HomoQuotable – Andrew Sullivan

“I never believed this would happen in my lifetime when I wrote my first several TNR essays and then my book, Virtually Normal, and then the anthology and the hundreds and hundreds of talks and lectures and talk-shows and call-ins and blog-posts and articles in the 1990s and 2000s. I thought the book, at least, would be something I would have to leave behind me – secure in the knowledge that its arguments were, in fact, logically irrefutable, and would endure past my own death, at least somewhere. I never for a millisecond thought I would live to be married myself. Or that it would be possible for everyone, everyone in America. But it has come to pass. All of it. In one fell, final swoop. Know hope.” – Andrew Sullivan, returning to his blog to spike the ball.

  • ChitownKev

    Oh dear, she is SUCH a sleaze but credit where credit is due and Andrew put it out there in a very very big way.

    I guess that she can go back to full-fledged Clinton hate, propping up racists like Charles Murray and what not…

    • another_steve

      Lol. Love that, Kev.

      Girl is a terrible mess of ego and internal conflict, but every really good Saturday night party requires the entire gamut of human messed-up-ness, so we should welcome all to the table.

      (I don’t like those glasses — do you?)

      • HAAAAAAA

        (I don’t like those glasses — do you?)

        No

  • Cousin Bleh

    I, I, I, I, me, my, I, I, I.

    • DaveDocSC

      That is the concise analysis of AS that I have ever seen. This is perfection!

  • Lumpy Gaga

    Girl droppin’ her OWN name.

    • Gustav2

      Wait, it’s worse…reopening her defunct blog to drop her OWN name.

      • And describe the court’s action as “fell.”

  • Elmo Buzz

    Yes, it happened in spite of all the prayers for God to grab the hands of the Supreme Court justices and force them to write an opinion against equal treatment for gay people. It happened in spite of their hateful comments and speeches. It happened in spite of their prayers. It happened in spite of their fasting.

    I have often heard Christians say that God answers all prayers, he just sometimes says, “No.”

    I wonder why they cannot accept his answer?

    • David Walker

      Because they’ve been so devout and so faithful in following their leaders and sending them money and fasting and yelling and screaming and earnestly trying not learn anything and, being told they’re ignorant, believing whatever they’re spoon fed. Plus the hate mongers in charge will now have to deal with a diminishing money supply.

      Maybe the most horrifying and enlightening scene in “Southern Baptist Sissies” has the boy who ultimately commits suicide (it’s a plot point early on, so I’m not spoiling it) praying feverishly to god to change him. And god doesn’t, so he knows god hates him and wants him to die. As Del Shores has another character say, “(Church) is where we learned to hate ourselves.”

      • LonelyLiberal

        There’s always a hesitancy to change anything you’ve invested time (and resources) in. One becomes resistant to the idea that it doesn’t work because, otherwise, you’ve just wasted a lot of time, money, and effort.

        We call that “beating a dead horse.” It doesn’t do any good, but doesn’t annoy the horse, either.

        These people don’t do any good, and annoy the horse (us), who isn’t dead yet and, from the looks of things, are in better shape than they are.

    • Steverino

      Because they have recreated God in their own image. Malignant narcissism is like that.

  • Toasterlad

    I’m sure the conservatives appreciate your years of playing apologist for their homophobia, Andrew.

    Why don’t you take a seat over there in the corner with the LCR? We’ll send over some cake in a little bit.

    • oikos

      lol

  • Judas Peckerwood

    Take a bow then crawl back under your rock, Sully.

  • cee

    I’d rather read Ted Cruz’s opinion than this self-hating fag.

    • Reality.Bites

      Hey be fair – he’s got good reason to be self-hating!

  • Lakeview Bob

    Sullivan is pro gay and anti everything else progressive. Hate him.

    • jizabel

      He’s only pro-gay as far as he is pro-Andrew Sullivan.

      • Lumpy Gaga

        .. who just HAPPENS to be gay. .

    • Blake Jordan

      The only gay he cares about is himself.

      • bambinoitaliano

        and those New York Hoteliers.

      • carswell

        Truer words were never spoken.

    • LovesIrony

      he is a pro at throwing gays under buses

      • Reality.Bites

        Chauffeured limos, please.

      • Steverino

        Especially those in San Francisco.

  • geoffalnutt

    I’m not very interested in how he thought ‘it would never happen’. He certainly behaved that way. He was never really our ally and shouldn’t expect to suddenly be one now.

  • Ray

    Thanks Andrew.

  • romanhans

    Well, *I* never knew it would happen when I posted a particularly smart JMG comment and then tweeted saying Clarence Thomas was a jerk.

  • LonelyLiberal

    I don’t like him in the slightest, but today I’m not allowing him to get on my nerves.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Not TODAY, Sullivan!

