling itself and then that was appealed at every level. The good news is that NOM had to expend a good amount of energy and money fighting this massive court battle for years.

  • i wonder how much money from their donations was used to fill maggie’s feedbag?

    • oikos
      • Chucktech

        Jesus, oikos, that’s disGUSting!

        I love you…

        • oikos

          Love you back, Chuck! Humor is how I cope with the world.

          • Chucktech

            And that, my friend is why these joyless, mirthless fucks don’t have even a christian’s excretory prayer of a chance of defeating us!

          • oikos

            Yeah they don’t understand humor at all.

          • Schlukitz

            Sometime, humor is the only thing that keeps us from going totally bonkers.

          • oikos

            Indeed. Aside from all of the faux outrage in this thread, I hope you are well, Schlukitz. 🙂

          • LovesIrony

            more like foe outrage

          • Schlukitz

            Fit as fiddle! LOL

            Thanks for inquring, my friend.

            Keep up the good work. Shaming Maggie is a rough job, but someone’s gotta do it. ;-P

      • SJWinCMH

        Supa dupa fupa!

      • zhera

        I usually find your photoshops funny and entertaining, oikos. But not this time.
        I don’t give a shit about Maggie Gallagher – I’m just thinking that the woman who’s body that is could very well be a kind and gentle human being, and doesn’t deserve to be made fun of.

        • oikos

          Not my photoshop, an internet find. Already out there on google images.

          • canoebum

            You gotta own re-posting it. The fat jokes aren’t all that funny. We despise their ideas, their efforts to deny us our rights and their hypocrisy. Isn’t that ground rich enough?

          • oikos

            I do own reposting it. I responded to Kiwi’s post about NOM’s budget and as I said Brian and Maggie deserve no quarter after all they have done. You are welcome to be upset about it and express that.

          • Sporkfighter

            The picture doesn’t shame Maggie, it shames overweight people by using “fat” as an insult.

          • oikos

            and no one on this blog has ever made fun of Maggie’s eating habits have they?

          • Sporkfighter

            “Other people do it too” is no defense of your own behavior, and if that’s your response, you know you’re in the wrong.

            We all act like dicks from time to time. Dragging it out with indefensible defense rather than introspection and growth is a right-wing characteristic.

          • oikos

            Flag button is on the right of the post-flag away.

          • fuow

            No, it does not.

          • Toasterlad

            Yes, it does.

          • fuow

            No, it does not. All this PC-Bullshit needs to be flushed down the toilet. It stinks.

          • Toasterlad

            It has nothing to do with being PC. It has to do with making yourself look like a childish idiot when your best argument against someone is to attack their appearance.

          • Balderdashing

            Yeah, let’s return to the good old days when you could slur someone with impugnity for being black, or Jewish, or non-Christian, or short, or female, or crippled, or ethnic, or lisping! Man, I miss the days when God’s great plan made me better than everyone else.

          • Schlukitz

            Sluring the aforementioned groups is now politically incorect.

            it’s still open season on LGBT people, however.

            Where is your outrage about that?

          • Balderdashing

            ?? Did you miss that I was showing how insupportable fuow’s stance was by extension? Gay folks aren’t the only ones it’s still open season on.

            As much as we like mocking those who deserve derision for their willful ignorance, hateful actions and dearth of compassion, using weight to slur them is very much an implicit slur on all hefty people. Explain to me how weight is supposed to be reflective of one’s views, reasoning capacity, capabilities or morality. Yes, we can get too PC, but there are a number of ways we’re still openly discriminatory and need to have our beads read when we cross the line.

          • Schlukitz

            “Gay folks aren’t the only ones it’s still open season on.”

            Really now?

            Then perhaps you could explain to me why LGBT people are the only ones whom I see being slammed, cursed, demeaned, belittled and spit on, in print, on a daily basis?

          • Schlukitz

            It shames people who are glutonous hypocrites and haters.

          • oikos

            Nope, I’m pretty sure it shames Maggie as someone else specifically created it to do so.

          • fuow

            Oh, puhlease. Leave the right-speak=right-think to the Nazis.

          • Toasterlad

            That’s exactly what people who make mean-spirited jokes about gay people say.

          • canoebum

            You’re accusing ME of right speech? You must not have read much of what I post here. I’ll give your ignorance a pass this time, but in future I won’t be so forgiving.

          • Schlukitz

            Turning the other cheek is for loosers.

        • fuow

          That woman may be a decent human being, but with the head of that c*nt on her, nobody would recognize her.

          • zhera

            Not the point. She’s being ridiculed for her body and it’s something that hurts all people with weight issues.

            I would’ve thought that a minority who’s constantly being ridiculed and mis-represented would have more understanding for this.

            Maggie Gallagher is vile enough in words and spirit, her body is irrelevant.

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            Is she being ridiculed for her body or for her hypocrisy, of which her body serves as an indicator that she is a fraud?

          • zhera

            But that’s not her body in the picture. There’s another woman being ridiculed here and she could be a great ally for all we know. Add to that the body shaming all overweight people experience when pics like this are posted.

            Like I said, I don’t care about Maggie’s feelings. I do care about the feelings of decent and nice people.

          • oikos

            I’m sorry but that is a ridiculous argument. Whoever it is in that picture cannot be identified so it shames no one but Maggie.

          • zhera

            Disagree.

          • oikos

            We’ll have to agree to disagree then.

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            Thanks, zhera. I hear you about the body not being Maggie’s, but I don’t agree that using the pic means that all overweight people are being shamed. (Do we even know if it IS a person…or is it already a manipulated image?)
            If it was a comic drawing instead of a photo, would it still be an issue?

          • Mark

            Her words and spirit are hideously corrupt.

          • Toasterlad

            RIGHT.

        • RoFaWh

          I’m sort of a lard ass myself. When I see a photo of someone that fat, my gut reaction is one of pity.

      • Trog

        What’s with the fat-shaming? Must we lower ourselves BELOW our enemies? Seriously, I find this line of attack to be revolting and immature and not the least bit humorous. Attack people for their ideas and morals, etc…. not for their looks and body weight.

        We are better than this.

        Aren’t we?

        • oikos

          Take it up with Google images. I have no sympathy for Maggie and she and Brian both partake in gluttony, one of the deadly sins. Since they rail about perceived sin of others all the time, they are both fair game.

          • Toasterlad

            It’s not a matter of being nice to Maggie and Brian. It’s a matter of lowest common denominator humor and shaming other people who have nothing whatsoever to do with NOM.

            When conservatives attack Clinton for her looks, we’re always willing to tsk-tsk and call them on their stupidity. And yet every single comment section on this blog for any article that deals with a conservative woman and/or fat person is filled with disgusting comments/pictures ridiculing them for their appearance. That’s called hypocrisy…the very thing you’re claiming to be calling out Gallagher and Brown for.

            Resorting to appearance-based insults is grade school pettiness that says only one thing about you: you are unable to engage people on an intellectual level. I don’t think that’s the message you want to send.

          • oikos

            You are entitled to be upset about whatever you wish. If you find it overly offensive the flag button is on the upper right.

          • Toasterlad

            I’m trying to help you understand WHY it’s offensive, so you’ll stop doing it.

          • oikos

            I don’t need to be lectured. If offended, flag it.

          • Toasterlad

            You clearly DO need to be lectured, since you don’t understand why what you’re doing is offensive, immature, hypocritical, and counter-productive.

          • oikos

            In the years I’ve been posting on this blog there have been numerous posts about Maggie and Brian’s eating habits. I’ve never seen you lecture anyone else about it. You know where the button is if you want to flag it.

          • Toasterlad

            I have been posting for weeks about people using appearance-shaming in an attempt to be funny. But if I had never said a single thing, ever, that doesn’t make what you’re doing okay.

            And thanks, I did flag it…as well as the comment above it.

          • oikos

            Good for you. There have been posts on here depicting maggie as a cow chewing cud and as a sow as well as other things and I’ve never seen any faux outrage over those.

          • Toasterlad

            You will. And when you do, will you stop? Or is “everyone else is doing it, too!” not your only excuse?