    • Gene

      oh my gawd…I am a financially conservative, pro monarchist (for the British) traditionalist in so many ways…and I just wish this self absorbed tory BITCH would just stop masturbating at his own FUCKING image in the mirror and SHUT THE FUCK UP. jesus…its the GREAT LOVE AFFAIR of our age…Andrew Sullivan and HIMSELF….Gag, vomit, puke…ooouuuuu…

  • jomicur

    If only Mr. SuperMaxGlutes were right about something else once in a while–anything else.

  • Bruno

    Um, this is the same guy who said he didn’t want marriage equality through “judicial fiat.” Now he’s celebrating the judicial fiat. Typical Sullivan.

    • Octavio

      Agreed. He’s like a debutante settling for a different posh frock, “Well, it is pretty . . . but it isn’t silk organza.” Aye, me.”

    • Cuberly

      He actually had a change of heart on that mid 2013. He said he realized the current GOP under the thrall of the christianists wasn’t going to let it happen. So he said while he’d prefer it not be through the courts, he’d take it this way too.

      BTW-not defending him just filling in some of the details.

      • Bruno

        It’s kind of like what’s mentioned by other commenters on this post…he held a lot of opinions and positions that were actually detrimental to the LGBT community before seeing the light. I don’t have a huge problem with him as others do, but I’m not sure I’ve seen any apologies either. And there can be no question that he’s his own #1 fan. The ego has yet to land.

        • Cuberly

          First to admit that at times, he has written some very well considered pieces. And, when I saw a debate between him and Mags, he won without question. But when he’s wrong, he’s really really wrong, and he gets mean about it.

          I threw in the towel with him after he blatantly misrepresented queer activist involvement in the Eich debacle. He gave a tepid apology, then proceeded to continue the same lies on multiple networks on multiple programs. It was repulsive. But like you said, ego. He just can’t pass up a chance to be in the limelight.

          I used to give him more of a pass, not so much anymore. I just roll my eyes whenever he appears.

          • Steverino

            I quit reading him altogether when he blamed the success of Proposition 8 on Gavin Newsom. That sentiment was so many layers of silliness and stupidity, that I became done with him for good.

          • Cuberly

            Totally forgot that. Ugh, ideological jackass. I think I can count the number of times he acknowledged lgbt activism in a positive light on one hand.

            I have to admit though, his aggregated coverage during the Iranian Spring protests was superb. It was riveting, the real-time updates as it unfolded. He and his crew did an amazing job, even eclipsing standard cable news coverage. That was when I went back to reading him actually. Shortly afterwards he softened a lot of his more idiotic rhetoric, and I read him regularly. But, like I said before, when he threw activists under the bus in such a callous and opportunistic way, basically returning to form, damn I was pissed.

          • Steverino

            Yes, I used to enjoy reading his insights into some issues, but his ideology often got in the way and blinkered him in ways that at those times, made him come across as a hypocritical, bigoted tool. I won’t go so far as to say “stopped clock, and all that,” but he often comes close. People who think like him are why I hate ideology of any stripe. Being an open-minded, fact-based, critical thinker, is best.

            I far prefer JMG, since most all of us can “agree to disagree,” pretty much all of the time.

          • Cuberly

            I remember an interview he did where he went on a long, and I do mean LONG rant lamenting the fact that Americans lacked an English sense of drawing room discourse. That oh so tweed wearing pipe smoking salon where ideas could be exchanged and debated ad nauseam. And, nothing would be taken personally nor viscerally. Regardless of the vehemence of the discourse.

            I’ve never mentioned this but I knew someone what was at Oxford the same year Sully was. And, Sully, coming from a working class background, made it plain that he was boning for aristocratic climes. And, he made it, to a qualified degree, but he made it by agreeing wholeheartedly with a far-right aristocratic clique. He’d pretty much wear the tweed and smoke the pipe in the salons, and go figure, he was never embraced by the titled ones. And then he discovered the US of A. Where station didn’t matter (as much), yet he still wanted to be among the ones that mattered through default status. Sully is aristocracy through aspiration with a lineage he flaunts when he can cast it as a badge of common-man honor.

            And, to be honest I don’t like lording an individuals history over them. So much should be shrugged off, dismissed, eye-rolled at. My Oxford friend hated Sullivan primarily because he knew Sully was gay and Sully knew my friend was gay, but nothing could get in the way of Sully’s status mania.

            I tend to think that conflict and hardship, real, or observed, can yield better understanding. My primary problem with Sully is he uses hardship, real or observed as a tool in his tool kit. If it can work for a certain situation or diatribe, he’d use it.

            Empathy addled.

      • 2karmanot

        “he’d take it this way too.” Preferably behind closed doors.

  • Reality.Bites

    If anything could make me regret this SCOTUS decision, it’s the thought of giving pleasure to Andrew Sullivan.

    • Ray

      Why wouldn’t you want today to be satisfying to Sullivan? It’s his day, too, and he did work toward this end for three decades.

      • Reality.Bites

        No, he really didn’t. No one who tried to elect Republicans did.

      • hdtex

        It’s most decidedly NOT his day.