          • oikos

            Yawn

          • Toasterlad

            So we’re clear: you DON’T have a good argument for posting this crap; you’re just doing it because you think it’s funny and mean, even though it’s been explained to you why it’s counter-productive. Okay. This is Joe’s house, and if Joe is cool with that, that’s fine. And I’ll continue to complain about it, until he asks me not to.

          • Schlukitz

            Where was your outrage when this disgusting sow (yes, I called her a sow and I will not apologize for it) was busy calling LGBT people every name in the book?

            Are we just supposed to bow and curtsy and say “Thank you, Ma’am…may we have more of the same”?

          • Toasterlad

            If you’ll check my posting history, you’ll find I’ve expressed plenty of outrage. Or do you think insulting someone’s appearance is the only way to express your outrage?

          • Schlukitz

            My policy in life has always been…

            When you toss a hand grenade into my back yard, I am going to pick it up and toss it back into the yard from whence it came.

            That’s how it works. Deal with it.

          • LovesIrony

            I don’t get offended when someone attacks my enemies, that’s just me.

          • LovesIrony

            Where’s your criticism of Maggie?

          • Schlukitz

            Non-existant.

            He’s been to busy defending the likes of her.

          • Toasterlad

            Did you check my posting history?

          • LovesIrony

            yes how far back do you expect me to go? I checked and didn’t see any criticism of that fat ugly bitch.

          • Toasterlad

            Maybe you were searching for the words “fat ugly bitch”? If so, no, you wouldn’t find anything.

          • oikos

            Your opinion is of course your own. That being said, you don’t get to determine what I think, feel or post. Get over yourself.

          • Toasterlad

            Feel free to explain, then. I’d love to hear your justification for why what you’re doing is okay. So far, all you’ve done is complain that everybody else is doing it too.

          • Mark

            And again – you’ve made your point. Or do you need some nails and a cross to be right?

          • Toasterlad

            I’m not trying to be “right”. I already know I’m right. I’m trying to help other people see why it’s hypocritical and counter-productive of us to act like commenters on Breitbart. If we all agree that’s a bad thing, then why are so many people so butthurt about being asked to knock it off?

          • LovesIrony

            because I’m not ready to make nice. You may pick up your citizenship award in the basement. they’re located just to the right of the I support bigots buttons, you’re welcome to one of them also.

          • Toasterlad

            So if I don’t call Maggie Gallagher a fat cow, I’m supporting bigots?

          • LovesIrony

            You have not criticized her at all You defend my enemy and attack my allies, Take a button

          • Schlukitz

            One wonders if he has done anything at all to stop the collective damage that the mad cow wreaked on our community?

          • Toasterlad

            Not wanting people to engage in fat-shaming is “defending your enemy”?

          • zhera

            Holy Macaroni, this thread turned ugly!

            Toasterlad, I agree with you about the body-shaming. I think, or hope, that the reason that people are reacting so ugly to your comments is that they’re a little bit ashamed and are lashing out instead.

            I don’t know. I just don’t understand the need for getting so vicious and catty.

          • Toasterlad

            I think it goes a little past “a little bit ashamed” when you get accused not just of supporting Maggie Gallagher but of being an enemy of the LGBT community just because you ask people to quit fat-shaming.

            It always sickens me when oppressed minorities have no empathy or consideration for other oppressed minorities. Here we see the ugliness of some in our community, who don’t give two shits about how it may make other fat people feel to be used as a punchline to take down Maggie Gallagher.

            I love this blog, and, honestly, I love most of the people here, even some of the ones who’ve been attacking me. But this relentless childishness and mean-spiritedness regarding women and fat people is fucking DRAINING.

          • zhera

            I am quite shocked at the reactions to your comments. Did NOT see that coming.

            I agree with everything you said here. Fat-shaming, racism, misogyny, homophobia… It’s all the same for me. I am by no means a perfect person, I fuck up all the time. I hope that when that happens people will let me know in a polite way.

            Calling you a nazi? Seriously?

            (my computer is dying on me so this will have to be my last comment on this. Stay strong!)

          • Schlukitz

            No one is demaning that you call Maggie Gallagher a fat cow.

            That said, we reserve the right to call her anything that we like.

            It’s called freedom of speech and the haters do not have a monopoly on that right even though they are trying their best to make it a law just for themselves.

          • Mark

            And like i said – YOU MADE YOUR FUCKING POINT!! NO ONE HAS TO BOW TO YOUR “RIGHT”.

          • Toasterlad

            Not looking for adulation (although it is certainly well deserved). Looking to get the fat-shaming to stop. When it does, I’LL stop. Simple?

          • Mark

            oh no….a martyr…..

          • Toasterlad

            Commenting on a discussion board doesn’t qualify one for martyrhood by any stretch of the imagination.

            You sure do love your religious terminology, though!

          • oikos

            I’ve already explained. Someone who fought to deny us basic rights deserves no respect. If you want to make it about other people, then that says more about you than me. My post was about one person: Slaggie. Perhaps you should read some of my posts instead of just rote lecturing.

          • Toasterlad

            You posted a photo-shopped picture of an obese woman with Maggie Gallagher’s face on it, in an attempt to make fun of Maggie. Because she’s FAT. You really don’t see how using “fat” as mockery isn’t hurtful to more than just Maggie?

          • oikos

            You are really obtuse. No. This was about slaggie, nothing else. Get over yourself.

          • Toasterlad

            Hopefully, someday, you’ll understand why you’re wrong.

          • oikos

            Hopefully someday you’ll realize that others don’t bow to your will. Get over yourself.

          • Mark

            Damn – chill out. You made your fucking point – or do you need a cross to nail him to?

          • Toasterlad

            Asking people to explain their actions is persecution now?

            Are you going to call me a Nazi too?

          • Mark

            Why does anyone here or anywhere have to explain their “actions” to you? Are you the self-appointed clearinghouse for gay actions?? Who the fuck do you hope to be?

          • Schlukitz

            Agreed.

            Who was she?

            Who is she?

            And who does she hope to be?

          • LovesIrony

            maggie’s food taster

          • Toasterlad

            I can’t make anyone explain anything, but oikos was doing it anyway…except that his explanations were just, “everyone else was doing it.” I was hoping to get him to dig a little deeper, so that he’d ultimately see that he couldn’t really justify what he was posting.

            I HOPE to be a person who fights for a world in which people are accepted for who they are, regardless of gender, age, race, orientation, weight or physical appearance. Who do YOU hope to be?

          • Mark

            I hope to be your last word….or do you have a last word to get in?

          • Schlukitz

            The self-righteous always have a history of always getting the last word in. :-0

          • Toasterlad

            You hope to be my last word? What does that mean?

          • Schlukitz

            Someone who is not as self-rightious as you.

          • Schlukitz

            No. But you sure are beginning to sound like a goody-goody, two shoes.

            Give it a rest already.

          • Toasterlad

            I like being good. You’re free to ignore me whenever you wish.

          • pierre denerome

            You like being good? Come join us at
            Venice Beach CA.But watch your language.We do not use the word fuck;
            unless you mean it.

          • Schlukitz

            When you choose to ignore us, we shall be only to happy to do the same.

            The ball’s in your court, Sir.

          • oikos

            No one owes you any explanation for anything. Just exactly who do you think you are?

          • Schlukitz

            A Jehovah’s witness, perhaps? LOL

          • Toasterlad

            I didn’t say you owed me anything. I ASKED you why you were posting pictures like that, and you said “everybody does it.”

          • oikos

            Apparently you can’t read for comprehension either.

          • Toasterlad

            My reading comprehension is excellent, thanks, though my vision is poor. If I’m mischaracterizing what you said, please feel free to tell how, and I’ll apologize.

          • Schlukitz

            “Gawd”, apparently.

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            Just because you believe it’s counter-productive doesn’t make it so.

            Also, your suggestion that our “being better” may be the root of how you choose to live your life, but don’t make it a demand that others must live that way too.

          • Toasterlad

            I’m not in a position to demand anything. This is not my house. I’m ASKING people to make better choices about how they express their anger. I understand that some people don’t like it, and are asking me to stop. They are likewise not in a position to demand anything.