      • BobSF_94117

        Sullivan’s book, Virtually Normal, came out in 1995. It distilled, supposedly for a conservative audience, the idea that gay people are NORMAL, an idea that some liberals had been arguing for DECADES before him.

        I’m glad he wrote his book. I’m glad people read it, encouraged by his conservatism, but the ideas were not new.

        • aschops

          He also published a gay marriage tract in 1989 – the idea was pretty much new, then.

          It’s OK to hate his guts, but that would be a more respectful position if people didn’t lie or omit stuff about him to justify their hatred.

          • BobSF_94117

            It was not new, god damn it. We have been fighting for equality for FIVE FUCKING DECADES. Not “equality except marriage”.

            I’m sorry Sullivan was on the East coast and chose to argue with whatever “intellectuals” opposed assimilation and heteronormativity. I’m sure it kept him, and them, amused and employed, spitting nasties at each other, while other people did the hard work.

          • BobSF_94117

            I mentioned his book, not to deprive him of a meaningless jump of six years against a five-decades struggle, but because he talks about it all the time as though its publication were some watershed moment in gay rights history.

          • Ray

            Oh, I don’t know Bob. In 1984 when I wrote my first published essay in favor of marriage equality, it was in opposition to the so-called “leadership” of the gay rights movement who bitched on the pages of The Advocate about the silly idea of anyone wanting to be part of an institution. In other words, the Left didn’t take the idea seriously until writers like Sullivan and Jonathan Rauch wrote serious arguments in favor of marriage. And they wrote those view in the context of how virtually all Americans perceived marriage at the time – a the most stabilizing social institution in this country. It was an argument put forward most effectively by Andrew Sullivan and, honestly, you can’t arrive at the day in which the majority opinion in favor of marriage virtually quotes Andrew and then revise history and say Sullivan is some kind of detriment to the cause of equality. That would be a lie if you did so.

          • Chuck in NYC

            I think there’s a lot of credit to be given to writers. But come on — a LOT of credit is due to people taking actions that weren’t necessarily recorded in the same way as a book or an essay. It isn’t just the intellectuals who’ve carved out these victories — it’s a gay volleyball team playing a police team and word getting out about that to all the policemens’ friends and families; it’s the lesbian couple adopting children no one else wanted and raising them in a loving way whose classmates and parents see everything’s turning out all right there; it’s the tourists in a city crossing the street unaware they’re approaching a Pride parade and seeing it’s a fun, festive event; and on and on. Writers deserve a lot of credit, but arguably not even most of it.

          • GarySFBCN

            My friend Sandy, who was one of the prop 8 defendants, sacrificed a good part of her life to see that case through to the final decision.

            Sullivan sacrificed nothing, nor did he push the argument along.

          • GarySFBCN

            And guess what? It would have been MUCH better for all LGBTs if ENDA had been the focus and not marriage equality. Don’t get me wrong – I’m happy with today’s decision.

            But the problem with the early marriage advocacy is much of it was assimilation nonsense, generated by people, including Andrew Sullivan, who were/continue to be embarrassed by being associated with people not like him and his need for validation that comes from ‘fitting-in’ with society.

          • Cuberly

            But look at Andrew’s lingering influence and how it transformed the National Review…oh, um….never mind.

          • Steverino

            Yes, the assimilation point in your second paragraph, that is an important distinction in understanding Andrew “Bell Curve” Sullivan’s motivation back then.

            Now, we have to deal with the absence of ENDA and the “religious freedom” bullshit.

          • BobSF_94117

            Point me to that Advocate article that said we would never want the equal rights of marriage.

            And, while you’re at it, explain why liberal gay people in California were making progress on Domestic Partnerships beginning in 1979, well before the impact of AIDS on gay couples brought legal rights to the fore and way before Andrew Sullivan even arrived in the U.S.

            Sullivan had the advantage of one hell of a pulpit and he used it to argue for conservatism and for conservatism as the road to our equality. We’ve now reached the kind of equality he had in mind: one at the mercy of the religious whims of the people we have to deal with on a daily basis.

            It’s not the kind of equality I’ve fought for since when Andrew was still in grade school.

          • ultragreen

            I would like to clarify the leftist view on marriage, which is often regarded as another conservative bourgeois institution, and its relationship to existing in a society with marriage equality.

            A distinction has to be made between “personally looking down on the institution of marriage” vs. “wanting equal access to marriage in society regardless of one’s personal views on the institution of marriage.” Just because someone looks down on the institution of marriage doesn’t necessary mean that he or she is against equal access to marriage.

            To use an example, a person may look down on cigarette smoking as an unhealthy vice he or she doesn’t want to engage in, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that the same person is in favor of making cigarette smoking illegal for the whole or any portion of society. Thus, the conclusion that you are attempting to make doesn’t necessarily follow from its premises.

          • BobSF_94117

            I don’t hate him, but he annoys the crap out of me because he ignores all the work liberals did before him, HARD work.

            And I seriously hate his position on anti-discrimination law and on religious exemptions. I had hoped to leave this planet in a couple decades as a fully equal citizen of this country. Sullivan has made, and continues to make, that ultimate outcome unlikely.

          • Bruno

            It wasn’t pretty much new (Baker vs. Nelson 1971?), it was just not written about in Sullivan’s circles much or at all. So credit him for that, but he certainly didn’t invent the idea of marriage equality.

          • Rob NYNY

            Yes, but he wrote “A Place at the Table,” declaring that monogamy was the only ethical model for gay relationships at a time when he was HIV+ and trolling the internet for unprotected sex.

          • jerrelt

            A place at the table was written by bru’ve bawer.

        • Octavio

          Nor his original ideas.

        • Ray

          It distilled? That would explain why, in the Prop 8 trial, Sullivan and his book were discussed. I think must have the wrong Sullivan.

          • BobSF_94117

            Of course it distilled. You’re not going to tell me that Andrew Sullivan invented the idea of same-sex marriage or presented some argument that had never been made before.

            Who discussed it? There’s this whole conservative cabal organized to make Andrew Sullivan the Gay Messiah. From Sullivan himself to Brooks to Rauch to Dreher and back around to Sullivan himself.

          • ultragreen

            Some protestant churches (e.g., MCC) have been performing gay marriages since the 1960s. Thus, the idea of marriage equality is MUCH older than Sullivan.

      • LovesIrony

        supporting those that would deny us equality is not supportive of us but gave them cover and the ability to claim they have gay friends

  • Ragnar Lothbrok

    Hi Andrew !! Haven’t heard from you for a while.
    Let’s keep it that way.

    • LonelyLiberal

      Chortle.

      • Soren456

        Eugene heard that.

      • David Walker

        Andrew who?

    • Webslinger

      check check check on the microphone

      • People4Humanity

        Gotta love Brian!

        • Webslinger

          oh I do….

  • Blake Jordan

    I thought* he was dead…

    • Lumpy Gaga

      You mistook him for some of Brian Brown’s cardiac tissue.

  • Robert

    to all you haters, andrew and evan wolfson were among the first to articulate the arguments for same sex marriage, and were ridiculed by many in the community when they did so. so go ahead and hate. but you all did jump on the bandwagon and benefitted from their work.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      Dude, I’ve got a docu on my Comcast DVR RIGHT NOW about 2 guys who married in 1975 and ended up a couple without a country.

      Get over it.

      • J̶a̶l̶a̶p̶e̶ñJoe Smithson

        Beat me to that. I recall that as well.

    • Blake Jordan

      So he may have helped with one important issue, but it does not make us forget about the rest of his opinions and actions.

    • J̶a̶l̶a̶p̶e̶ñJoe Smithson

      Too bad he fucked all that up by becoming an asshole, in more ways than one. What has he done for us lately?

      http://gph.is/1LAONPE

    • BobSF_94117

      I get so sick and tired of the assertion that Andrew Sullivan was among the first.

      You know who was among the first? Baker. Baker was among the first, two decades before Sullivan.

      • Robert

        doesn’t matter if you’re tired of the assertion. it still remains a fact.

        • RobNYNY1957

          While he was trying to butt fuck HIV- men without disclosing his HIV+ status. I can do without advocates like that.

      • Reality.Bites

        And Manitoba’s Chris Vogel and Richard North, who legally sought marriage in 1974 – and won the right in 2004.

        (and in typical Canadian fashion, didn’t get married but stayed common law)

    • bryan

      You mean, when he wasn’t busy worshipping Margaret Thatcher ? How kind of him.

      • Robert

        you’re free to dislike Sullivan for any and every reason you want. it doesn’t change the huge contribution he made to struggle for SSM. one contributor among many for sure, but a very important contributor who helped lay the intellectual foundation for the arguments used to win the case.

        • Gustav2
        • bryan

          I do not dislike him for any reason, but for very specific reasons.. If you’re supporting an anti gay tyrant like Thatcher, you are doing nothing for gay rights. Equally his bitchy sniping at Olson and Boies was vile. If you want to admire a man in the UK who worked tirelessly for gay marriage over the years… look to Peter Tatchell.

          • Robert

            again, you can dislike Sullivan for any and all reasons you like, but to say he was “doing nothing for gay rights” is pure BS. he did a lot.

          • 2karmanot

            Brown nose is one thing but brown face is quite amazing.

          • RobNYNY1957

            His vile, homophobic articles are still in the TNR archives. Go read them.

        • 2karmanot

          “who helped lay the intellectual foundation” Sullivan? Seriously” intellectual? ROTFL

    • 2karmanot

      So wrong in so many ways Mary Stockholm Syndrome.

      • Robert

        poor dear. when you have no ability to articulate an argument you hurl names.