            It is not my OPINION that childish name-calling and schoolyard bullying is counter-productive. It is accepted fact. The next time the Right attacks us, using the same tools I’m complaining about here, and people react with anger and disgust, maybe it’ll make more sense.

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            I’m ASKING people to make better choices about how they express their anger.
            Why not settle for asking people to make DIFFERENT choices about how they express their anger.?
            Your insistence that your choice is BETTER reeks of a superiority that would do Tony Perkins proud.

          • Toasterlad

            If you don’t agree with the notion that fat-shaming is bad, than I AM superior to you, at least in that regard.

            Nobody’s a good person all the time. That doesn’t mean we can’t try to be. If mocking someone for being fat is so important to you that you have to fight this hard for it, maybe you need to try harder to be better.

          • Schlukitz

            “I AM superior to you,”

            Name me a fascist dictator who did not also make that claim?

            Hitler is the very first who comes to mind.

          • zhera

            “at least in that regard.”
            Come on now. At least quote him in context.
            I am horrified at the ugliness here. Toasterlad is trying to stay on the topic – fat shaming – and people are calling him every nasty thing they can think of.
            Why is the reaction so strong this time? We’ve had fat body shaming discussions before

          • Schlukitz

            Perhaps it is because a good many of us are fed-up with Toasterlad’s constant hijacking of threads, his Mother Superior attitude and his constant preachingbloviating about this that and the other like we are a bunch of little children at his Sunday School class?

          • Amanda B. Rekendwith

            If you don’t agree with the notion that fat-shaming is bad, than I AM superior to you, at least in that regard.
            I am trying very hard to see things from your POV, but your insistence about your superiority doesn’t add anything to the clarity.

            For your next act, maybe you could work on your humility a bit, and then you might actually have something. Until then, I think your approach could use significant adjustment.

          • Toasterlad

            There are many areas in which you’re undoubtedly superior to me, so I feel no need for false modesty in claiming that empathy is clearly not one.

            And you’re right; I can be a total dick. That’s one of the areas *I* have to work on. But I don’t believe I started this conversation in a dickish fashion, and if I’ve reacted to snark and pettiness with snark and pettiness…well, I haven’t accused anyone of being an Evangelical Nazi Sympathizer who kisses homophobe ass, just because they disagree with me. So I’m more or less comfortable with my “approach”.

          • Schlukitz

            Well said.

            I for one, am so fucking sick and tired of people who insist that I must live my life according to how they think I should and who try to tell me how I must think, act and speak.

            And it is especially infuriating when a member of my own tribe pulls this shit.

            I wonder if Toasterlad is a member of the Republican Log Cabin Party?

            He sure sounds like one. 🙁

          • oikos

            No, No I won’t. Just because you’ve been a dick about me mocking one of our enemies.

          • Toasterlad

            Great! So now you have an EXCUSE for fat-shaming! “Toasterlad was mean to me” is certainly more original than “everybody does it”, I’ll give you that.

            For what it’s worth, I didn’t MEAN to be a dick to you, although I am, admittedly, a dick. And I honestly don’t have any ill-will towards you. I just don’t like people on my side using the same low-brow, merit-less tactics that the people on the other side do, and I’d like you to stop. I’m not a perfect person, and I don’t expect anyone else to be, either. I just don’t think it’s asking too much for people to leave physical appearance out of their comments. There are better, more effective ways to be funny, and there are certainly better, more effective ways to express your outrage.

          • oikos

            Still lecturing and not saying anything new.

          • Toasterlad

            Nor are you, sadly.

          • barrixines

            “I have been posting for weeks about people using appearance-shaming in an attempt to be funny”

            Has it escaped your attention that Joe picks the most unflattering photos he can find of the rogue’s gallery? Why stop at fat-shaming? The photo most used of Maggie here shows her as frankly educationally challenged.

          • oikos

            Thank you. This little temper tantrum over me mocking someone whose job it was to make sure we did not have human rights would be amusing if it weren’t so petty.

          • Toasterlad

            There’s a difference between posting an unflattering picture of someone as a humorous punctuation to an article about how awful they are, and posting a picture designed to mock a physical characteristic, especially in response to a comment which is also mocking a physical characteristic.

            In other words, anyone photographed at the right moment could exhibit Brian Brown’s monkey face or Maggie Gallagher’s dur face. When Joe starts posting photo-shopped pictures of Maggie Gallagher sitting on a park bench with her gut hanging on the ground, then you’ve got a point. I haven’t seen him do anything close to that.

          • barrixines

            Sorry but that contradicts this statement

            I have been posting for weeks about people using appearance-shaming in an attempt to be funny

            Joe posts those shots because they look like morons for us to laugh at their appearances.

            I don’t really hold with this boy scout idea that somehow LGBT people have got to be better than anyone else. It reminds me a bit of how when Hattie McDaniel accepted her Oscar for Gone with the Wind she was forced to say that she was glad to be a credit to her race. I do not subscribe to the idea that I have to be a credit to my sexuality.

            I appreciate honestly that this is an issue for you but it does seem to be rather that you make the same mistake as our enemies as marking out LGBT somehow as different from anyone else. We’re not. We’re human in all our failings and prejudices.

          • LovesIrony

            and we have our quislings

          • Sporkfighter

            “I don’t really hold with this boy scout idea that somehow LGBT people have got to be better than anyone else.”

            It isn’t about “gay people” being better than everyone else, it’s about each of us holding ourselves to high standards. It isn’t OK to slut-shame women or fat-shame anyone no matter who you are. It isn’t about Maggie or Brian, it’s about using a characteristic of one group as an insult. It’s no different from an old acquaintance who often said “that’s mighty white of you” rather than “thank you”.

          • LovesIrony

            you’re welcome to part from the group at any time.

          • Sporkfighter

            I’ll wait for Joe to ask me to leave.

          • barrixines

            But sometimes a slut shaming joke is funny – lord knows I have had enough of them directed at me. We’re not in church here – I come to Joe’s because I like the fact that some of the comments are a bit racy and a bit off colour. I have lurked here long enough to know that the regulars are decent folk who sometimes let their hair down. I think it’s great to be reminded as you and Toasterlad have done, that we are being a bit mean, but sorry sometimes a bit of meanness makes me laugh and releases some of the tension these homophobic fuckwits build up in me.

          • Schlukitz

            Thank you for joining the dialogue.

            Others are obliged to pay a psychiatrist for relief.

            We can get ours here for free. :-0

          • barrixines

            I think Trog and Toasterlad’s initial points were fair and well made and it doesn’t hurt to be reminded if we are being a bit unfair. But I don’t get the subsequent “I am going to tell you what being a good gay means”. Does anyone here seriously think Oikos or me or anyone else really has an issue with fat people? It’s no more than doing the dozens and letting off steam. The subsequent telling off felt disproportionate and controlling. And I can’t help it but the line “buy her a fucking pizza” made me roar.

          • oikos

            That one made me laugh out loud.

          • Schlukitz

            Then Buy her a fucking pizza was a classic.

            I too roared when I read it.

            Thanks for sharing.

          • Toasterlad

            It has nothing to do with being a “good gay”. Fat-shaming isn’t something ANY decent person should do.

            I’m not trying to control anybody. I’m trying to get people to put some thought into what they post. They are, of course, free to ignore me, or yell at me, as they’ve made abundantly clear.

          • barrixines

            “I’m not trying to control anybody-”

            Honestly look at some of your posts here and the way you expressed yourself. This one in particular:

            “I WANT him to stop fat-shaming people. I KNOW that he NEEDS to be lectured, because he’s still doing it.”

            My response to someone posting a message like that to me would be who the fuck are you? It’s pissy, arrogant and not in the least designed to move the discussion forward. It’s just a big ol stamp your feet my way or the highway kind of post. You’re just preening about occupying the moral highground – fuck knows it’s where I spend enough time myself much to my own annoyance – and guaranteed to put people’s backs up.

          • Toasterlad

            Sure, but I didn’t start the conversation that way.

            Frankly, given the accusations and slanders and insults and general bad behavior I’ve been subjected to since my suggestion that we maybe shouldn’t be using grade school bully tactics against our enemies, I believe I’ve shown remarkable restraint…as well as entrenched an unassailable position on the moral high ground.

          • Toasterlad

            I absolutely agree with you, and if this was an isolated incident, it wouldn’t bother me as much. But this happens EVERY TIME an article about a woman and/or a fat person is posted.

            Frankly, I didn’t realize the problem was this bad until the responses I was getting looked like they were straight out Free Republic. All because I asked someone to stop using fat to insult someone else.

            If calling people fat or a bitch is the best weapon we’ve got, what does that say about us as a community? And I’m not talking about the LGBT community…I’m talking about the Joe.My.God community.

          • barrixines

            “If calling people fat or a bitch is the best weapon we’ve got, what does that say about us as a community?”

            No there is plenty of erudition, insight, and heart on display here regularly too. Mockery is just one of the weapons in the armoury. I do actually come here mostly to laugh at the sheer wickedness of villains like Linda Harvey, Tony Perkins and Maggie. They truly deserve it and I welcome the off-colour humour showed by some of the smart-mouthed, quick-witted folk here.

            So I guess what it says about us as a community is that, much like any other community there is a diversity of opinions, coping strategies and methods of defence/attack. It’s also clear we don’t all share the same boundaries and what might cross the line for you doesn’t necessarily for me. Just like regular folk eh?

          • Toasterlad

            It’s not the mockery I object to. It’s the childish, hurtful methods frequently employed.

            I don’t expect everyone to be Noel Coward. I’m just sick of posts about women and/or fat people dominated by childish bullies who think “You’re fat!” is the height of wit.

          • Schlukitz

            With all due respect, and I do emphasize my respect for you as a supporter of LGBT rights, I feel compelled to state that you really do not have any idea of what it feels like to spend one’s entire life being the victim of family rejection, rejection by society as a whole, slights, finger-pointing, ridicule, barbs, insults, jeers, laughter, hate comments, anti-gay laws, bashings, beatings and Christian-inspired hate killings. And that’s just the tip of the ice-berg.

            I say this as a man of some 78 years who has been the victim of two beatings, being denied the right to serve my country, live where I choose, work where I choose, live my life free of fear or harm, marry my significant other for over ten years or enjoy the rights and privileges that you have always enjoyed and never been denied of.

            You will have to forgive us if the weight and gravitas of all that mental and physical abuse occasionally gets the better of us at times.

            it is important to note that the LGBT community did not start this culture war. The Christian right did. And Maggie is one of the many members and leaders of anti-gay hate clubs.

            From my point of view, she is getting exactly what she deserves. And unlike Matthew Sheppard and the thousands of LBGT people who have been murdered or committed suicide because of vile, bigoted and hateful people like her, she will survive it.

            The others were not so fortunate. They no longer get to enjoy their twinkies and cupcakes.

          • Toasterlad

            I know exactly what it’s like to live through those experiences, and Sporkfighter is exactly right.

            Being shitty to someone because other people have been shitty to you is the most piss-poor excuse for bullying there is.

          • Schlukitz

            Deflection, my boy. Deflection. You are now being disingenuous.

            No one here is being shitty to someone because others have been shitty to us.

            We are being shitty only to those who have been shitty to us and are totally deserving of it.

            Don’t lie about shit. It only serves to give your argument less credibility.

          • Sporkfighter

            “From my point of view, she is getting exactly what she deserves. And unlike Matthew Sheppard and the thousands of LBGT people who have been murdered or committed suicide because of vile, bigoted and hateful people like her, she will survive it.”

            First, I disagree that Maggie is getting anything like what she deserves. Posting a photoshopped image of her that she’ll likely never see is not the smallest sliver of what she deserves. She is alive, and there is no hell, she will never get what she deserves. Then again, who does? You didn’t, Matthew Sheppard didn’t. For better or worse, most people don’t.

            There are millions of overweight people who don’t get what they deserve when being fat is equated with being bigoted or dumb or evil or lazy. When “fat” is understood by all to be an insult, making fun of anyone for being fat drags ever one of those overweight people farther from any chance at a life of dignity. It’s no different than using “faggot” as an insult.

            Consider this: If Maggie were slender, young, and attractive, would she be less repulsive? No, and we’d have no trouble explaining why she’s repulsive, because she isn’t ugly because she’s fat. The root of Maggie’s evil has nothing to do with her weight, so why stigmatize other people who have nothing to do with Maggie but their weight?

            As an aside, I have been beaten for being a “faggot” in high school. I’m not gay, but I’m small, slender, nonathletic, a member of the chess club and debate team, one of Matt Baume’s sissies. Close enough, I guess, for those thugs. I can empathize in some very small way with what you’ve suffered, but I can empathize with my fat friends and students too.

          • Schlukitz

            First of all, you need to know that this is not Toasterload’s first visit to the rodeo.

            Toasterlad has a long history of hijacking threads like this one, derailing the conversation and turning it into a pissing match like the little boy who feels compelled to poke a stick into a hornet’s nest…and then howls to high heaven when he gets stung in the ass.

            The obviously photo-shopped picture of a porcine Maggie Gallagher is poetic justice. People. Glass houses. Stones. And yes. I do agree with you. It is hardly sufficient criticism of the tremendous harm that she has inflicted on the LGBT community. She deserves so much more than this. No argument here.

            It should also be noted that no one said a word to Toasterlad until he decided to go on a tear with oikos about the picture that he posted. Always and without exception, Toasterlad starts this shit and then, just like the Christian anti-gay maligners of LGBT people who have never done shit to them, cries “persecution” and having his “freedom of speech” squelched.

            oikos was perfectly within his rights to post that picture irrespective of whether anyone approved of it or not. Obviously, it did not violate the TOS of this site or Joe Jervis would have deleted it.

            Likewise, Toasterlad has every right to post his objections to oikos having done so. No one is denying him of that right. Nor, has anyone flagged his comments as he admittedly did with oikos. Special rights? Special treatment?

            But that was not good enough for Toasterlad. Yet once again, he had turn the thread into a forum for his own private use and transform it into a pulpit from which to preach/bloviate down at everone else and which he so obviously enjoys doing, much to the consternation of the majority of posters on JMG, myself included.

            It was that smug, self-righteous positon that Toasterlad so often takes with us, that made us turn on him like the lions on the Christians in the arena.

            I am reminded of the little shit that kept picking on the other much larger boy in school who finally had had enough and body-lammed the little fucker. Many would argue that it was wrong of the other boy to do that…that he was bigger…that it was overkill…he should taken the high road…Yada, yada, yada, but the fact still remains that the little fucker begged for it and so he must assume some responsibility for what happened to him. One reaps what one sows. And thus it goes for Maggie sweets; bless her not so little heart.

            The assumption that all of the posters on JMG are women-haters who love to attack fat people is entirely erroneous, exaggerated and disingenuous. Maggie just happens to be a woman and it is she who chose to become obese, just like I have chosen to allow myself to become obese over the past couple of years.

            No one twists my arm to eat pasta, pizza or Hagen Dasz ice cream. Those are my choices and I do not demand that anyone “respect” my choice to become fat, ask for special treatment as a fat person or get all pissy if someone happens to mention that I have allowed myselt to get fat. It’s the truth and I deal with it. And, if I cannot handle that, then I have the choice of going on a diet. It’s called being responsible for ones choices. The rest is all bullshit.

            I found it interesting that you minimalized my experiences by sayng I can empathize in some very small way with what you’ve suffered, yet you chose to enumerate the injustices that you suffered as a straight man. Very telling, indeed. Where have we heard this before, I wonder?

            Sorry, but that argument comes off sounding like the old My pain is far greater than your pain. As a senior gay man who has been around the block quite a few times (and also been to the rodeo), I refuse to get involved in that pissing match.

          • Toasterlad

            “I hate Toasterlad! Toasterlad is the worst! Does Toasterlad ever ask about me? Let’s drive by Toasterlad’s house tonight.”

          • Sporkfighter

            “I found it interesting that you minimalized my experiences by sayng I can empathize in some very small way with what you’ve suffered, yet you chose to enumerate the injustices that you suffered as a straight man. Very telling, indeed. Where have we heard this before, I wonder?”