    • Hue-Man

      Robert, “Victory has a thousand fathers…” (JFK, BTW)

      I’ll be magnanimous and agree with you that Andrew is entitled to a victory lap; his writings about marriage equality were extremely fringe at a time when he was writing for and was subsequently editor of The New Republic. I don’t know how many Republican hearts and minds he changed but Wolfson and he analyzed the issue and gave it (almost) mainstream visibility.

      Contrary to the commenters here, Sullivan does not take credit for marriage equality’s win today – I see him more like Peter Higgs who theorized and wrote about a fundamental particle that wasn’t actually discovered until 50 years later. Over those 5 decades, Higgs refined his thinking, wrote and spoke about his theory, and worked collaboratively with other scientists. The workers at CERN did the heavy lifting to “discover” the Higgs Boson.

      Ditto Sullivan – other people made marriage equality a reality.

      • Robert

        i agree with you 100%. his was one of many voices, but as you say, Sullivan’s views about marriage equality were fringe back in TNR days. and by articulating them over and over he (again, among other) helped them become more mainstream. that’s all I’m saying. i remember many people in the community screaming that marriage was a waste of time, that there were other priorities. in fact, a fb friend was still grousing yesterday about how gay marriage was going backwards into patriarchal anachronism…. oy… So my only point was that whatever else you say about AS, you can’t deny his role in SSM and how he helped make the idea mainstream.

  • J̶a̶l̶a̶p̶e̶ñJoe Smithson
    • Lumpy Gaga

      SupercalifragilisticexBITCHalidocious.

      • J̶a̶l̶a̶p̶e̶ñJoe Smithson

        oh my I might have to steal that

        • Octavio

          If you say it fast enough you may get halitosis.

    • 2karmanot

      Indeed…hope he gets the golf clap!

  • Jake

    Can’t even celebrate without self-promotion

  • BobSF_94117

    Next up, arguments for “religious liberty” exemptions from Mr. Sullivan…

  • Randy Ellicott

    Cant we revoke his gay card? Really? I mean he is so important in his mind that its about his book and how he save the gays…. Its a happy day, and i guess we have to deal with a-holes just like any other group…

  • What?

    You know what? Today is a victory for all gays and straights. It’s a victory for marriage, period. I’m glad that Sullivan was there in the early days (although Evan Wolfson is arguably more important at that time if not so high-profile). If he wants to say how amazing he is, fine, let him. Today belongs to everyone. We are all part of this.

  • pickypecker

    just this. that’s all. Have a great day, Andrew.
    https://kimbroughwriter.files.wordpress.com/2015/05/eye-roll-in-motion-3.gif

  • TommyTune

    I wondered how long it would take him to crawl out from under his rock and say something. Now I know.

  • countervail

    Well he the fuck surely didn’t help along the way. Thanks for nothing mother fucker.

    • TrollopeReader

      Please explain what you did to “help” along the way?

      • countervail

        Maybe my 15 year, monogamous relationship was a shining example? In other news, go fuck yourself. 🙂

  • David F.
  • Blake Jordan

    So this is what it sounds like when a man is blowing himself…

    • Lumpy Gaga

      But he has to keep one hand free for clapping.

  • jerrelt

    For one day, on this historic day, let us all share in the joy and celebrate together whatever our differences…and not attack each other.

    • Lumpy Gaga

      We’re not attacking each other. We’re attacking Sullivan.

  • HAAAAAAA

    No No…..

    • oikos

      Stealing graphic-love!

      • pickypecker

        Ditto that, oikos! good stuff!

      • HAAAAAAA

        And that from the Master…… Today is a good day

        • BrianQTD

          Who is this guy? He’s hot.

          • ChitownKev

            The Old Spice guy, right?

          • HAAAAAAA

            The Old Spice guy…

            I bet you want to see him on his way to the shower….

        • JulieBL

          Ohhh he’s the hotness!!

    • Charles Manuel P.

      Oh come on….why?

      • HAAAAAAA

        Why

        How much time have got…….

        • Charles Manuel P.

          I think quite a lot. No more classes for the day : )

    • Strepsi

      Jesus, I’m gif-notized!

      • People4Humanity

        Ha ha ha ha. You want it.

  • J̶a̶l̶a̶p̶e̶ñJoe Smithson

    OT, but BO is burning it down giving the eulogy at Sen Pinckney’s funeral. Now he’s spontaneously singing Amazing Grace and the crowd was stunned, but they joined in. In other news BO can’t carry a tune in a bucket but he is on fire. Between the eulogy and the SCOTUS ruling, I’m a blubbering mess today.

    • Giant Monster Gamera

      If today’s decision didn’t do it, that eulogy is doing to unleash the derpocalypse.

  • John Ruff

    Fuck him and the bullshit he road in on.

  • hdtex

    In other Andrew Sullivan news……

    • teeveedub

      … Andrew takes credit for women’s suffrage, the Emancipation Proclamation, and the end of World War II.

      • Daniel

        Also, he invented the internet.