            What I meant was that I can empathize with your experiences in a very small way because I know I’ve not personally experienced as much in my 55 years as you probably have in a week. For the last century, it’s unjustly sucked to be gay. You know it from experience. I know it because I listen to people like you. Take me at my word.

            “Sorry, but that argument comes off sounding like the old My pain is far greater than your pain. As a senior gay man who has been around the block quite a few times (and also been to the rodeo), I refuse to get involved in that pissing match.”

            Well, your pain is far greater than mine. Telling me that isn’t a “pissing contest”, it’s a statement of fact, so obvious it needn’t be said.

            Along with participating as best I can in the civil rights fight of my day, I find the people who participate here to be intelligent, funny, and above all, optimistic and upbeat in spite of the difficulties they’ve been through. Makes me feel better about my own problems, reminds me how good I’ve had it.

          • Schlukitz

            Thank you for that clarification. Obviously, I misintepreted your words. And for that, I apologize profusely.

            It’s an example of how one-dimentional mere words can be and how easily they can be misunderstood. With no facial expressions, no body language and no voice inflections to accentuate the true meaning of the words, it is so easy to mis-judge ones meaning. This was a perfect example.

            Your kind words in your closing paragraph meant a great deal to me and were good to hear. As you indicated, it’s not often that we see words of praise in the headlines that we read here on JMG each day. I am certain that there are many more caring, open-minded and supportive folks like you out there. It just a shame that we don’t get to hear from more of them.

            I know tht I have said it in the past but I will say it yet once again. Thanks for being on our side. We appreciate it more than you’ll ever know. 🙂

          • Toasterlad

            Being LGBT has nothing to do with it. If you disagree with ANYONE, about ANYTHING, it does not advance your argument to belittle them because of their weight or appearance.

            I explained already why what Joe does is not the same as fat-shaming. Joe’s pictures are funny because of the expression of the people he posts. Anyone can have a goofy expression in a photo. He is not taking a specific characteristic and using it against the person; he taking a human condition (a bad photo), and using it to punctuate an article about what a horrible person that person is. He is not posting photo-shopped pictures of Maggie Gallagher and Brian Brown, and intimating that the reason they’re worth ridiculing is because they’re obese.

          • barrixines

            “I explained already why what Joe does is not the same as fat-shaming.
            Joe’s pictures are funny because of the expression of the people he
            posts”

            No you have explained why you think it is different. Important distinction there and I think it’s the one you’re not getting which is why you are putting people’s backs up. A little “in my opinion” goes a long way.

            So – in my opinion the photo Joe posts of Maggie is highly redolent of the kid who gets put at the back of the class to make macaroni pictures with Legos stuck up her nose. Quite frankly she looks simple and we are invited to laugh at Maggie looking like a simpleton. That actually is a pretty unsavoury laugh too. It just isn’t hitting your buttons in the same way as the fat jokes are.

            Seriously do you think anyone here dislikes Gallagher because she’s overweight?

          • Toasterlad

            That’s a fair point. I DON’T think of that picture of Maggie as being anything more than “dur face”, which anyone could show, depending on the picture. However, I can certainly see how someone else could think it’s an attempt to belittle mentally challenged people. I couldn’t even say that’s not Joe’s intent, although I don’t think it is. So yes, that could be a matter of opinion as to whether or not that picture is inappropriate or mean-spirited.

            I don’t, however, think there’s any doubt that the picture of “Maggie” in question IS mean-spirited. Regardless of how you feel about fat people, or Maggie Gallagher, that image was created to belittle Maggie Gallagher FOR being fat, and was clearly posted with that intent. I don’t think THAT’S a matter of opinion. That’s a matter of CONTEXT.

            I know exactly why people here don’t like Maggie Gallagher. My issue is not with the hate she gets (she deserves all the hate). My issue is with people using Maggie Gallagher to make fat people feel shame, and, beyond that, to reduce the worth of women, however odious they may be, to their physical appearance.

          • barrixines

            My issue is with people using Maggie Gallagher to make fat people feel
            shame, and, beyond that, to reduce the worth of women, however odious
            they may be, to their physical appearance.

            You might feel it does that I don’t think it is people’s intention. To me when people are laughing at Maggie’s weight on here they are just drawing attention to her hypocrisy not being able to live by the Biblical rules she wishes to hit us over the head with.

            I see you have drawn in a more general note here and below about what you think posters think about women here and for me that is way off. Every one of the villains here gets the stock jokes. Brian Brown gets as many fat jokes as Maggie does and on top of that he along with any fat guy gets the small penis jokes. Linda Harvey gets the withered old fuckless misery jokes. With Janet Porter it’s mostly that she looks like she needs a good shit- Every single guy gets a judgement on being not fuckable or hate fuckable. And so on and so on. It’s all part of the schtick that goes on in amongst the more serious discussions.

            Suggesting there is an anti women vibe here is just so much SJW-ish nonsense. Unless you seriously think the word bitch should be out of bounds and if you do I am afraid you are just pissing in the wind on that one.

          • Toasterlad

            I have no doubt that no one intends any insult to anyone besides Maggie Gallagher when they call her fat. Just like a high school bully intends no insult to anyone besides the kid he calls “faggot”.

            Intentions are not context. They do not matter when determining who is the target of a joke, intended or otherwise.

            The level of misogyny is pretty glaring on any post that is about a conservative woman, no matter how much she weighs. If you compare and contrast any article about Brian Brown with, say, an article about the country clerk in Kentucky who’s going to court over not issuing marriage licenses…well, I invite you to tally up the comments about physical appearance. Ignoring the problem doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.

            I think the word “bitch” should not be the first insult a person thinks of to hurl at a woman. If it is, I think that person’s got some issues to work through…as do we all. I’m not less misogynistic, or racist, or homophobic than most anyone else. I was raised in the same society, after all. That is no excuse for not examining your behavior and trying to better yourself.

          • barrixines

            Oh dear now you’re lecturing me to examine my own isms. Already done it and found I am a decent enough bloke. But one who is a little weary,

            I was reading a much more right on blog the other day where they were discussing a Breitbart piece byi Milo Yiannopoulos and someone posted the comment “He’s a gay Catholic – that tells me everything”. Which for me it does too. Immediately an SJW was in there with “I find that remark homophobic” and the thread then got derailed while they examined the commenter’s homophobia. I knew then that really wasn’t the place for me. That sort of thing just makes my shoulders sink.

            Your posts are doing the same to me now. For as long as I have lurked here at Joe’s it’s been a bit rude and right-off but plenty of heart and smarts too. It suits me when people are letting their hair down a bit. You obviously want it to be something different. You’re on a mission to save – you want to change the world one gay blog at a time. Good luck with that fella – I can’t fault your intention, you mean well I guess but I have no interest in where it is you’re going.

          • Toasterlad

            I’m fairly sure I was speaking generally, but sure, it can be all about you if you want it to be.

            I agree that it IS a bummer when someone feels compelled to rudely point out body-shaming and other gross behavior. It’s much more fun when people are constantly punching down. Oh, the hilarity of making fat people feel bad! Their feelings don’t matter, cause they’re fat!

            But now I’m off message. Time to get back to being a…SJW, you said? I’m assuming that stands for Social Justice Warrior. Yes, it’s a boring, humorless job, but this is what my commie pinko overlords demand. We won’t rest until everyone thinks exactly the same! Or so my agenda has been explained to me.

          • barrixines

            You’re quite antagonistic aren’t you?

            I seem to remember I acknowledged in my first posts you had a point. You seem to think you have the only point. You don’t.

          • Toasterlad

            You’re quite thin-skinned, aren’t you?

            I seem to remember conceding that YOU made a fair point. You seem to think it’s appropriate to paint me as an unreasonable person who doesn’t listen to others. It is not.

          • barrixines

            I don’t really get into this sort of silly back and forthing- you make no bones about it that your intention is to bludgeon people into your way of thinking. I disagree with you – I can live with that. I suggest you do too.

          • Toasterlad

            You sure know a lot about me and my intentions!

            I can easily live with your disagreement, which you’ve generously shared with me at length. However, that won’t stop me from speaking out when I see people being intentionally or unintentionally cruel. I won’t lose much sleep over people who refuse to change, though. Not everyone’s cut out to be a decent human being. I accept that.

          • Schlukitz

            After just having read Toasterlad’s resonse of 9 minutes ago to you, I believe it is we who are pissing in the wind. 🙁

            He is getting all of the attention that he craves and I have no doubt that he will drag this thread into the wee hours of the morning if we continue to feed him.

          • barrixines

            Obviously I am a bit slow on the uptake but I see what you mean now.

          • Schlukitz

            That has been the thrust of Toasterlad’s comments…all afternoon and going on into the evening, I might add!

          • Schlukitz

            And most definitely, not calorie challenged. LOL

          • Schlukitz

            There! I told my mommy on you.

          • LovesIrony

            you don’t know what he needs You WANT to lecture him.

          • Toasterlad

            I WANT him to stop fat-shaming people. I KNOW that he NEEDS to be lectured, because he’s still doing it. Pretty simple.

          • Schlukitz

            Who appointed you moderator on this site?

          • LovesIrony

            That fat ugly bitch Maggie Gallagher

          • oikos

            I love you.

          • LovesIrony

            right back at cha, I’ve never been one for party dresses, I like to get dirty and when I fight I usually win, you don’t like the way I fight…. don’t fight with me. You fight with me I go all out

          • oikos

            Thank you. This is most ridiculous bunch of rants I’ve seen on this blog. You’d think I was putting puppies through a wood chipper from all the caterwauling.

          • LovesIrony

            It’s like we’re supposed to be courteous to those that want us killed: Toast: My you look lovely today Maggie, Loves Irony: You look like shit you fat piece of shit moogie.

          • oikos

            lol

          • Mark

            An old friend used to say: get off my skirt! I came here to dance!

          • oikos

            I’ve never heard that one before. 🙂

          • Schlukitz

            Round up the usual suspects. 😛

          • Mark

            come hither, my boy. I need some personal ‘training’!

          • Toasterlad

            What I’m doing is not moderating. What I’m doing is commenting. Like you.

          • Schlukitz

            Correction. You are lecturing.

          • Mark

            What you are doing is getting up on a soap box – and preaching way past the limit of making a point and going on and on just being an asshole. I think everybody here “gets it” – but that doesn’t seem to be enough for you. Are we to all bow down a beg your forgiveness, oh anointed one? And if your answer is yes, you’ve got issues bigger than anti- ‘fat shaming’ hero.

          • Toasterlad

            If you got it, you wouldn’t keep whining about it.

            I’ve told you what I want: for people to stop fat-shaming. If what YOU want is for me to shut up about it, that’s what you have to do.

          • Schlukitz

            “I’ve told you wnat I want.”

            Nero had wants.

            Napoleon had wants.

            Mussolini had wants.

            Hitler had wants.

            All fascist dictators have wants.

            You are a self-righteous little twat (there…I just gave you something else to climb up on a soapbox about) who thinks and acts just like a Christian, Muslim or Jew who believes that they have the right to tell everyone else how to think, what to do and how to act.

          • Schlukitz

            You really need to get off your self-righteous high horse.

            I am a man of some 78 years of age. For most of my life, my weight stayed pretty much at 135 lbs. with a waist measurement of 30-32 inches.

            I watched what I ate. I exercised. And I avoided gaining weight like the plague because I knew that it was the kiss of death as far as making out sexually was concerned.

            I am now retired and have reached the age where I could give a good fuck less whether I can still make out or not. A nice home cooked meal now holds more appeal for me than sitting around in some smoke-filled bar or club looking for some nookey.

            That said, I now weigh 210 pounds stripped and have a waistline of 38. I allowed that to happen…and I am perfectly ok with it. I take full responsibility for it and am not looking for any sympathy or special treatment as a result.

            As a person who could be called fat, obese, overweight, whatever, I do not have any need to get up on a soap box and look for sympathy or support for my girth.

            If someone makes fun of my present weight, that is their prerogative and if it bothers me that much, I have the choice of doing something about it.

            We all makes choices in life and sooner or later, we must accept responsibility for those choices. And I sure as shittin’ do not need the likes of you to defend my choice to become obese.

            So kindly fuck off.

          • LovesIrony

            In a battle for my rights I would much rather have you on my side than a kumbya singer

          • Schlukitz

            ;-0

          • Schlukitz

            Whose Fault Is It if You’re Fat?

            http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=123590

          • DaveW

            Or, you are wrong and can’t reason through the clear differences. Gay not choice. Fat choice. Not coming off as superior but clearly you feel that way. Enjoy the high while it lasts

          • Toasterlad

            Fat is not a choice for many people. More to the point, who cares if it is? Why does it make it okay for you to demean and belittle fat people just because they’re fat?

          • Schlukitz

            Many fat people belittle us for being gay. Maggie is only one of them.

            Gov. Chris Christie Proudly Discriminates Against Gay and Lesbian Couples.

            http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/chris-christie-gay-marriage/

            I wouldn’t exactly describe him as being svelte.

            People. Glass houses. Stones.

          • fuow

            Why the drive to turn us into sanitized little Nazis?
            I just refuse to do PC. If you don’t like oikos humour, don’t look at his work.

          • Toasterlad

            You’re flouting Godwin’s law even more aggressively than NOM is flouting Maine’s.

            I don’t give a fuck about PC. I give a fuck about being better than the people I’m fighting against, and it’s annoying to be surrounded by allies who clearly enjoy getting down in the sewer with them. If you don’t like MY work, feel free to ignore it.

          • oikos

            Take your own advice.

          • Toasterlad

            No, thanks.

          • pierre denerome

            “I don’t give a fuck.I give a fuck about being BETTER than …”.
            I’m out of negative words to describe you.
            Back to the dictionary? No,I’m heading back to Venice Beach.
            Have a sunny day sweet child.

          • Toasterlad

            You too!

          • Schlukitz

            “Flouting Godwin’s law?

            When might we expect your declaration that we are all sinners who are flouting God’s law and going straight to hell for being sinners?

          • zhera

            wtf, Schlukitz.
            You’re not usually this hyperbolic. What’s going on?

          • Schlukitz

            Hi there, zhera. Nice to hear from you as always.

            I truly do not believe that I am exaggerating. I just posted a reply to Sporkfighter a few minutes ago that I think will explain my feelings to you.

            Be well.

          • Schlukitz

            “I am passing this law against you because I am trying to make you see how much Gawd loves you if you’ll just stop doing what you are doing.”- Christian Right.

          • Toasterlad

            So to sum up: if you don’t think people should fat-shame other people, you’re an Evangelical Nazi who’s out to crucify people.

            Joe.My.God turned into Free Republic so gradually, I never even noticed!

          • Schlukitz

            Wow!

            And now you are attacking Joe Jervis as well because he allows free speech on his blog, unlike Free Republic who bans anyone with an opinion other than their approved orthodoxy?

            You’re just like the anti-gay Christians. You keep ratcheting-up the arguments and making baseless claims until your argument makes no sense whatsoever.

          • Toasterlad

            I’m sorry…I didn’t realize you weren’t a rational person. I won’t trouble you again.

          • Schlukitz

            If you are so fucking upset about a funny picture that oikos posted, then why are you not offended by Time For Pie cartoon about Brian Brown, which has been posted numerous times on JMG?

          • Schlukitz

            These two pieces of shit never stop shaming us.

            I don’t kiss the asses of people who hate me…and let it be know at every opportunity…and who work tirelessly to make sure that I remain a second class citizen..

            But, kiss away, if that is what makes you happy.

          • Toasterlad

            So, if I don’t call Maggie Gallagher a fat cow, I’m kissing her ass?

          • Schlukitz

            Give it a rest.

          • LovesIrony

            Yes, you’re kissing her big FAT ass

          • Toasterlad

            Well, you sure told me.

          • Mark

            You lost me at having a conversation with Mags and Bri-bri on an intellectual level.