        • Reality.Bites

          Him and Al Gore, in a bipartisan project

        • Steverino

          And milky loads.

    • ScottJL

      Sorry, there is no news other than Andrew Sullivan, according to Andrew Sullivan.

  • teeveedub

    Really, Andrew? Are you really attempting to take credit for today’s decision? After years of supporting politicians who would do anything in their power to deny LGBT people their equality? How dare you!

    • timpundit

      No I don’t see where he is trying to take credit.

  • Steven Leahy

    This vile POS can go fuck off

    • oikos

      I really detest this POS more than the pseudo religious bigots like PerKKKins because he spent his years rimming those that relegated us to second class citizen status.

      • Reality.Bites

        Better him than me!

        • Octavio

          Oooofta!

  • bambinoitaliano

    I recorded Panti Bliss last night in Toronto if anyone interested.
    Don’t mind the video but the audio is good.
    https://youtu.be/u9i8PgdcExw

    • gaymex

      Thanks…that was an inspiring talk. Damn, Panti is a good speakeer.

  • ScottJL

    Can he go away now?

  • bkmn

    At least he is still a myopic fool.

  • oikos

    Enjoy these rights, Andrew. They were hard fought for by others whilst you were still cheerleading conservatism.

    • Sk3ptic

      And warning that activism was the wrong way to achieve true equality.
      Get off everyone else’s shoulders, carpetbagger Sully!

    • wc1e

      Not really. He was one of the first arguing for Marriage Equality.

      • oikos

        He was cheerleading for the very people that sought to deny us rights for so long. Kinda of like arguing against slavery while supporting Jefferson Davis as President.

        • You mean he didn’t support the president who brought us DOMA and DADT?

          • oikos

            I don’t seem to remember Clinton not acknowledging the Aids epidemic or blocking action on it and he has apologized for DOMA and DADT. Have the conservatives that Sullivan supports apologized for all of the hate against gay people?

          • Just as I forgive Bill Clinton for his direct anti-gay acts, I forgive Sullivan for his indirect anti-gay acts.

          • oikos

            Not me. Sullivan is still a tool. Have a great weekend.

    • TrollopeReader

      “These rights” owe a lot to Andrew.

      • oikos

        In what way?

        • dain42

          1989: http://www.newrepublic.com/article/79054/here-comes-the-groom

          1995: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtually_Normal

          I mean most of the early vocal advocacy for equality was from Sullivan. After he published his piece in 1989, Evan Wolfson, who had previously written a dissertation got in touch with him, as well, and both men have been very important to the fight over the years.

          They didn’t invent it. They didn’t do it alone. But I hardly see how it’s right that we should deny them credit or recognition for the important part that they played in this.

          Getting a front page story published in one of the major American journals of opinion was incredibly important, even if that were the only thing he’d done, but he has campaigned and argued and worked just as tirelessly as many other people to see this day come.

          • oikos

            I suggest you read the rest of the comments on this page. Claiming you are for gay rights while supporting the people and the agenda that oppose those same rights doesn’t put you in the forefront of the movement.

          • 2karmanot

            ROTFL

  • davidgc

    Make sure you shill that book and pump up your already overinflated ego while you celebrate with us little folk, Andrew. p.s.: I’ve never liked you enough to read much of the crap you write.

  • oikos
    • LonelyLiberal

      Sully has better legs than I would have imagined.

      • oikos

        LOL

      • 2karmanot

        And I always thought he wore a size 5 pump.

        • Steverino

          And a size 16 dress.

  • gaymex

    Andrew, Andrew, Andrew…Please. Those of us who lived openly gay lives whether single or as couples should get just a bit of credit for this ruling. Family, friends, neighbors, fellow employees–they began to see us as “normal”. We didn’t support right-wingers who would throw us under the bus–you did. I will grant you some credit, but do you really have to come on so strong and pretend that our joy today rests on your shoulders.. Please, there are untold thousands of us who fought the battle each and every day…try a little humility.

    • David Walker

      “Who is she? Who was she? Who does she hope to be?” Boys in the Band.

      • gaymex

        Great line…and so apropos.

    • BlueberriesForMe

      ” ‘Humility’? What is this word you are speaking of? I am the great and powerful A.S. I am a wizard in my own mind. I have a VERY large and attractive ego.
      I have many followers. I had a blog once. It was mine.”

      • gaymex

        lol. I think that sums it up very nicely. Thanks.

  • oikos
  • Octavio

    He’s married? Obviously everyone can find someone to love. Good for him. However, it’s amazing how well I’ve got on in life without reading any of his books or taking any of his scribblings seriously. So many others have contributed so much more to LGBT rights and causes with much more grace and humility. “My book, my anthology, my many many talks and lectures.” From my years on this spinning rock his contributions to the LGBT community do not register a blip in gay history or equal rights. Andy, you’re not as erudite a political lion in the world of sexual politics as you obviously believe you are. Calmate, chico. Hay otros en el mundo.

    • Reality.Bites

      Well not everyone. Maggie couldn’t.

      • brian

        Speaking of which, I have but one thing to say to her. “Maggie, you are most definitely correct, winning is fun”.

    • TrollopeReader

      I think you and I agree on a lot of things, but on this i’m sad to say you are incorrect.

      • Octavio

        That’s OK. We shall boldly carry on.

      • 2karmanot

        Back of hand to forehead in utta dismay

  • Reality.Bites
    • LonelyLiberal

      If that’s what a Shameful Dawn looks like, I need more shame in my life.

      • Reality.Bites

        Oh honey, you already know me. Your life couldn’t possibly be more shameful!

        • LonelyLiberal

          We haven’t slept together, so yes, it could be. 🙂

      • Chuck in NYC

        You take Shame. I’ll take Dawn.

      • Steverino

        I prefer a shameful dusk, thank you.

        • LonelyLiberal

          Dawn, dusk, night, knight, it’s all the same. 🙂

  • PhilDavisNYC

    The usual narcissism.

  • gaylib

    Leave it to Sullivan to make it all about him.

  • 2karmanot

    Can I slap huh now?

  • JerzLaw

    The way Sully just posted, you would think the case before SCOTUS was called Sullivan v. Hodges. I imagine that in Andrew’s mind Obergefell was just some interloper piggybacking on Sullivan’s vast achievements and who is now getting all the glory that is rightfully Sullivan’s.

  • bJason

    “In all of my me-ing about myself, I would never have told me that I might be me, myself, and I!

  • davidgc

    Wow! Just wow! …taking credit for the whole thing. “That man’s got balls as big as church bells.”

  • brian

    Dearest Andrew, it’s been a long hard fought battle. Sorry but I’m outta fucks to give. Especially to you. Sincerely, B.

  • timpundit

    I was waiting for him to write something, I miss reading The Dish so much.

  • ChadSF

    Oh so now you want to get on the party train with the rest of us, huh.. Um, no!!

  • David From Canada

    Andrew Sullivan is a gentleman of a more moderate nature. He talked about gay issues many times on his website and magazine articles and helped educate many people. He was someone that people could relate to. I really and truly believe that he helped, with many others, to pave the way for today’s American same-sex marriage victory.

  • Look, I know that there are lot of people who have issues with Andrew Sullivan. I understand that. He can be a pretentious ass at times, and he’s pissed me off on many an occasion, but he’s also written a lot of worthwhile stuff, and I think our community is richer WITH his voice than without it.

    Especially on THIS day, of ALL days, can we all have just a little more grace toward one another?

    • TrollopeReader

      Yes, but the bitches will be just that. Sad, and rather pitiful.

      • RobNYNY

        Thank you for your grace. I’d rather be a sad and rather pitiful bitch.

    • 2karmanot

      No

  • Gerry Fisher

    Yes, irrefutable arguments and a book and essays. Also blood and sweat and tears and raising money and hustle and creating brand new LGBT groups and pain and effort and organizing and strategizing and redoubling your efforts after a heart-breaking loss at the polls and lobbying and preparing court arguments…and even stupid things like standing in a Maryland farmer’s market collecting signatures of support on a June morning in 2012 while the underpants grow swampy, or going door-to-door to have conversation after conversation after conversation with not-always-friendly voters. Yay to the thinkers. Ten times that to the doers in the trenches.

    • Cuberly

      Perfect. Very well said Gerry.

  • We’ve had our disagreements, but on this day, I think we can all be happy.

  • TampaZeke

    I will grant him this one. He was fighting this fight before most of us, including gay rights orgs, knew that it was a fight worth fighting.

    But even a broken clock…

    • JoeyKY

      No he wasn’t! He didn’t do anything other than try to take credit for it!

    • TrollopeReader

      he’s more correct on many things, and admits when he’s not .

  • JoeyKY

    Nobody cares what you have to say, Felicia Sullivan. Go skeethe on straight guys and continue your self-loathing hatred somewhere else. UGH!

    • franklinb23

      How is he “self loathing”? He’s argued for gay marriage with some of the most rabid right wingers (like Doug Wilson).

  • Cuberly
    • LonelyLiberal

      In his case, “I’m ready for my bareback, Mr. DeMille.”

      • Cuberly

        Ha, um, yeah that’s his thing. I don’t really get into peoples individual predilections but when it comes to Sully. It’s got to be ABOUT SULLY.

  • I don’t always agree with Mr. Sullivan, but credit should be given where it’s due: he successfully argued for marriage equality in terms conservatives (and the rest of us) could understand. He argued that marriage equality and full access to military service were the two things we should focus on, because they are the places where the government discriminates. The fight for employment and housing nondiscrimination should be a little easier now that the government can’t discriminate against us in marriage and in military service. So thank you, Andrew Sullivan.