          • DaveW

            Hilary’s looks are not fair. They are not a choice. Christies fat is a choice. Pretty obvious difference if you put a little thought into it

          • Toasterlad

            So if Shapiro or Limbaugh call Hillary a fat cow, you’re okay with that?

          • fuow

            Stand up to the PC-Nazis, oikos.
            Slaggie and Ms. Braunhemd are pigs.

          • oikos

            Yeah, I don’t really care if they don’t like it. Maggie and Brian have been dehumanizing a whole class of people for decades. They are fair game, not innocent private citizens.

        • fuow

          Oh, puhlease, Mary. Enough with the PC-Politessa routine.

          • Mark

            OK. who came in here and farted?

        • barrixines

          Didn’t Maggie use her piggery to disrupt Dustin Lance Black’s play about Prop 8by sitting in the gallery munching loudly on a bag of chips? She used her gluttony as an attack, sorry I think she’s fair game I do understand that you are coming from a good place but I feel this woman has forfeited the honour of us behaving like gentlemen towards her.

        • LovesIrony

          buy her a fucking pizza

          • Schlukitz

            Ahahaha….

            I snorted my coffee all over my screen with that one. LOL

        • Schlukitz

          Gluttony is one of the seven deadly sins.

          We should celebrate and support Maggie’s Gluttony?

          Get serious.

          • Mark

            I don’t know. Put on 50 pounds then hit the clubs and let us know how it turns out.

            FWIW – I am overweight. Notice that- – – over….weight. Of course there are the medical terms of obese, etc. So, which of them have zero shaming?

          • Schlukitz

            In my old age, I have balooned up to 210 lbs. LOL

            If i am not offended by Oikos’ posting, I don’t know why others on this thread should be?

          • Mark

            me neither. i laughed my butt off at it.

          • Schlukitz

            When I was still going to high school, Instead of doing my homework assignments, I spent much of my time in home room reading Laughter Is The Best Medicine in Reader’s Digest

            Here is a collection of jokes that many by todays PC standards would probably not pass muster.

            Enjoy.

            http://www.readersdigest.ca/fun/jokes/laughter-best-medicine/

        • DaveW

          People choose to be fat. We get accused of choosing our orientation, fat girl attacks us. We point out her choice vs our non choice. It fits. Fat is wrong, selfish and a. choice. Fair game, especially outside the equality issue. So many places fat intersects other issues. Like food stamps, being judgmental, carbon footprint , rude airplane neighbor etc.

          The PC thing doesn’t play with fat issue, since you control what you eat. Fat people that own it, admit they choose to be and don’t attack equality are great, but not all of them.

          Even Christie who tried surgery. As presidential candidate it matters. Health costs, longevity, lack of character, self control. His fatness shows he is not fit. We have to discuss it. He and Maggie choose to put themselves out there as examples of better people. We get to disagree. Not a PC issue!

        • Schlukitz

          No.

          We are just human beings who also belch, fart and whose shit stinks just like the haters. LOL

      • robirob

        I’ll attach the picture to my fridge and I’ll be thin in no-time.

        • oikos

          Careful, the PC police will accuse you of a crime.

      • tom dumptee

        jeeze,shes huge….what pier is she berthed at?

        • tom dumptee

          Is she still on the NY-Southampton run?

          • 2guysnamedjoe

            No, she got stuck in the Holland Tunnel. Literally.

          • Schlukitz

            Pfffffffffft.

            Using a squeegee to clear my computer screen of the iced tea that I snorted all over it.

          • tom dumptee

            ha ha ha,perfect!

      • Henri205

        I’ll never recover. But thanks for the laugh!!

        And release the names, I can’t wait to check THAT list.

  • MattM
  • TommyTune

    No more hiding in the dark for you, cockroaches. Heh!

  • ryan charisma

    RELEASE THE LIST

  • JT

    Finally we get to see all the tax exempt religiofascist groups behind this slimy organization.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Relax. All the cash is from Brian’s stepdad.

    • StraightGrandmother

      it is going to be mainly Sean Fieler.

      NOM Preemptively released the names of a few of their donors for the donors gave permission. That was a long time ago, maybe 3 years or so. What will be interesting to me is not the Catholic money but the Mormon money.

      Who is that Mormon Science Fiction writer, Scott something? Orb? We campaigned against his movie, remember that? He has sure shut the Hell up. All these actions are perfectly legitimate actions in a social justice campaign.

      You hold up and socially shame & shun the haters.

      • Shy Guy

        I believe you mean Orson Scott Card.

      • Octavio

        Orson Scott Card, one of the many POSs with whom I had the misfortune of attending BYU Academy. He is an icky boy. Icky, icky, icky, icky.

        • RoFaWh

          Care to enlighten the commentariat about the exact nature of Card’s ickiness?

          • Octavio

            He was one of those skinny, gawky kids that was always out of shape — with the requisite acne — who grew up to be tall, skinny gawky adult — still with the same acne — who espoused his testimony of the mormon church (which, as everyone knows is unquestionably gawd’s only one and true church restored in these latter days) who doesn’t change his magic underwear every day (imagine the smell) and could often be caught picking his nose unaware that other’s around him were repulsed. Need more?

      • JT

        Well, we’ll see. I suspect there are people and organizations not wanting the publicity, unlike the Fieler dealer.

  • shellback
    • abel

      Oh my God, that even LOOKS like Bri-Bri Brown.

  • Toasterlad

    I’m not taking any joy in this. It’s been six fucking years, and we still haven’t seen the names. How much longer is NOM going to be allowed to flout the law? Are they just going to be left alone to do whatever the fuck they want, until there’s not a person alive who cares about a hateful ballot initiative that was overturned years ago?

    I want those fucking names, and I want them now.

    • Chucktech

      Hey, this was the ruling of the Maine Supreme Court. They now have to fork over the names or hope that the big girl Supremes take up the case (right??). Or, of course, choose to go to jail. Frankly, I prefer the latter.

      • Todd20036

        Or they will appeal. Again. And again. They’ll try SCOTYS next

        • Todd20036

          Fuck it. I can’t type

        • Rand503

          Well, they can try, but SCOTUS will likely deny them cert. For SCOTUS to take up the appeal, there must be a federal law in question. From what I can see, Maine decided this on Maine law. Therefore, SCOTUS will take it it up.

          NOM will undoubtedly attempt to argue that federal law is implicated, like the 1st amendment or something, but it’s a stretch. They would need four justices to vote in favor of cert., and that is possible.

          • Dreaming Vertebrate

            *not* take it up.

          • David

            See my comment above. There’s no chance cert would be granted. However, technically, such a petition would not be frivolous because NOM is claiming that the Maine election commission acted arbitrarily and capriciously, which is a Due Process issue.

        • Chucktech

          I think SCOTUS would tell them to fuck off.

        • David

          I actually think they might petition for cert. But I can tell you that the chances of that being granted are zero. There’s no real federal question here. SCOTUS previously turned down their other constitutional attacks on Maine’s campaign finance law. However, NOM may petition for cert anyway because Brian Brown controls the legal entity that represents NOM. So the more pointless filings they make, the more NOM pays in legal fees to the Brian Brown-controlled entity. In any event, a petition for cert would only delay the inevitable by a few months.

      • Bj Lincoln

        No one will ever go to jail for this, even if they never turn over the list.

  • perry

    It’ll be the Morman Church or some division of it designed to minimize scrutiny, and the Knights of Columbus will be the Catholic Church’s avenue of giving.

    • Johnson

      I thought everyone already it was the Mormons and the Catholics.

    • Randolph Finder

      The words you are looking for in regards to the Mormons are “Corporation of the Presiding Bishopric” and “Intellectual Reserve, Inc”

  • Blake J Butler

    REVEAL!!! REVEAL!!! REVEAL!!!

    Poor bri bri, the looney toon with an evil smile, and an anal fixation has to follow the law and there’s nothing he can do.

    Excellent. (Mr. burns style).

  • TheManicMechanic

    Give them a week to comply, and when they don’t, toss the lot in jail.

    • Mike in Texas

      Along with a financial penalty assessed daily for each day of noncompliance.