  • Turi

    #ByeRachel
    this is the enhanced version of #ByeFelicia btw

  • Rob NYNY

    No wonder he never foresaw such a thing. Among his earliest essays at The New Republic was “Flogging Underwear,” the stinking work of a homophobic closet case. My letter to the editor calling him on it was in the next issue.

  • e jerry powell

    Sullivan, happy to be wrong?

    Imagine what the world would be if Ann Coulter were the same way?

  • Jean-Marc in Canada

    That’s right Sully, you were at the forefront, you and you alone stood against the conservatives while they scapegoated us and tried to grind us under their boots, yes, you were…………oh fuck, I can’t continue with this sarcastic screed. Sully, you’re a pompous ass who did far less than you think and more damage than you will ever admit. Twat!

  • Refugay

    “I my I my I my I my I my I me.” Andrew Sullivan

  • DumbHairyApe

    Sounds like he’s at the heart of this. I had no idea the decision was all about him.

    • hdtex

      It’s ALL always about him.

  • Queequeg

    Is he actually trying to grab some credit for today’s victory? Everyone should celebrate, but the credit belongs to the plaintiffs and the attorneys who saw this through from beginning to end.

    • TrollopeReader

      and where did they get the idea? Out of thin air? No, a lot of work from the mid-80’s to the initial win in the Massachusetts Supreme Judicial Court.

      It took a lot of groundwork for that to happen, and like it or not Sullivan’s writings (derided by pretty much everyone) helped get the ball rolling.

      • Queequeg

        OK. I admit to not having read many of his writings, so you may be correct in that. We do, of course bhave to acknowledge all the contributions of those who have gone before, well into previous centuries. In my home town of Chicago, Mr. Gerber formed a gay tights organization in the 1920’s and there were others before him. We must remember past contributions, even before Stonewall. If Sullivan contributed, I’m sorry for being unaware.

  • TrollopeReader

    Thank you for being the voice in the darkness, Sully.

    You’ll have a lot of nasty comments against you, but those are the bitchy queens who partied and thought it odd a conservative would make the argument for same-sex marriage. You and Evan Wolfson with his law school paper in 1983. Back when the Left derided you, and him, and the whole concept.

    Savor the win that has spread across the nation from Massachusetts ( a great rally in Ptown this afternoon) and across much of the civilized world.

    Sad to say that the Joe.My.God crowd, on probably the most important ruling next to Windsor and Goodridge treats you as the enemy; and it’s too bad that Joe posted your final paragraph, leaving out the rest of the post where you share the beginnings, and the pain, and the hard work of lots and lots.

    I’ve enjoyed JMG, but on momentous occasions the inner person comes out —- and I’m not proud today at all of what I’ve read in these comments. Not proud at all.

  • ian

    Sully deserves credit where credit is due. He did write about Marriage Equality 25 yrs ago or more and made a cogent case for it in conservative terms. I learned from him that Right-Wing extremism as promulgated by Fox news and the GOP propaganda bubble is not conservatism. There is tremendous overlap between liberal and conservative thought, it’s just that much small “c” conservatism has been demonized as “librul” by the far right. He’s alway been a supporter, even if one might disagree with him on other issues. His former blog was a good source of news and information about the marriage Equality struggle especially for his straight readers. I see a lot of division here about his seeming credit taking, but if you read his entire post he lays out a lot of history that many may have forgotten or were unaware of, and in the end, all politics is personal. There is nothing wrong with relating todays ruling to ones life.

  • no, honey. helping would’ve been restarting your blog before you were aware that it was time for a rainbow celebration. this is just you, taking credit for something in which you had a minor part, now that it’s fashionable. i bet you’re hoping some of Brian Brown’s conservative grifter money will come your way soon.

  • shawnthesheep

    So in other words, he’s taking credit for something that never would have happened if the party he supports was in power.

  • Gary Arbach

    And now they all come crawling out of the woodwork to take credit…

  • leastyebejudged
  • JCF

    “I thought the book, at least, would be something I would have to leave behind me – secure in the knowledge that its arguments were, in fact, logically irrefutable, and would endure past my own death”

    “…but hey, it’s not about me.” said Andrew Sullivan, never. Good God man! I’m trying to think only Kum-Ba-Yah thoughts today, but could you please GTF over yourself? This is EVERYONE’S victory!

  • Robert

    Here’s a link to Andrew Sullivan’s article from 1989 advocating for same sex marriage way way way before most of the rest of the community. Hate him if you want, but his contributions to the movement are a matter of history:

    http://www.newrepublic.com/article/79054/here-comes-the-groom

  • pigboye

    completely douchey, as always. I thought he was post-gay, anyway…

  • Sullivan wisely argued that we should be fighting against government discrimination (marriage and military service) when the conventional wisdom was that we should fight discrimination in the private sector (employment and housing). He pointed out that it makes no sense to ask the government to enforce anti-discrimination laws when the government itself was discriminating. He’s not right about everything, and he can come across as a jerk, but I have no doubt that he is due some of the credit for where we are today.