  • Adam Schmidt

    See, now that’s the big issue with running a national organization… you’re subject to the laws of every jurisdiction you operate within. A good lawyer (of which you apparently have none) could have told you that there are jurisdictions with more stringent campaign finance laws which might cause you problems. But then you prefer to ignore things that you don’t like… whether it’s a passage in your Bible that you disagree with or find inconvenient, or science, or Constitutional law.

    And now it’s going to bite you in the ass… again.

  • Dreaming Vertebrate

    > > “It was unclear whether the National Organization for Marriage has any additional legal options to avoid disclosure of the list.”

    So, … is there any wiggle room left? Can NOM appeal this ruling or must they now comply?! Any legal eagles here?

  • William

    Could Brian end up with a life sentence for contempt of court?

    • Sporkfighter

      He doesn’t have a life, he has a miserable existence.

    • RoFaWh

      Regrettably, Brown himself is probably not in Maine’s crosshairs. Just NOM the organization, which he heads.

  • Joe in PA

    why the hell are the donors such cowards? You give to NOM…you own it fuckers.

    • Exactly, if your donating upwards of 6 figures to a cause you should be willing to be publically affiliated with that cause, the slimy nature of the money handling in religious right circles is just sickening.

  • D. J.

    Octopop’s deposition was a joke. A first grader would know NOM would lose and continue to lose this case.

  • Happy Dance

    Why is it OK to fund hate, cry about your rights to freedom of speech, but then you want to hide your identity? Stop being cowards? Come out and face us like the jerks you are!!

  • Todd Allis

    The longer they wait, the worse those donors will look. In 2009, a little embarrassing. After Obergefell? Shame, shame, shame.

  • Baltimatt

    NOM had a tweet this afternoon. Not about this, but a retweet of a link to a Ryan Anderson article in the Daily Signal

    http://dailysignal.com/2015/07/22/the-relationship-between-planned-parenthood-and-redefining-marriage/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=thffacebook

    Ryan, I don’t think you need to worry about too many same-sex couples having abortions.

  • Dreaming Vertebrate

    A Rainbow of Color Idioms
    Why is Brown too yellow to release the blacklist?
    Why are the lily-white donors who have pumped green into NOM’s black heart afraid to show their true colors? These shrinking violets need to be exposed to the full sunlight of day. No more red tape! The court has green-lighted the release of the donor list. If this leaves NOM in the red, so much the better. Time for the contemptuous Brown to wear prison orange.

  • Queequeg

    NOM has never complied before. If they don’t this time, they should put Brian Brown’s sorry ass in jail for contempt.

    • David

      They have never been ordered to disclose donors before. They have been fighting this same battle in Maine since 2009 and up until now have not been required to make the public disclosure. At one point, they were ordered to disclose names to the Maine elections commission, and they did so. They definitely will abide by the court’s order here.

      • Homo Erectus

        How come they don’t have to pay the legal fees for the prevailing party?

        • David

          In general, a private party doesn’t have to reimburse the state for its legal fees. If the state had lost, it very likely would have been required to pay NOM’s fees, but not the other way around. However, don’t feel too bad. NOM has spent a fortune on its own fees over the last 6 years. And for all that expense, it got stuck with a $50K penalty and it has to disclose anyway.

      • Bj Lincoln

        I’m glad you seem so sure. I am not.

      • Queequeg

        Good. About time we knew the names of the bigots who support NOM.

  • Alpha 50327

    It’s just going to say ‘Orson Scott Card’ over and over again. Then a list of various archdiocese. Who should then lose their tax exempt status.

    • Dreaming Vertebrate

      My guess is – it will include a few conservative business leaders, too. The type who are most vulnerable to boycotts and social activism.

  • jomicur

    Persecution! Oh God, when will it ever end! (Hee hee hee)

  • Sporkfighter

    Brian’s going to fill his briefs again . . .

    • Bryan

      Oops!

  • JaniceInToronto

    They’ll come up with another way to block revealing the list. This isn’t over yet. It could be years before we see the list. Maybe they could use “Religious Freedom”. That one seems to be used a lot. What cretins.

    • 2guysnamedjoe

      They’ll try to drag it out for a few more years, at which point the only ones still interested will be a handful of JMG readers with long memories.

  • Ninja0980

    Time to release the names.
    If these people want to support hate, they shouldn’t be able to hide who they are.

  • matt n

    the bulk of the money came from a handful of donors. people like tom monaghan of domino’s pizza. it wold be interesting to see if scalia’s name appeared.

    • D. J.

      I will be very surprised if his name isn’t on their list.

      • matt n

        that would look very bad for him as he was deciding obergefell

        • B Snow

          That would be sweet, though — it would shut up everyone who said RBG and Sotomayor should recuse for marrying same sex couples.

    • 2guysnamedjoe

      I expect to see several archbishops on the list.

  • D. J.

    Will the list be a who’s who of convicted Duggarers? Rhetorical question.

  • David

    Wow! I’ve been following this but I did NOT expect a ruling so soon. Apparently, this is not the final ruling but a denial of a stay of the lower court order requiring disclosure. So essentially, the ME Supreme Court is telling NOM that it is going to lose on the merits, so it can just go ahead and disclose now.

    This is a really big win. This will be disclosure of the 2009 donors and those donors are very likely to be the same 10 very large donors who fund NOM in 2010-2015. There may be some who dropped off, but it is highly unlikely that there would be any mega-donors who joined after 2009.

    BTW, this would not have happened without Fred Karger – on his own – filing a complaint against NOM in 2009. HRC didn’t do it. The so-called Task Force didn’t do it. Not even the local group in Maine did it. Fred did it. All the way from California. Proving once again that one person with a thinking mind and a willingness to act can make a huge difference.

  • noni

    From the link to the article:

    The organization has already paid the $50,250 fine and registered as a ballot question committee “under protest,” according to Maine Ethics Commission Executive Director Jonathan Wayne, but has so far not revealed its donors. Wayne said that list would be published on the commission’s website when it is received.

    Vanderhulst said there are no other legal avenues to appeal the issue of the stay.

    • Homo Erectus

      What, No interest due?

      • Tom G

        Likely paid it long ago and awaited possible refund

  • David

    The other really neat thing about this is that it will seriously enrage the donors. Remember, NOM marketed itself as a vehicle through which these donors could funnel money into marriage ballot campaigns without being exposed. These donors relied on NOM’s assurances and now they are going to get burned. This is on top of NOM’s spectacular failure at the ballot box in 2012, in the state legislatures in 2013, and in generating grass-roots resistance to the federal courts in 2014-15. Why would any big donor would want to continue funding these people? Even if you wanted to keep up the fight against gay marriage, why would you stick with these losers?

    • noni

      The donors have been recast as Persecuted Christians now, so they have shed their bigot image.

      Or so they believe. Their delusion is endless.

      But when you believe in an imaginary sky daddy to begin with, delusion is endless.

  • noni

    I recently tried to search for other lists of homophobes that use to be readily on the internet like Who signed it? and Know thy neighbor, but those don’t appear to be available anymore. Bigot names should remain on the Internet for eternity.

    • Tom G

      You can’t find the prop 8 donor list ? I’ll have to look. I know I’ve saved it somewhere

  • Bill T.

    OK, so Brian not only looses the case, but he has to pay the $50,000 fine, and court costs, and whatever legal fees his lawyers are charging him. It’s gonna be ground turkey meatloaf at the Brown clan dinner table for the foreseeable future. Hee Hee Hee.

  • anne marie in philly

    bwhahahahahahahaha! sux to be you, bri-bri!

  • Homo Erectus

    2015 is shaping up to be a great year to be gay 😉

  • Bj Lincoln

    We are NEVER going to find out. BB needs arrested and all their records from the beginning should be confiscated and published but it is all a dream. NOM will keep finding shit to block it and this will keep on going like the fucking energizer bunny.

    • RoFaWh

      If by any chance NOM goes tits-up and the sherriff auctions off all their “stuff”, the computers will be especially valuable. Think of all the incriminating emails on them!

  • “It was unclear whether the National Organization for Marriage has any additional legal options to avoid disclosure of the list.”

    They could always move to Uganda and stay out of US politics..